Upgrade 2019 RAM 1500 Infotainment to Uconnect 5

[Imadjiddawi]

Since i’ts been confirmed that 2022 Ram 1500 will support Uconnect 5, do you think that 2019 Ram 1500 owners will be able to update their system to Uconnect 5. If not, do you think we will be able to replace our current infotainment aiment system with the new Uconnect 5 version?

Info: I currently own a 2019 Ram 1500 Limited.

 

[Mister 4x4]

I say it's a Hard No. Ram's business model won't make it feasible to be backward compatible with older vehicles because that would hurt sales of new vehicles, so they'll just make it work with new vehicles exclusively by making even just simple redesigns and reconfigurations so the components that work with the UConnect 5 are just THAT MUCH DIFFERENT enough to be incompatible with older vehicles (even switching the locations of wires within the plugs could cause things to not function and possibly even short out, damaging both older components as well as the new UConnect 5 stereo/command centers).

 

[Jimmy07]

I say it's a Hard No. Ram's business model won't make it feasible to be backward compatible with older vehicles because that would hurt sales of new vehicles, so they'll just make it work with new vehicles exclusively by making even just simple redesigns and reconfigurations so the components that work with the UConnect 5 are just THAT MUCH DIFFERENT enough to be incompatible with older vehicles (even switching the locations of wires within the plugs could cause things to not function and possibly even short out, damaging both older components as well as the new UConnect 5 stereo/command centers).

If you’re going to say stuff like that, at least preface your reply by saying that you have no clue how the electrical systems work on these trucks.

 

[vincentw56]

If you’re going to say stuff like that, at least preface your reply by saying that you have no clue how the electrical systems work on these trucks.

I was thinking the same thing.

 

[MannymanX]

I say it's a Hard No. Ram's business model won't make it feasible to be backward compatible with older vehicles because that would hurt sales of new vehicles, so they'll just make it work with new vehicles exclusively by making even just simple redesigns and reconfigurations so the components that work with the UConnect 5 are just THAT MUCH DIFFERENT enough to be incompatible with older vehicles (even switching the locations of wires within the plugs could cause things to not function and possibly even short out, damaging both older components as well as the new UConnect 5 stereo/command centers).

 

[Mister 4x4]

If you’re going to say stuff like that, at least preface your reply by saying that you have no clue how the electrical systems work on these trucks.

I'm sorry. I was completely overcome by your obvious vast expertise in this topic when you said things like 'it SHOULD work.'

I know enough about automotive electronics to have upgraded countless stereos since my first car in the mid-'80s, rebuilt and rewired my two favorite toys sitting in the garage and driveway (respectively), and integrated many modern electronic amenities and conveniences into older as well as newer vehicles (complete factory stereo replacement to an aftermarket touchscreen system with BT & USB with the addition of GPS and back-up camera was my latest success). I'm also willing to admit I've smoked my share of components over time - most often because the parts guy gave me wrongly boxed components (for example: a '96 Honda FI relay in a '95 box - which was a model year design change while retaining the same harness connector... which fried something on the ECU warranting a replacement).

My point is that the original poster asked with his single post on the site if the new UConnect device could be swapped in to replace the older UConnect device in his 2019. My OPINION is that Ram won't simply make a plug-n-play, backward-compatible swap possible. Granted, someone will most likely be able to retrofit a newer system into an older vehicle with trial and error and lots of electronic gymnastics that most people can't get their heads around. Maybe that guy is you... who knows.

Good luck with your experiment, just the same.

 

[TravisH]

I'm sorry. I was completely overcome by your obvious vast expertise in this topic when you said things like 'it SHOULD work.'

I know enough about automotive electronics to have upgraded countless stereos since my first car in the mid-'80s, rebuilt and rewired my two favorite toys sitting in the garage and driveway (respectively), and integrated many modern electronic amenities and conveniences into older as well as newer vehicles (complete factory stereo replacement to an aftermarket touchscreen system with BT & USB with the addition of GPS and back-up camera was my latest success). I'm also willing to admit I've smoked my share of components over time - most often because the parts guy gave me wrongly boxed components (for example: a '96 Honda FI relay in a '95 box - which was a model year design change while retaining the same harness connector... which fried something on the ECU warranting a replacement).

My point is that the original poster asked with his single post on the site if the new UConnect device could be swapped in to replace the older UConnect device in his 2019. My OPINION is that Ram won't simply make a plug-n-play, backward-compatible swap possible. Granted, someone will most likely be able to retrofit a newer system into an older vehicle with trial and error and lots of electronic gymnastics that most people can't get their heads around. Maybe that guy is you... who knows.

Good luck with your experiment, just the same.

Swapping out a factory radio to aftermarket isn't difficult and doesn't make someone credit worthy to shed knowledge of modern oem electrical systems. I worked in the aftermarket automotive electronics industry for over 12 years and I was a rep for Alpine. Installing aftermarket head units is the one the most basic things we did.

With that being said, I think your mistake was saying that it's their "business model" to make changes so customers can't swap oem parts and have to buy a new vehicle. I bet over 95% of people never change anything on their vehicle and just drive it the way it is. If something breaks, it gets replaced with the same part. I highly doubt RAM has a checklist when making components for new vehicles and there's a checkbox that says, Make sure it doesn't work with older models. If anything, it's costing them more money for R&D, tooling, assembly line change, etc.

 

[Mister 4x4]

Swapping out a factory radio to aftermarket isn't difficult and doesn't make someone credit worthy to shed knowledge of modern oem electrical systems. I worked in the aftermarket automotive electronics industry for over 12 years and I was a rep for Alpine. Installing aftermarket head units is the one the most basic things we did.

With that being said, I think your mistake was saying that it's their "business model" to make changes so customers can't swap oem parts and have to buy a new vehicle. I bet over 95% of people never change anything on their vehicle and just drive it the way it is. If something breaks, it gets replaced with the same part. I highly doubt RAM has a checklist when making components for new vehicles and there's a checkbox that says, Make sure it doesn't work with older models. If anything, it's costing them more money for R&D, tooling, assembly line change, etc.

A fair point, and I'm not trying to establish myself as any kind of an expert on automotive electronics (unlike some others, possibly).

Replacement parts for specific model runs vs. new component compatibility with older vehicles is not a very good argument. Remember when they made a subtle facelift change to the Rams in 2013? The front bumpers, grilles, and some bracketry from the 2013-2018s don't fit the 2009-2012s, after all. This UConnect upgrade sounds like a subtle change as well, but with Ram saying the UConnect 5 software won't be compatible with earlier vehicles, who honestly thinks it stops at just the software package?

The point of the term business model is valid, albeit not as a major factor... as you pointed out... but it's all about money at the end of the day. Ram would lose a number of new vehicle sales if they offered new features to be backward compatible to older vehicles - why buy a new truck with UConnect 5 if you can simply get a new stereo and swap it out? Along those same lines, there are lots of vehicles sold simply because buyers want new features. With word of a major redesign coming, it's fair to say they'd rather people buy a whole new truck than be able to swap out new components for old. Most people aren't skilled enough to replace such things, and making them as complicated as possible to do so (hint: "proprietary") is in their best interest... and they've done it before: anybody remember the Infinity systems in the '90s/'2000s, with their embedded amplifiers and 2ohm impedance? Pretty much had to replace the entire audio system to get better sound with aftermarket components... all the way through to the wires and speakers (been there, done that). Then the lowest bidder comes along for the next model design and suddenly you're dealing with Alpine or Harmon Kardon (for instance) - those are definitely financially motivated decisions.

Anybody heard any news about FCA opening a new backward compatible audio division? Me neither.

 

[Jimmy07]

A fair point, and I'm not trying to establish myself as any kind of an expert on automotive electronics (unlike some others, possibly).

Replacement parts for specific model runs vs. new component compatibility with older vehicles is not a very good argument. Remember when they made a subtle facelift change to the Rams in 2013? The front bumpers, grilles, and some bracketry from the 2013-2018s don't fit the 2009-2012s, after all. This UConnect upgrade sounds like a subtle change as well, but with Ram saying the UConnect 5 software won't be compatible with earlier vehicles, who honestly thinks it stops at just the software package?

The point of the term business model is valid, albeit not as a major factor... as you pointed out... but it's all about money at the end of the day. Ram would lose a number of new vehicle sales if they offered new features to be backward compatible to older vehicles - why buy a new truck with UConnect 5 if you can simply get a new stereo and swap it out? Along those same lines, there are lots of vehicles sold simply because buyers want new features. With word of a major redesign coming, it's fair to say they'd rather people buy a whole new truck than be able to swap out new components for old. Most people aren't skilled enough to replace such things, and making them as complicated as possible to do so (hint: "proprietary") is in their best interest... and they've done it before: anybody remember the Infinity systems in the '90s/'2000s, with their embedded amplifiers and 2ohm impedance? Pretty much had to replace the entire audio system to get better sound with aftermarket components... all the way through to the wires and speakers (been there, done that). Then the lowest bidder comes along for the next model design and suddenly you're dealing with Alpine or Harmon Kardon (for instance) - those are definitely financially motivated decisions.

Anybody heard any news about FCA opening a new backward compatible audio division? Me neither.

Your business model argument doesn’t hold water. Otherwise, you could apply that same logic to any other factory upgrade that they would claim can’t be done after the fact, like adding adaptive cruise, blind spot monitoring, passive entry, etc, which has all been done. Why would that be possible if, as you say, they would lose money on people buying lower trim models and adding all the upgrade features themselves. If you ask a Ram engineer, they’ll tell you that nothing can be added after the fact, unless it’s a mopar kit they offer, like remote start, bed lights, or power steps. But pretty much every feature on every FCA vehicle has been figured out how to add after the fact.
Speaking of backwards compatibility, would you think it’s possible to get blind spot monitoring, 12” radio, and surround view system working 100% like factory on a 2017 4th gen, features that didn’t even exist for Rams until the 5th gens? As far as this radio swap, the radio doesn’t control “as much of the truck” as most people would think. I won’t go into detail on why I believe it’s going to work, but let’s just say I’ve had this planned and figured months before ram announced they were going UC5. Other than that- about 2 months out on the radio module I ordered, and we shall see.

 

[ekaz]

The UC5 has a new radio module and a new screen module. They aren't going to make major changes to the electrical bus or interior trim when a refresh is a yearnorn2 away. Plugs are different but the wires are still there. I was comparing the UC4 wires with the UC5 wires.

 

[Mister 4x4]

I totally understand that there's most likely a way to ADAPT the UC5 components to work in an older vehicle, as I'm sure you guys are going to find ways to make it work. But you can't deny that a management decision was made to not go with a plug'n'play solution. Otherwise, you guys wouldn't need to spend time comparing pin-outs and coming up with ways to rewire everything to make it all work. Did the adaptive cruise control work for an older cruise-control enabled vehicle with a software update, or did you have to replace components and/or rewire? (it goes without saying about adding components if they're not already there). The fact that modern wiring harnesses are typically loaded up with connectors for all of the possible components offered is a management decision as well: it's a LOT easier and more cost-effective to make a one-size-fits-all harness and slip into place during assembly, then simply add the components listed on the build sheet [and omit the ones not spec'd]. I admit that maybe the term 'business model' might not have been the right one to use, because even though they're core components of business models, things to be considered like 'cost,' 'efficiency,' 'profit margins,' and 'management decisions' as motivators of the things done by the Ram Truck Division seem to be getting lost in the translation here.

The things you mentioned that they DO allow to be added-on or backward compatible, do they advertise their availability, proprietary instructions, and parts lists? Has anybody seen a Veteran's Day Special to bring in your old truck to add adaptive cruise control for a blow-out price of just $299? No - because offering a program like that costs money, and they wouldn't make enough back to be profitable.

That mind set is also why it's more expensive to order a vehicle with only a handful of options, rather than a trim package with some options you might not want or care for. For instance, I wanted a brand-new '89 Mustang LX 5.0 'vert I could turn into a Saleen clone for cheap, but all I wanted was cruise and A/C (no power windows, no power locks, no 'premium' stereo I was going to replace anyway, etc.), and it wound up being almost $1000 more expensive than a loaded GT - because I wanted specific things and it would've taken more time to put together a custom package than a car that they'd already made 100 of that day.

Everything is deliberate. Fact: Ram is releasing the UC5 mid-model run, but it will not be backward compatible with vehicles already wired and loaded with the components it manages. The Ram engineers didn't just start tweaking a 12.1 software package, hit a speed bump and say 'Well, Bummer - it won't be backward compatible with the 2019-2021s. Let the Bosses and Advertising know." There were reasons for that... why do you think that is? I'm not saying I have all the answers... not in the least because I'm still new to 5th Gens myself (trading up from 3rd & 4th Gens)... but I'd wager it's still a factor. The Ram Truck Division is not there to be our friends, take care of us, and make sure we're happy - they're there to make money... and talking someone into buying a new truck is a helluva lot more profit margin than selling a UC5 system in the part dept.

You can disagree with my opinion all you like and it doesn't bother me in the least. I just find it disappointing that it's not as reciprocal, as with most other social media outlets these days.

Seriously: good luck with your project. If they wind up offering something better than a 3-band EQ for the stereo, I might just have to bug you for some help to upgrade mine.

 

[CanRebel]

Software wise, I don't see any reason for it not be compatible. The OS is android and so is the application.

@Mister 4x4 I did read some of what you wrote, but most of it gave me a headache.
Not really sure what your crying about.

As what I read, newer trucks with UC5 is more than just software.
1. faster processor
2. better resolution
some other things.
Some of that is hardware, some is software.
Are you expecting to Ram to replace hardware in every truck every time they improve it??

 

[Mister 4x4]

I'm not cryin' about anything. If you'd read it, you'd see that the original poster asked if UC5 would be compatible with his older truck. I said 'No,' offered my opinion as to why, and got dogpiled as a result. The rest is me foolishly thinking I needed to explain myself.

 

[CanRebel]

@Mister 4x4
/quote
I say it's a Hard No. Ram's business model won't make it feasible to be backward compatible with older vehicles because that would hurt sales of new vehicles, so they'll just make it work with new vehicles exclusively by making even just simple redesigns and reconfigurations so the components that work with the UConnect 5 are just THAT MUCH DIFFERENT enough to be incompatible with older vehicles (even switching the locations of wires within the plugs could cause things to not function and possibly even short out, damaging both older components as well as the new UConnect 5 stereo/command centers).
/quote

I guess I need google to translate Texan to English. UC5 is new hardware/software. What does that have to do with business model?
Based on your 'opinion' they should never change hardware or try to improve anything.

 

[vincentw56]

I'm not cryin' about anything. If you'd read it, you'd see that the original poster asked if UC5 would be compatible with his older truck. I said 'No,' offered my opinion as to why, and got dogpiled as a result. The rest is me foolishly thinking I needed to explain myself.

No one dog piled on you. They corrected your inaccurate posts. As shown above, you stated it was a hard no. And that even trying to upgrade to it would fry your truck. You were proven wrong by more knowledgeable people.

The OP asked if he would be able to upgrade his current system OR replace it with this.

 

[Brutal_HO]

I'm not cryin' about anything. If you'd read it, you'd see that the original poster asked if UC5 would be compatible with his older truck. I said 'No,' offered my opinion as to why, and got dogpiled as a result. The rest is me foolishly thinking I needed to explain myself.

Perhaps you didn't read all the previous replies before showing your lack of understanding of the merits of doing the retrofit and "the rest" is you foolishly thinking how you can spin and backpeddle for making ridiculous statements. Just my opinion.

 

[EMS_Pilot_66]

I totally understand that there's most likely a way to ADAPT the UC5 components to work in an older vehicle, as I'm sure you guys are going to find ways to make it work. But you can't deny that a management decision was made to not go with a plug'n'play solution. Otherwise, you guys wouldn't need to spend time comparing pin-outs and coming up with ways to rewire everything to make it all work. Did the adaptive cruise control work for an older cruise-control enabled vehicle with a software update, or did you have to replace components and/or rewire? (it goes without saying about adding components if they're not already there). The fact that modern wiring harnesses are typically loaded up with connectors for all of the possible components offered is a management decision as well: it's a LOT easier and more cost-effective to make a one-size-fits-all harness and slip into place during assembly, then simply add the components listed on the build sheet [and omit the ones not spec'd]. I admit that maybe the term 'business model' might not have been the right one to use, because even though they're core components of business models, things to be considered like 'cost,' 'efficiency,' 'profit margins,' and 'management decisions' as motivators of the things done by the Ram Truck Division seem to be getting lost in the translation here.

The things you mentioned that they DO allow to be added-on or backward compatible, do they advertise their availability, proprietary instructions, and parts lists? Has anybody seen a Veteran's Day Special to bring in your old truck to add adaptive cruise control for a blow-out price of just $299? No - because offering a program like that costs money, and they wouldn't make enough back to be profitable.

That mind set is also why it's more expensive to order a vehicle with only a handful of options, rather than a trim package with some options you might not want or care for. For instance, I wanted a brand-new '89 Mustang LX 5.0 'vert I could turn into a Saleen clone for cheap, but all I wanted was cruise and A/C (no power windows, no power locks, no 'premium' stereo I was going to replace anyway, etc.), and it wound up being almost $1000 more expensive than a loaded GT - because I wanted specific things and it would've taken more time to put together a custom package than a car that they'd already made 100 of that day.

Everything is deliberate. Fact: Ram is releasing the UC5 mid-model run, but it will not be backward compatible with vehicles already wired and loaded with the components it manages. The Ram engineers didn't just start tweaking a 12.1 software package, hit a speed bump and say 'Well, Bummer - it won't be backward compatible with the 2019-2021s. Let the Bosses and Advertising know." There were reasons for that... why do you think that is? I'm not saying I have all the answers... not in the least because I'm still new to 5th Gens myself (trading up from 3rd & 4th Gens)... but I'd wager it's still a factor. The Ram Truck Division is not there to be our friends, take care of us, and make sure we're happy - they're there to make money... and talking someone into buying a new truck is a helluva lot more profit margin than selling a UC5 system in the part dept.

You can disagree with my opinion all you like and it doesn't bother me in the least. I just find it disappointing that it's not as reciprocal, as with most other social media outlets these days.

Seriously: good luck with your project. If they wind up offering something better than a 3-band EQ for the stereo, I might just have to bug you for some help to upgrade mine.

The OP asked if the 2019-21’s would be software upgradable or would a swap be required. The answer given and is known to the 1st ?? s a hard no. As for it being able to be hardware swapped is yes. Why would anyone think the old radio couldn’t be swapped out for the new UC5 radio? It’s just like putting in an aftermarket radio if you think about it.

Just like the aftermarket radios installed in any vehicle.
1. A wire harness of some sort will have to be used to adapt to the older trucks, and
2. Luckily we’ll only lose some features/capabilities unlike a true aftermarket radio where (I assume)we’d lose large amounts of features/settings. I don’t even know if you could install a true aftermarket radio in these trucks as a lot of settings for the truck are through the radio. I haven’t installed one in a couple decades now so don’t know how they interact with the vehicles settings.
If anything; to me the manufacturers are making it almost impossible for anyone to install aftermarket radios due to vehicle settings imbedded in the radios. Again I am probably wrong here but haven’t looked at true aftermarket radios in a couple decades.
Not dog piling on you just saying all that’s being done is an quasi aftermarket radio install if you think about it.

 

[Mister 4x4]

Obviously, my mistake is thinking in the 'cause & effect' and 'big picture' lanes when almost everybody is only concerned with 'can I make this work.' My apologies and gratitude to those who chose not to be an *** through all of this.

Let's try something new and think logically starting with a few facts:

I never said this swap would fry the vehicle... I said there's a possibility. Big difference, ASSumptions being what they are. I also never said Ram shouldn't ever make improvements, I simply said they're not going to make anything easy enough for the common consumer to just swap in the next cool thing - they'd rather sell you a new truck.

UConnect touches pretty much everything in the vehicle, whether there are software-driven controls or simply reporting status of the features - this is done through the Body Control Module, which also directly interfaces with the ECU. My [apparently] uneducated way of thinking has the possibility of bad things happening to the vehicle if this is not executed correctly (i.e., something wired incorrectly could indeed short something out and cause damage to the BCM & ECU)... and then how well does the truck work afterward? Who can name all of the things UConnect doesn't touch? That's what you're POTENTIALLY left with if things don't go well.

GM cars have this thing called 'Theftlock,' which causes their cars to quit functioning when stereos and other 'smart' components are swapped/replaced, most often requiring dealership technician intervention (or some kind of aftermarket 'cheat' device) to restore functionality. Does UConnect have something similar? I genuinely and obviously don't know, but something to consider if not already. What are the odds that swapping in a new UConnect system shuts down the vehicle because the BCM is expecting 'authentication' (for lack of better term) from the new unit?

I really am interested to see if this works, and hope it does. My OPINION is that it's not nearly as easy as simply matching up schematics and harness pin-outs, but that's just me. Good luck, just the same

To offer some relief, I'm throwing in the towel on this. We're obviously not communicating well, and I admit that's my fault. If you guys want to keep telling me how much of an idiot I am for not thinking along singular lines as seems to be the trend here, that's fine with me - have your fun. Something of note: just because one lives in Texas, doesn't make them a Texan, so no need for a Google translator... but I will take note to use less and smaller words in the future to alleviate the possibility of causing any more headaches.

 

[djevox]

 

[CanRebel]

@Mister 4x4
Sorry the Texan thing was just humour.

I actually do agree with somethings you mentioned or at least what I think you are trying to say.
While some members might be able to rig up new hardware. Most people not going be able too.
Ram doesn't make these parts, some one else does for them. Anyone with any computer, phone device experience
knows or should know things get outdated rather quickly. Sooner or later current screens and hardware for them
will not be produce anymore.
Example 2021 Rebel I just purchased new, if the screen and/or hardware module breaks in few years.
Ram 'may' not be able to get stock of any more. This controls AC, Heating, whatever else. If there isn't
direct replacement, I 'could' be screwed.
Car companies are adding so much into these devices, and in my view, with no knowledge of how world really works.
Old days, if something broke, it was rather easy fab something new. Try doing that with cpu, memory, and/or lcd
screens that no one makes anymore, or that size/resolution.

 

[EMS_Pilot_66]

Obviously, my mistake is thinking in the 'cause & effect' and 'big picture' lanes when almost everybody is only concerned with 'can I make this work.' My apologies and gratitude to those who chose not to be an *** through all of this.

Let's try something new and think logically starting with a few facts:

I never said this swap would fry the vehicle... I said there's a possibility. Big difference, ASSumptions being what they are. I also never said Ram shouldn't ever make improvements, I simply said they're not going to make anything easy enough for the common consumer to just swap in the next cool thing - they'd rather sell you a new truck.

UConnect touches pretty much everything in the vehicle, whether there are software-driven controls or simply reporting status of the features - this is done through the Body Control Module, which also directly interfaces with the ECU. My [apparently] uneducated way of thinking has the possibility of bad things happening to the vehicle if this is not executed correctly (i.e., something wired incorrectly could indeed short something out and cause damage to the BCM & ECU)... and then how well does the truck work afterward? Who can name all of the things UConnect doesn't touch? That's what you're POTENTIALLY left with if things don't go well.

GM cars have this thing called 'Theftlock,' which causes their cars to quit functioning when stereos and other 'smart' components are swapped/replaced, most often requiring dealership technician intervention (or some kind of aftermarket 'cheat' device) to restore functionality. Does UConnect have something similar? I genuinely and obviously don't know, but something to consider if not already. What are the odds that swapping in a new UConnect system shuts down the vehicle because the BCM is expecting 'authentication' (for lack of better term) from the new unit?

I really am interested to see if this works, and hope it does. My OPINION is that it's not nearly as easy as simply matching up schematics and harness pin-outs, but that's just me. Good luck, just the same

To offer some relief, I'm throwing in the towel on this. We're obviously not communicating well, and I admit that's my fault. If you guys want to keep telling me how much of an idiot I am for not thinking along singular lines as seems to be the trend here, that's fine with me - have your fun. Something of note: just because one lives in Texas, doesn't make them a Texan, so no need for a Google translator... but I will take note to use less and smaller words in the future to alleviate the possibility of causing any more headaches.

Just to add I believe @Jimmy07 said he has the Uconnect 12” installed in his 2017 Ram truck. Thinking if it can work in a truck that never had a 12” screen designed for it, the newer UC5 radios/modules can be installed in the 19-21s. Again it’s just an aftermarket install.