Input on towing setup

[slimchance]

riccnick .. you said .."However, if you're suggesting that you can use the wdh setup to remove tongue weight from the truck when you get to the scales, then that's a different story. "

NO ..NO .. i am NOT saying you will remove any tongue weight from the truck, you only redistribute the tongue weight between the truck axles ... to MOVE tongue weight OFF the truck you have to raise or lower the hitch ball and that moves weight on or off the trailer axles

 

[riccnick]

riccnick .. you said .."However, if you're suggesting that you can use the wdh setup to remove tongue weight from the truck when you get to the scales, then that's a different story. "

NO ..NO .. i am NOT saying you will remove any tongue weight from the truck, you only redistribute the tongue weight between the truck axles ... to MOVE tongue weight OFF the truck you have to raise or lower the hitch ball and that moves weight on or off the trailer axles

It seems we agree then! lol

 

[Gondul]

Yeah, I think we're agreeing on the same thing here. Gondul doesn't know his exact truck / trailer / axle weights yet, but he's trying to get a good baseline to see if it's even possible or safe to be pulled with his truck.

Believe me... I appreciate the information. Which has me now considering a 2500... but that will require some lengthy discussions with the boss to really drill down into what 'we' want.

I really like the 1500, but if we will be *just* scraping by on the numbers then the 2500 will be safer to drive... I would like to make a decision sooner rather than later. I figure the less miles on the 1500, the better off I'll be when I trade it in... but I am leery about purchasing a truck sight unseen...

 

[riccnick]

Believe me... I appreciate the information. Which has me now considering a 2500... but that will require some lengthy discussions with the boss to really drill down into what 'we' want.

I really like the 1500, but if we will be *just* scraping by on the numbers then the 2500 will be safer to drive... I would like to make a decision sooner rather than later. I figure the less miles on the 1500, the better off I'll be when I trade it in... but I am leery about purchasing a truck sight unseen...

As with everything, be careful and still pay VERY close attention to the payloads on the HD trucks. It's very easy to end up with a Crew Cab, 4x4, Diesel, Longbed, Loaded Up Heavy Duty that you think will haul the planet in the back but still only has 1,400lbs of payload capacity. (not sure on the exact spec's / numbers on how to get there, but you get what I'm saying)

 

[Gondul]

As with everything, be careful and still pay VERY close attention to the payloads on the HD trucks. It's very easy to end up with a Crew Cab, 4x4, Diesel, Longbed, Loaded Up Heavy Duty that you think will haul the planet in the back but still only has 1,400lbs of payload capacity. (not sure on the exact spec's / numbers on how to get there, but you get what I'm saying)

Exactly my concern with no hard numbers available on weights. I know @Zeronet posted a list of weight of different items... I double checked it against my 1500 and it is off by 37# (shows 1273 vs 1310)... it may be a baseline for the 2500.

 

[Johnvan]

If you already own the truck and trailer you've got to try it out first. You might be throwing away $20,000+ and end up with a truck you don't like as much.

 

[Johnvan]

Just to add to that...

You've got a trailer that is reputed to tow very well and you have a modern, powerful half ton with air suspension.

Check out the combinations at the campgrounds and you'll see much worse combinations. Many overweight. Ignorance is bliss because they're doing just fine!

 

[Gondul]

If you already own the truck and trailer you've got to try it out first. You might be throwing away $20,000+ and end up with a truck you don't like as much.

Just to add to that...

You've got a trailer that is reputed to tow very well and you have a modern, powerful half ton with air suspension.

Check out the combinations at the campgrounds and you'll see much worse combinations. Many overweight. Ignorance is bliss because they're doing just fine!

I do not have a TT, that particular conversation just came up within the last couple of weeks. Had I know her interest in a TT, I would likely not have bought the 1500.

And while it is a very nice truck and can tow a good bit, the payload is what is restricting me... not understanding the numbers made me think the TT we looked at was doable. Based on input here, and research, it appears that I am placing the 1500 at (or just over) its maximum capabilities, not a place where I think I want to be...

Ignorance may be bliss, but physics doesn't give a f***.

 

[Zinger]

I do not have a TT, that particular conversation just came up within the last couple of weeks. Had I know her interest in a TT, I would likely not have bought the 1500.

And while it is a very nice truck and can tow a good bit, the payload is what is restricting me... not understanding the numbers made me think the TT we looked at was doable. Based on input here, and research, it appears that I am placing the 1500 at (or just over) its maximum capabilities, not a place where I think I want to be...

Ignorance may be bliss, but physics doesn't give a f***.

Is this your first TT? My sincere advice if so is to go with something far cheaper than an Airstream to cut your teeth on the whole idea. Airstreams are wickedly expensive, and in my opinion quite small. Slide outs are a must because they really open up the trailer living space. $100k for a first TT is a real gamble unless you're 100% positive it's the right one for you.

 

[Gondul]

Is this your first TT? My sincere advice if so is to go with something far cheaper than an Airstream to cut your teeth on the whole idea. Airstreams are wickedly expensive, and in my opinion quite small. Slide outs are a must because they really open up the trailer living space. $100k for a first TT is a real gamble unless you're 100% positive it's the right one for you.

Thanks, I appreciate the comments and concern, but we've borrowed TTs from other folks over the years.

There are a couple of more RV shows in the next couple of months for us to go out and peruse TTs but the wife is not impressed with 'land whales'... and there is Outdoorsy where we can rent something over a weekend to give it a try.

 

[JJRamTX]

Picking your own number for tongue weight is asking for trouble, as you don't know the balance of the weight of the trailer behind the axles. Taking X% off the front of the trailer moves that X% directly to the back of the trailer (assuming most TT's axles are pretty close to centered in the length of the trailer. To be more accurate, we'd need overhang and hitch length measurements from any trailer we'd want to calculate for)

I should have clarified that 8% would only work for loads over 7,000LBS tandem, triple, or greater axle trailer. Never go below 10% on a single axle trailer!!

 

[Johnvan]

I think there's a few reasonable things you can do to slightly reduce it. Instead of buying a bike rack that mounts on the A-frame get a ladder or bumper mount.

Load a bit of the heavier things in the aft cargo. Going from a 13.8% from the factory down to 11%-12% shouldn't be difficult or inconvenient.

 

[riccnick]

I should have clarified that 8% would only work for loads over 7,000LBS tandem, triple, or greater axle trailer. Never go below 10% on a single axle trailer!!

I'm just asking here, but how did you arrive at these numbers? There's no hard and fast rule like that

 

[slimchance]

i guess this "overweight" issue is more important to me because, you see years ago i worked at a blacktop mfg plant and i saw trucks brought to the scales for probable overweight and it is not pretty ... weight cops just do not write out a ticket when they find you are overweight, you have to reduce the weight to be legal BEFORE you move the truck, and in the case of gross overload they also had to pay the fine before they could move ... we sometimes had illegal trucks on our lot for weeks

 

[Creep0321]

i guess this "overweight" issue is more important to me because, you see years ago i worked at a blacktop mfg plant and i saw trucks brought to the scales for probable overweight and it is not pretty ... weight cops just do not write out a ticket when they find you are overweight, you have to reduce the weight to be legal BEFORE you move the truck, and in the case of gross overload they also had to pay the fine before they could move ... we sometimes had illegal trucks on our lot for weeks

I’m just getting into the research phase of buying a TT, what weights are “law”, vs “recommended”?

 

[Gondul]

I’m just getting into the research phase of buying a TT, what weights are “law”, vs “recommended”?

Your vehicle cannot go over the GVWR.
Truck and 'trailer'together cannot go over the GCVWR.
You are likely to be over your GVWR before you are over your GCVWR.

Some number for my truck:

GVWR 7100
Curb weight (how much the vehicle weighs with all fluids) 5790
Payload 1310 (GVWR-Curb weight)
GCVWR 17000

If we use the the 13% or so @riccnick mentioned earlier my TT with a GVWR of 7600, will have a hitch weight of 1,024 lbs.. add 100 for the WD hitch and we are 1,124 lbs.
Assuming two passengers @ 200lbs each, I am over my GVWR on the truck by 211 lbs.
So if I got pulled over and they wanted to weigh the truck, it would weigh 7,311 lbs vs the max of 7,100 lbs..

So even though my truck is rated to be able to tow 11,240 lbs, I am limited by the payload.

 

[slimchance]

Gondul ... very good explanation

 

[Johnvan]

But if you have weight Distribution some weight will be put back on the axles of the trailer. This is a fact.
There was a link to a YouTube video here comparing air bags versus weight Distribution.
You say you'd be over by 200 lbs. You'd be putting about 300 back on the trailer so you'd be under.

 

[Johnvan]

Here’s a great page explaining clearly the reduction in weight from the tow vehicle. In this example it is reduced by 298 lbs.

Trailer Weight Distribution Hitch | ProPride 3P Trailer Hitch

Discussion on 'What happens when weight is added via a trailer weight distribution hitch'. Propride 3p Trailer Hitch eliminates 'Sway' and 'Porpoising'.

propridetrailerhitch.com

 

[Gondul]

Gondul ... very good explanation

I try to pay attention...