Does 2020 Ram 1500 still has AC not cool enough problem?

[Paultg]

The Truck Fast Lane (TFL) video compared a 2019 F-150 to a 2019 Ram 1500 for AC performance (https://www.tfltruck.com/2019/06/do...han-the-ram-1500-real-answers-s-1-ep-2-video/). In the video the measurement indicated a 9.8 F difference in vent outlet temperature, and a 1.7 F difference in internal cabin temperature, both to the advantage of the F-150.

Thanks, that was pretty interesting video to watch. Especially seeing the delta in cabin temps vs. vent temps during the video; sort of supports the idea that the Ram is moving alot more air than the Ford, to somewhat match BTUH output at such a higher vent air temp.
Especially since the inside cabin temps when they started were almost identical; that the cabin temps dropped in a similar rate; so the cooling load & output from each AC system is very similar, even with the difference in AC air temperature.

I wonder what the pressure drop is across the cabin filter and if removing it would allow the fan to move enough additional air to make any improvement. Doing the clamp on the heater hose and dropping the air temp is a much bigger boost in cooling capacity though.

Paul G.

 

[2019_Ram]

The Truck Fast Lane (TFL) video compared a 2019 F-150 to a 2019 Ram 1500 for AC performance (https://www.tfltruck.com/2019/06/do...han-the-ram-1500-real-answers-s-1-ep-2-video/). In the video the measurement indicated a 9.8 F difference in vent outlet temperature, and a 1.7 F difference in internal cabin temperature, both to the advantage of the F-150.

My observations are in the previous message, but I should add one more: I watched the video three times and nowhere was the ambient (outdoor) temperature stated. It sure would've been nice information to have in order to determine if the Ram was meeting it's own factory specification.

Your comment about airflow was timely. Reduce the outlet airflow and the vent temperature will drop, which means it is an important aspect in doing any comparison. In researching this subject it appears that in the Chevy truck and F-150 sites the techs. are stating outlet temps between 40 and 47 F for "proper operation." Ram lists one specific outlet temp to meet for ambient. I can't determine if the "other trucks" have a range specification for outlet or not since I do not currently have recent service documentation for GM or Ford. Some older GM manuals list a temp range spec.

Best regards,
Dusty
2019 Ram 1500 Billet Silver Laramie Quad Cab 2WD, 5.7 Hemi, 8HP75, 3.21 axle, 33 gallon fuel tank, factory dual exhaust, 18” wheels. Build date: 17 July 2018. Now at: 035449 miles.

Actually, if you look at minute mark 5:20 in the video, you can see in the screen of the RAM says the outside temp is 68* and at 6:10 the Ford's screen shows the outside temp as 66*.

Based on this information, I would say if Dusty's specs are accurate, the RAM does not meet it's A/C performance requirement...

 

[SpeedyV]

I haven't seen any vent temp pictures from those saying their AC is fine. I've seen lots of vent temp pics from those saying their AC is not fine. It would help if the former would post pics.

You’ll want to check out some of the older A/C threads, then. I remember recording my temps something like a year ago.

I live in Texas, keep the house between 65-72 (depending on time of year), and tend to “run hot”.

My 2019 Ram has a panoramic sunroof (I do keep the shade closed in the summertime), and I’ve measured “average” vent temps (low 50s, IIRC) on a summer day. Here’s the thing...I’m very comfortable. My wife (seriously) needs to put on a jacket when riding with me at times. I only run the vented seat on low.

So...something is working, despite my truck’s “average” A/C performance. Maybe there really is something to the “air volume” design that FCA touted.

 

[Grape_Ape]

I haven't seen any vent temp pictures from those saying their AC is fine. I've seen lots of vent temp pics from those saying their AC is not fine. It would help if the former would post pics.

Yep, as mentioned above check some of the other threads. I've also posted pictures. Just by feel mine was fine but I used a Thermopop meat probe. I forget who it was but someone said at 70* it should be like 49* at the vent? Mine was 51*. That's close enough for me with a thermometer that's not meant to read ambient air temperature to be satisfied.

We also have a similar experience as above. My wife frequently needs a blanket or jacket in the truck. I keep it on 70* Auto pretty much all the time.

 

[ColoradoCub]

Ever since the inadequate AC performance came up on this forum guys have tried to over analyze everything from panoramic sun roofs, ceramic tint, Uber big cabs, vented seats, air flow dynamics, etc. The bottom line is the blend doors aren’t closing all the way on the heater core side of the box and we are getting warm air blending even though by selecting the coldest setting you have told the system you do not want ANY hot air introduced. You should not be able to produce 7-10 deg colder vent temps by clamping the heater core coolant line when you are in the coldest setting or max AC. I have experimented with my AC and even when the ambient temperature outside is below 40 degrees my AC will blow low 50’s on the coldest setting with fresh air being introduced. I have also tried opening the coolant valve on the hack a little bit to allow a little flow and I lose the lower vent temps immediately. It’s a blend door problem .......period! And while it’s great that people are content with sub standard vent temps because their wives are cold , it still doesn’t take away from the design being flawed. Thankfully on days like today when its 97 deg outside the hack makes the AC seem like a non issue. Thanks KcRay

 

[SpeedyV]

Ever since the inadequate AC performance came up on this forum guys have tried to over analyze everything from panoramic sun roofs, ceramic tint, Uber big cabs, vented seats, air flow dynamics, etc. The bottom line is the blend doors aren’t closing all the way on the heater core side of the box and we are getting warm air blending even though by selecting the coldest setting you have told the system you do not want ANY hot air introduced. You should not be able to produce 7-10 deg colder vent temps by clamping the heater core coolant line when you are in the coldest setting or max AC. I have experimented with my AC and even when the ambient temperature outside is below 40 degrees my AC will blow low 50’s on the coldest setting with fresh air being introduced. I have also tried opening the coolant valve on the hack a little bit to allow a little flow and I lose the lower vent temps immediately. It’s a blend door problem .......period! And while it’s great that people are content with sub standard vent temps because their wives are cold , it still doesn’t take away from the design being flawed. Thankfully on days like today when its 97 deg outside the hack makes the AC seem like a non issue. Thanks KcRay

And quite obviously, the issue is inconsistent.

 

[ColoradoCub]

And quite obviously, the issue is inconsistent.

I disagree, the issue is pretty damn consistent, there’s only been a handful of owners that posted mid 40’s or colder AC vents where as the majority of owners here report low 50’s as the coldest temps possible. We also have a bunch of owners that state it works good enough even though it could be colder but don’t report their temps. I’ve owned two of these 5th gens and my buddy has owned two 5th gens, I’ve put a thermometer in the vents of all 4 trucks and they all performed the same.

 

[SpeedyV]

I disagree, the issue is pretty damn consistent, there’s only been a handful of owners that posted mid 40’s or colder AC vents where as the majority of owners here report low 50’s as the coldest temps possible. We also have a bunch of owners that state it works good enough even though it could be colder but don’t report their temps. I’ve owned two of these 5th gens and my buddy has owned two 5th gens, I’ve put a thermometer in the vents of all 4 trucks and they all performed the same.

As stated above, I reported my temps. The temps aren’t good enough, per your assessment. The system does the job here in Texas, per empirical evidence (i.e. we’re very comfortable). Hence the inconsistency. Has anyone actually bothered to measure flow volume, air exchanges, etc?

 

[PostPremium]

As stated above, I reported my temps. The temps aren’t good enough, per your assessment. The system does the job here in Texas, per empirical evidence (i.e. we’re very comfortable). Hence the inconsistency. Has anyone actually bothered to measure flow volume, air exchanges, etc?

Respectfully, the vent temps you posted were low 50s. That's about ten degrees higher than most other vehicles on the road. Higher than usual vent temps are adequate for you but not for me.

I've yet to see someone post their "adequate" non-hacked vent temp in the low 40s when it's approaching triple digits outside. All my other current vehicles can do it. Ram can't.

 

[ldoh]

Ever since the inadequate AC performance came up on this forum guys have tried to over analyze everything from panoramic sun roofs, ceramic tint, Uber big cabs, vented seats, air flow dynamics, etc. The bottom line is the blend doors aren’t closing all the way on the heater core side of the box and we are getting warm air blending even though by selecting the coldest setting you have told the system you do not want ANY hot air introduced. You should not be able to produce 7-10 deg colder vent temps by clamping the heater core coolant line when you are in the coldest setting or max AC. I have experimented with my AC and even when the ambient temperature outside is below 40 degrees my AC will blow low 50’s on the coldest setting with fresh air being introduced. I have also tried opening the coolant valve on the hack a little bit to allow a little flow and I lose the lower vent temps immediately. It’s a blend door problem .......period! And while it’s great that people are content with sub standard vent temps because their wives are cold , it still doesn’t take away from the design being flawed. Thankfully on days like today when its 97 deg outside the hack makes the AC seem like a non issue. Thanks KcRay

Do you know anyone who tore apart a few gen 5 a/c systems and demonstrated failed blend door mechanism/design? If so, I'd be with you. Otherwise it's a far cry from sticking a thermometer in 4 air vents and claiming you've solved the problem.

There's too many variables for a thoughtful person to draw a bottom line conclusion.

 

[ldoh]

Hence the inconsistency. Has anyone actually bothered to measure flow volume, air exchanges, etc?

Yep. The only way to know is to peel the onion. Until then it's all puffy chest banter.

 

[ColoradoCub]

Do you know anyone who tore apart a few gen 5 a/c systems and demonstrated failed blend door mechanism/design?

I do not and It scares me to death what would happen with the quality of technicians at most Ram dealerships if they started doing so. I do however understand how the HVAC box and blend doors should function. I worked in dealer service when I was younger and I honestly could say that with 15 techs in a dealership, maybe 1 on a really good day could remove the dash on a basically new vehicle, replace the heater box and reinstall the dash without breaking several things and having the final product look factory perfect. It would be disastrous for FCA on the warranty side of things if they opened this can of worms and is probably why nothing has been done.

 

[ColoradoCub]

If so, I'd be with you. Otherwise it's a far cry from sticking a thermometer in 4 air vents and claiming you've solved the problem.

There's too many variables for a thoughtful person to draw a bottom line conclusion.

If you own another vehicle set the AC to max AC check the temperature of your vents, then clamp the heater core coolant line and you will see that your AC will not blow 7-10 deg colder. This isn’t rocket science.

 

[SpeedyV]

It would be disastrous for FCA on the warranty side of things if they opened this can of worms and is probably why nothing has been done.

That much we agree on, especially if they've investigated and determined it's an "involved" fix.

 

[dmodem]

Apparently, there are issues with consistent build quality. My '19's A/C was blowing between 64-68 degrees on the lowest setting during 90+ degree days last summer and both Ram and the dealer verified there was a problem. The compressor, temperature sensor, and refrigerant were all changed, and although it does seem to be cooler this summer, it's still not anywhere near as cold as any of the other vehicles I've ever owned (including previous generation Rams).

 

[Dusty1948]

Apparently, there are issues with consistent build quality. My '19's A/C was blowing between 64-68 degrees on the lowest setting during 90+ degree days last summer and both Ram and the dealer verified there was a problem. The compressor, temperature sensor, and refrigerant were all changed, and although it does seem to be cooler this summer, it's still not anywhere near as cold as any of the other vehicles I've ever owned (including previous generation Rams).

From the table in the Ram (DT) service manual (see previous message) the outlet temperature should be 55F when outside temp between 90 and 100F. Yours was out of specification.

Best regards,
2019 Ram 1500 Billet Silver Laramie Quad Cab 2WD, 5.7 Hemi, 8HP75, 3.21 axle, 33 gallon fuel tank, factory dual exhaust, 18” wheels. Build date: 17 July 2018. Now at: 035509 miles.

 

[Dusty1948]

Here are some photos I took today using a auto parts store auto air conditioner thermometer. Unfortunately, both digital thermometers that I would've preferred to use won't be available to me for another week or so. I also had trouble taking the shot with my Coolpix digital camera, both with light reflections on the little bitty distorted glass of the thermometer, and trying to get the dial itself in focus. Please excuse the poor photography, but if you enlarge the picture you can pretty much see it was reading 48 degrees (each division is 4 degrees), which beats the Ram spec. for a day that's 90F (spec is 55F at vent for 90F outside temp).

Regards,
Dusty
2019 Ram 1500 Billet Silver Laramie Quad Cab 2WD, 5.7 Hemi, 8HP75, 3.21 axle, 33 gallon fuel tank, factory dual exhaust, 18” wheels. Build date: 17 July 2018. Now at: 035551 miles.

 

[PostPremium]

Here are some photos I took today using a auto parts store auto air conditioner thermometer. Unfortunately, both digital thermometers that I would've preferred to use won't be available to me for another week or so. I also had trouble taking the shot with my Coolpix digital camera, both with light reflections on the little bitty distorted glass of the thermometer, and trying to get the dial itself in focus. Please excuse the poor photography, but if you enlarge the picture you can pretty much see it was reading 48 degrees (each division is 4 degrees), which beats the Ram spec. for a day that's 90F (spec is 55F at vent for 90F outside temp).

Regards,
Dusty
2019 Ram 1500 Billet Silver Laramie Quad Cab 2WD, 5.7 Hemi, 8HP75, 3.21 axle, 33 gallon fuel tank, factory dual exhaust, 18” wheels. Build date: 17 July 2018. Now at: 035551 miles.

Almost within the green targeted range of the thermometer. Almost. Is your truck's AC hacked or stock?

 

[Dusty1948]

Almost within the green targeted range of the thermometer. Almost. Is your truck's AC hacked or stock?

It is completely stock. No hack.

One thing to possibly consider. I have an early build and have only had one computer flash for the V61 recall in August of 2019. It's possible the factory updated software that affected AC performance in later builds.

As an aside, someone mentioned that they had read that the new R1234yf refrigerant is less effective than R132. I looked at the pressure curves of both gases and they are almost identical, with a slight falloff for R1234yf at temps approaching 150F which is out of the auto AC range. R1234yf should actually be a viable, direct substitute for R134. The real differences are systems with R1234yf use an internal heat exchanger and modified evaporators and condensers. What that effect is I do not know. With R1234yf being around $5.60 an ounce compared to R134 at <> $0.75 an ounce, I suspect manufacturers have reduced the amount of charge in their systems..

Best regards,
Dusty
2019 Ram 1500 Billet Silver Laramie Quad Cab 2WD, 5.7 Hemi, 8HP75, 3.21 axle, 33 gallon fuel tank, factory dual exhaust, 18” wheels. Build date: 17 July 2018. Now at: 035551 miles.

 

[clotagames]

My 2020mon ride home today with outside temp at 91 and feels like 100, temp set to 73 and on auto-vent air temp 49 degrees.