subwoofer swap

[Billet1500 4x4]

One thing I have noticed and its not related to the ANC, but related to the fact that RAM has piped the exhaust note into the cab through the speakers is now its noticeably louder when driving more spiritedly, there are multiple sounds that come through the speakers at fixed volume regardless of the volume setting for your music, warning chimes, turn signal click and the exhaust note, now that you have more sensitive speakers in the rear doors the amp still broadcasts these sounds at the same signal strength making them audibly louder within the cab the exhaust note being the most noticable with the new rear door speakers, I think the dash speakers handle the turn signal click and warning chimes and the difference in volume is not as noticable on those, they aren't really a lot louder than the stock speakers just offer better range and clarity in my opinion.

 

[Billet1500 4x4]

Any tips for removing the rear door panels? Is it difficult?

One thing that happened on my panels.

Right below the arm rest where the plastic meets the leather rest is where the lower portion of the plastic panel is joined to the upper, they use a plastic melt rivet to joint them together and its brittle and will tear loose. Try popping the pins that hold the upper panel first otherwise there is good chance the 2 panels will separate, 3 of mine split right there I just put them back together with 2 part epoxy

 

[Billet1500 4x4]

Now after getting some road time in, the wierd noises and and low frequency growls are showing up, I think I'm going to pull the rear jbls back out and try to return them, they just don't play well with the ANC and sound system in general. I do not plan on disconnecting my ANC just to upgrade the rear door speakers.

 

[ksn240]

Now after getting some road time in, the wierd noises and and low frequency growls are showing up, I think I'm going to pull the rear jbls back out and try to return them, they just don't play well with the ANC and sound system in general. I do not plan on disconnecting my ANC just to upgrade the rear door speakers.

I haven't noticed anything out of the ordinary with mine yet. I haven't driven the truck a whole awful lot with them, but have driven under all speeds and rpms and have been looking for it. That being said, I have no problem disconnecting my ANC should it start posing a problem. Never had it in any vehicle before and I have no problem hearing my Hemi and Carven exhaust growl inside the cabin.

If you do take the 6x9s back out, you could always try replacing just the headliner speakers back there. If it is only low frequency noises coming through, the GX302s shouldn't pick them up and that would give you a proper tweeter in the back.

Mine will be here tomorrow and I will be replacing them sometime this week. I was going to replace the front doors as well with the second set of GX963s, but if they don't provide enough bass as you said then it would be pointless. They may go in my wife's Grand Cherokee. She has the Alpine in it and I believe the rear doors are 6x9s as well.

 

[Billet1500 4x4]

I haven't noticed anything out of the ordinary with mine yet. I haven't driven the truck a whole awful lot with them, but have driven under all speeds and rpms and have been looking for it. That being said, I have no problem disconnecting my ANC should it start posing a problem. Never had it in any vehicle before and I have no problem hearing my Hemi and Carven exhaust growl inside the cabin.

If you do take the 6x9s back out, you could always try replacing just the headliner speakers back there. If it is only low frequency noises coming through, the GX302s shouldn't pick them up and that would give you a proper tweeter in the back.

Mine will be here tomorrow and I will be replacing them sometime this week. I was going to replace the front doors as well with the second set of GX963s, but if they don't provide enough bass as you said then it would be pointless. They may go in my wife's Grand Cherokee. She has the Alpine in it and I believe the rear doors are 6x9s as well.

Its correlated with rpm and exhaust , with the carven exhaust you might not notice it at. Its wierd it only makes the noise at certain rpms and load on the engine, but it doesn't do it everytime, the way I really noticed it was with the radio muted it was obvious some sounds were coming out of the rear doors that shouldn't have been.

 

[ksn240]

Its correlated with rpm and exhaust , with the carven exhaust you might not notice it at. Its wierd it only makes the noise at certain rpms and load on the engine, but it doesn't do it everytime, the way I really noticed it was with the radio muted it was obvious some sounds were coming out of the rear doors that shouldn't have been.

I see. I will have to mute the radio and see if I hear anything.

 

[Cannonball]

..now that you have more sensitive speakers in the rear doors the amp still broadcasts these sounds at the same signal strength making them audibly louder within the cab the exhaust note being the most noticable with the new rear door speakers

I think you got it 100% with that statement.

I wonder if the low sounds are created for exhaust tone enhancement or to counter unwanted noises. It seems there are two independent systems at play here.

I ran across this article https://jlaudio.zendesk.com/hc/en-u...tive-Noise-Cancellation-ANC-?mobile_site=true that makes me wonder (from option 3) if removing the rpm signal input to the amp would fix the wanted noises (assuming they are the exhaust supplement only) heard with more sensitive speakers while retaining the noise cancellation ability.

 

[Billet1500 4x4]

I think you got it 100% with that statement.

I wonder if the low sounds are created for exhaust tone enhancement or to counter unwanted noises. It seems there are two independent systems at play here.

I ran across this article https://jlaudio.zendesk.com/hc/en-u...tive-Noise-Cancellation-ANC-?mobile_site=true that makes me wonder (from option 3) if removing the rpm signal input to the amp would fix the wanted noises (assuming they are the exhaust supplement only) heard with more sensitive speakers while retaining the noise cancellation ability.

I actually was able to pinpoint it today on my way into work. 2500 RPM +/- 200 RPM or so, the supplemental exhaust note or ANC for whatever reason creates a resonance with the aftermarket door speakers, I'm not sure if it's ANC related because you can reproduce the issue while parked. I don't know if it would do it with an aftermarket exhaust system or if you just can't hear it over the actual exhaust.
When I first noticed it I was able to reproduce it by setting the cruise at around 55 MPH then using the gear limited down shifted to 5th to get RPMs up. So after I got to work I put the truck in park, muted the radio, and held the RPM at 2500 and the rear speakers resonated the entire time I held the truck at that RPM, as soon as it was a little above or a little below it goes away. I'm not sure how or if the ANC and supplemental exhaust go hand and hand, I have read that cracking a window disables the ANC I would think being in park would as well but maybe not. I'm going to run the same test at lunch today but with the window cracked to see if it makes a difference.

Being that it only happens at this one RPM it's not a huge deal since cruising speeds are generally under 2500 rpm, My concern though in my case is driving in the mountains and 1400 rpm doesn't cut it for pulling a grade and you need the RPM's up in the 2500 RPM range or for others that tow regularly this could be an issue as well when you need to be in the higher RPM range for the additional torque.

What RAM needs to is offer a software patch with the option to turn off the supplemental exhaust and ANC through the uconnect setting screen. This should be an option straight from the factory. I have read that you can unpin the mic's at the amp, i wonder if you could pop the mic's out of the headliner and disconnect them there or if that would be easier than working on the harness under the seat. Or like you mentioned just disconnecting the RPM signal from the amp.

Has anyone that has disconnected the ANC noticed any real difference in cabin noise without it? Typically if you're going down the ANC disable road you're adding after market stereo stuff and possibly have am exhaust so cabin noise is the last of your concerns.

 

[Cannonball]

I actually was able to pinpoint it today on my way into work. 2500 RPM +/- 200 RPM or so, the supplemental exhaust note or ANC for whatever reason creates a resonance with the aftermarket door speakers, I'm not sure if it's ANC related because you can reproduce the issue while parked. I don't know if it would do it with an aftermarket exhaust system or if you just can't hear it over the actual exhaust.
When I first noticed it I was able to reproduce it by setting the cruise at around 55 MPH then using the gear limited down shifted to 5th to get RPMs up. So after I got to work I put the truck in park, muted the radio, and held the RPM at 2500 and the rear speakers resonated the entire time I held the truck at that RPM, as soon as it was a little above or a little below it goes away. I'm not sure how or if the ANC and supplemental exhaust go hand and hand, I have read that cracking a window disables the ANC I would think being in park would as well but maybe not. I'm going to run the same test at lunch today but with the window cracked to see if it makes a difference.

Being that it only happens at this one RPM it's not a huge deal since cruising speeds are generally under 2500 rpm, My concern though in my case is driving in the mountains and 1400 rpm doesn't cut it for pulling a grade and you need the RPM's up in the 2500 RPM range or for others that tow regularly this could be an issue as well when you need to be in the higher RPM range for the additional torque.

What RAM needs to is offer a software patch with the option to turn off the supplemental exhaust and ANC through the uconnect setting screen. This should be an option straight from the factory. I have read that you can unpin the mic's at the amp, i wonder if you could pop the mic's out of the headliner and disconnect them there or if that would be easier than working on the harness under the seat. Or like you mentioned just disconnecting the RPM signal from the amp.

Has anyone that has disconnected the ANC noticed any real difference in cabin noise without it? Typically if you're going down the ANC disable road you're adding after market stereo stuff and possibly have am exhaust so cabin noise is the last of your concerns.

Everything you've just found leads me to believe the problem is the exhaust supplement sound not any sort of noise cancellation. Frequency will be different when moving vs parked so the common here is rpm.

If this was a speaker sensitivity issue, I'd expect the active sound management to hear its own drone and change its frequency quickly. But if it's purposeful exhaust supplement, it will override ANC and remain active dependent on rpm. And as you said, now being sent through a more sensitive speaker, will be much louder.

Need to find the rpm input wire!

 

[ksn240]

Everything you've just found leads me to believe the problem is the exhaust supplement sound not any sort of noise cancellation. Frequency will be different when moving vs parked so the common here is rpm.

If this was a speaker sensitivity issue, I'd expect the active sound management to hear its own drone and change its frequency quickly. But if it's purposeful exhaust supplement, it will override ANC and remain active dependent on rpm. And as you said, now being sent through a more sensitive speaker, will be much louder.

Need to find the rpm input wire!

Very interesting but seems to be the culprit. I listened for it in the way to work this morning and couldn't hear anything, but I do have the Competitor catback so it is probably loud enough that I don't hear it coming from the speakers.

 

[Billet1500 4x4]

Everything you've just found leads me to believe the problem is the exhaust supplement sound not any sort of noise cancellation. Frequency will be different when moving vs parked so the common here is rpm.

If this was a speaker sensitivity issue, I'd expect the active sound management to hear its own drone and change its frequency quickly. But if it's purposeful exhaust supplement, it will override ANC and remain active dependent on rpm. And as you said, now being sent through a more sensitive speaker, will be much louder.

Need to find the rpm input wire!

No such luck my friend. Just a guess but the RPM signal is coming in on the IP canbus, so its just one of the many addressed information packets coming through on the CAN bus not a discrete input, the amp is just looking for the particular RPM input register on the data stream, Just like reading the RPM's from the ODB2 port.

 

[Cannonball]

Well

No such luck my friend. Just a guess but the RPM signal is coming in on the IP canbus, so its just one of the many addressed information packets coming through on the CAN bus not a discrete input, the amp is just looking for the particular RPM input register on the data stream, Just like reading the RPM's from the ODB2 port.

Well, s***.

Nice dd on the wiring diagram!

Like @Billet1500 4x4 said, curious to hear the difference between ANC mics removed vs installed...

 

[Billet1500 4x4]

Well


Well, s***.

Nice dd on the wiring diagram!

Like @Billet1500 4x4 said, curious to hear the difference between ANC mics removed vs installed...

Well here are a couple vids, From my limited testing it appears that it is directly related to the ANC. With the windows up the drone is there, I cracked the window in the first video with no change but I didn't give it enough time to adjust for the window being open before closing it. In the second video I started with the window open and let it run at 2500 RPM for about 30 seconds with no drone, then I closed the window while holding it there and the drone started. The video has been edited down so all of the elapsed time on the second video of the truck holding 2500 RPM without drone has been cut to just right when I closed the window.

 

[Billet1500 4x4]

I haven't noticed anything out of the ordinary with mine yet. I haven't driven the truck a whole awful lot with them, but have driven under all speeds and rpms and have been looking for it. That being said, I have no problem disconnecting my ANC should it start posing a problem. Never had it in any vehicle before and I have no problem hearing my Hemi and Carven exhaust growl inside the cabin.

If you do take the 6x9s back out, you could always try replacing just the headliner speakers back there. If it is only low frequency noises coming through, the GX302s shouldn't pick them up and that would give you a proper tweeter in the back.

Mine will be here tomorrow and I will be replacing them sometime this week. I was going to replace the front doors as well with the second set of GX963s, but if they don't provide enough bass as you said then it would be pointless. They may go in my wife's Grand Cherokee. She has the Alpine in it and I believe the rear doors are 6x9s as well.

Yeah I may exchange these for a partial refund and a set of GX302s for the headliner. They do sound much better less the drone. I might try disconnecting the ANC mics at the head liner are even just muffling them temporarily to see how much of a difference there really is without it. I'm guessing they are really after engine noises because the ANC isn't offered on the V6 version. GM did the same thing on the 14-18's, the 5.3 didn't have noise cancelling but the 6.2 did. Unfortunately the only way to get an accurate baseline would be to put the stock speakers back in and measure SPL with ANC connected and everything functioning correctly then compare it with the SPL with the ANC disconnected.

 

[ksn240]

Yeah I may exchange these for a partial refund and a set of GX302s for the headliner. They do sound much better less the drone. I might try disconnecting the ANC mics at the head liner are even just muffling them temporarily to see how much of a difference there really is without it. I'm guessing they are really after engine noises because the ANC isn't offered on the V6 version. GM did the same thing on the 14-18's, the 5.3 didn't have noise cancelling but the 6.2 did. Unfortunately the only way to get an accurate baseline would be to put the stock speakers back in and measure SPL with ANC connected and everything functioning correctly then compare it with the SPL with the ANC disconnected.

What happened to the days when these kind of things were simple? Drop the proper spec'd speakers in and you're good to go. Just what we get for buying fancy new trucks lol.

 

[cruz1996]

I didn’t like the gx962 I got the gx963 and just put them. Sounds like a concert in my truck

 

[Billet1500 4x4]

What happened to the days when these kind of things were simple? Drop the proper spec'd speakers in and you're good to go. Just what we get for buying fancy new trucks lol.

I know right, your biggest issue was making sure everything is wired in series or parallel and bridged correctly for power and ohms. Now I'm wondering if the rear speakers are out of phase and the ANC is trying to cancel a frequency by generating a 180 degree signal and instead of cancelling the signal its just adding to it so it sends more power and it just gets continually worse. It seems like its primary purpose is to cancel exhaust drone so it waits until its detecting a frequency for at least a few seconds of a sustained frequency before it kicks in to try and cancel the tone. During normal driving around town, everything is constantly changing so it's really just monitoring things and not doing anything, then you get on an open stretch with constant RPM and then its starts doing its thing. The speakers sounded fine when I installed them so I didn't check polarity but now I'm wondering. Did you check polarity when you installed yours, or just go plug and play with the adapters? I'm getting really tired of pulling door panels off, so far I've been lucky but now I'm waiting for something to break during the process or ending up with rattles from the constant on/off process. One of these days I'll buy a new truck and just leave it alone.

 

[ksn240]

I know right, your biggest issue was making sure everything is wired in series or parallel and bridged correctly for power and ohms. Now I'm wondering if the rear speakers are out of phase and the ANC is trying to cancel a frequency by generating a 180 degree signal and instead of cancelling the signal its just adding to it so it sends more power and it just gets continually worse. It seems like its primary purpose is to cancel exhaust drone so it waits until its detecting a frequency for at least a few seconds of a sustained frequency before it kicks in to try and cancel the tone. During normal driving around town, everything is constantly changing so it's really just monitoring things and not doing anything, then you get on an open stretch with constant RPM and then its starts doing its thing. The speakers sounded fine when I installed them so I didn't check polarity but now I'm wondering. Did you check polarity when you installed yours, or just go plug and play with the adapters? I'm getting really tired of pulling door panels off, so far I've been lucky but now I'm waiting for something to break during the process or ending up with rattles from the constant on/off process. One of these days I'll buy a new truck and just leave it alone.

I didn't check polarity. I just trusted it was all right and used the adapters. I had some sustained driving at 70 mph for 10-15 minutes and still couldn't catch anything from the rear. I also had two and six year old noise makers in the back though. My other set of 302s came in today. Will try to install them in the headliner when I get off work tomorrow.

 

[Billet1500 4x4]

As an experiment I covered the rear ANC mics with a piece of 1/8" thick rubber. This pretty much eliminated the drone. Didn't touch the front mics at all, apparently each of the 4 mics is positioned to cancel noise for a person sitting in that seat location, cutting off the input to just the rear mics prevented the ANC from broadcasting any white noise through the rear speakers. All in all it still doesn't make sense why just a simple speaker change would have such a dramatic effect on the ANC. I'm debating on reversing the polarity to see if it has any effects on the ANC issue.

 

[ksn240]

Well here are a couple vids, From my limited testing it appears that it is directly related to the ANC. With the windows up the drone is there, I cracked the window in the first video with no change but I didn't give it enough time to adjust for the window being open before closing it. In the second video I started with the window open and let it run at 2500 RPM for about 30 seconds with no drone, then I closed the window while holding it there and the drone started. The video has been edited down so all of the elapsed time on the second video of the truck holding 2500 RPM without drone has been cut to just right when I closed the window.

That seems to be pretty loud drone. I would think even with my exhaust I would be able to hear that. When I go to work tomorrow I will try to keep it around 2500 and see if I catch anything. I haven't noticed anything of the sort yet.