Conflicting Oil Standards in Owners Manual

[Aseras]

What failed?

 

[EugeneYYZ]

What failed?

lower end , crankshaft bearings

 

[KNGSNK11]

lower end , crankshaft bearings

If you used the correct oil, what was the cause of the bearing failures?

 

[EugeneYYZ]

If you used the correct oil, what was the cause of the bearing failures?

engeneering fail

 

[Aseras]

It's possible it was a fuel dilution issue. Or just bad part/luck. Crankshaft bearing in a diesel take a beating. I wouldn't expect one to fail unless it was run dry or something, and even then just be grumpy.

 

[Neurobit]

So the dealer contacted me today, said they heard from FCA and they’ll be swapping my oil out for the MOPAR MS-12991. I knew my dealer would make it right, I just wonder how many other Ecodiesels are out there with Rotella because neither the owner nor the dealer has a clue that the oil specs changed.

Wow. Glad to hear they got this corrected. Good dealer.

 

[Mchurch52]

Wow. Glad to hear they got this corrected. Good dealer.

Yes, they are! I took it in this morning and they drained the T6 and put in Pennzoil Platinum Euro. They said trying to get a straight answer from FCA on what oil to use was extremely painful and that they had to talk with multiple people. Not sure why FCA had such a hard time when it was right there in the newest version of the owner’s manual.

 

[Sascwatch]

Yes, they are! I took it in this morning and they drained the T6 and put in Pennzoil Platinum Euro. They said trying to get a straight answer from FCA on what oil to use was extremely painful and that they had to talk with multiple people. Not sure why FCA had such a hard time when it was right there in the newest version of the owner’s manual.

When I first contacted FCA about this issue the agent knew nothing about oil except what was in the owners manual. Its not their fault, not everybody is a car guy or mechanic. But after hours of phone conversations and many emails with multiple reps at FCA Canada the engineering department finally gave them a solid answer and got the issue resolved, I just hope no engines or turbos were harmed in the process.

It was and still is upsetting that the dealers have yet to be notified about which oil is correct for these new motors. The head mechanic at one of my local dealers said there’s no way pennzoil euro is the correct oil and they have been and will continue to use rotella even tho their system says pennzoil platinum euro is what is to be used. It makes no sense and I won’t be getting my oil changed there anytime soon. I’ll give it a few months and call a few dealers and see what each one recommends for oil.

 

[Aseras]

Until they do a recall, Rotella is still the correct oil. If it screws up the truck because of a known problem, its on them, not the owner, even and especially past warranty coverage.

Apparently this is new new ecodiesel fiasco lottery, because FCA can't or won't fix their own documentation and dealership network, much less notify owners.

 

[Smon]

I saw on another forum that Amsoil is recommending a couple different oils. Started with the european oil, but now recommending a heavy duty diesel oil.

I'm getting close to needing my first oil change. Just not sure which way I want to go and who to listen to.

 

[Sascwatch]

I saw on another forum that Amsoil is recommending a couple different oils. Started with the european oil, but now recommending a heavy duty diesel oil.

I'm getting close to needing my first oil change. Just not sure which way I want to go and who to listen to.

You’d have thought this would have been figured out before the first production gen 3 rolled off the assembly line with the aftermarket catching up later. But were all guinea pigs at the moment.

It would be interested to see what the difference is in the testing for ms-10902 vs ms-12991 certifications.

 

[Mchurch52]

I also saw where Amsoil is recommending their Signature Series Max Duty diesel oil, but it is spec'd as Chrysler MS-10902 so I don't see how they can consider it suitable for the EcoDiesel when FCA is calling for MS-12991.

 

[KNGSNK11]

You’d have thought this would have been figured out before the first production gen 3 rolled off the assembly line with the aftermarket catching up later. But were all guinea pigs at the moment.

It would be interested to see what the difference is in the testing for ms-10902 vs ms-12991 certifications.

That would nice to know what the difference is actually.

 

[Aseras]

That would nice to know what the difference is actually.

Its the SAP. One is mid SAPS, one is High SAPS.

European Motor Oils and SAPS Content

European vehicle market share has grown steadily over the last decade, with roughly 10 percent of all vehicles sold in the U.S. today bearing a European badge.

www.amsoil.com

 

[Palo Duro Pete]

Rotella T6 is a better oil in practically every way than the oil they are recomending.

Their recomended oil is a High SAPS ( Sulphated Ash, Phosphate Sulphur ) oil that will ruin a DPF and emission equipment. Rotella isn't, it's low ash. Cleaning a turbo is a hell of a lot easier than a DPF replacement.

Here is a thread on a Fiat forum, where they list the Valvoline 5W-40 Euro (ms-12991) as a low-SAPS formulation: https://www.124spider.org/threads/oil-filter-master-thread.15041/. I've read other sites claiming it is a low-to-mid SAPS formulation. In any event, it's probably better for the DPF than the Penzoil formulation. Maybe this is the best choice to both comply with the Chrysler standard and protect the DPF. WXman posted a link to Walmart for the oil, here is a link to Amazon: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07ZCR1LNG

Edited to add: This Valvoline oil complies with the BMW LL-04 specification. Here is a lay description of the spec:

Special BMW approval for fully synthetic long-life oil. Viscosities are SAE 0W-30, 0W-40, 5W-30 and 5W-40. Usually required for BMWs equipped with a diesel particulate filter (DPF). Can also be used where a BMW Longlife-98 or BMW Longlife-01 oil is recommended.

Note that Penzoil Platinum Euro does not comply with the LL-04 spec. It is LL-01.

Edit 2: Found the Valvoline spec sheet (attached) on their Australian web site. Confirms it's low SAPS.

 

[mrfreon]

FYI, Here's the response I got from RamCares. It looks like I'll be using Penzoil since that's the only brand name they care to mention at this point.

mrfreon said:
I was informed the owners manual that came with my 2020 Ram 1500 EcoDiesel specified the incorrect oil type. Where can I find (in writing) the correct oil type to use so I do not void my warranty? Another member on this forum mentioned Pennzoil Platinum Euro is the correct oil, but I would prefer to see an official document from FCA. Thank you!

Thank you for taking the time to reach out! We recommend 5W-40 Synthetic engine oil such as Mopar or Penzoil Platinum Euro that meets FCA Material Standard MS-12991 - please refer to the chart on page 424 of your owners manual. Please know that the appropriate parties are aware and manuals are in the process of being updated.

Mark
RamCares

 

[EugeneYYZ]

Here is a thread on a Fiat forum, where they list the Valvoline 5W-40 Euro (ms-12991) as a low-SAPS formulation: https://www.124spider.org/threads/oil-filter-master-thread.15041/. I've read other sites claiming it is a low-to-mid SAPS formulation. In any event, it's probably better for the DPF than the Penzoil formulation. Maybe this is the best choice to both comply with the Chrysler standard and protect the DPF. WXman posted a link to Walmart for the oil, here is a link to Amazon: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07ZCR1LNG

Edited to add: This Valvoline oil complies with the BMW LL-04 specification. Here is a lay description of the spec:


Note that Penzoil Platinum Euro does not comply with the LL-04 spec.t is LL-01.

Edit 2: Found the Valvoline spec sheet (attached) on their Australian web site. Confirms it's low SAPS.

LL 01 much better than LL 04 , more thick , more lubrication , less ecology sh*t .

 

[mrfreon]

It's on sale this month..... https://www.napaonline.com/en/p/PZR...MI84f--cmH6gIVDg8YCh3y8g7sEAQYASABEgIucvD_BwE

 

[EugeneYYZ]

It's on sale this month..... https://www.napaonline.com/en/p/PZR...MI84f--cmH6gIVDg8YCh3y8g7sEAQYASABEgIucvD_BwE

in Canada 5L 20$ us

 

[Hrspwr88]

To all my Canadian forum friends.

Pennzoil Platinum Euro 5w40 is on sale at Canadian Tire for 50% off. 5L for $29.99

Cheers!