Considering Ram - opinions on my choices so far

[mikeru82]

Kinda. The diff between the 4th and 5th gen RAM is an example of
”good thing I waited”, but then there’s usually enough leaked info that a buyer will know what’s coming.

Oh I agree. But there's a difference in waiting for a complete redesign (4th to 5th gen), and waiting for a model year change within the same gen. And no matter how much info is "leaked", until it actually exists in production, it's still only speculation. Not sure if you remember, but I remember reading posts in other Ram forums before the 5th gens came out, where people swore that the 5th gens were gonna have UConnect 5. Or any number of other goodies. Some of them panned out, but some of them didn't.

 

[jdmartin]

Well, I've had mine for over 2 years so far and getting close to 20k miles and I haven't had anything inside it go wrong, and I have all kinds of nifty options in here. The main thing I see complaints on is the 12" screen in terms of power things going wrong on the interior. I don't remember reading anywhere about anyone having problems with power seats, mirrors, seat heaters, etc. That stuff has been around forever, so you're not talking about some new technology.

 

[SCasey89]

The difference here between buying now vs waiting, is that he’s looking at multiple brands. If this was a conversation about just the 2021 vs 2022 Ram 1500, then buying vs waiting would be kind of a moot point because I don’t see a lot changing other than the possibility of UConnect 5.

But because he’s also looking at other brands of trucks that have some rather huge changes coming in the next model year, then he might want to wait to see what they bring to the table. We’ll know soon enough what these other brands have in store, and maybe at that point the OP can decide if he wants to wait, or buy now.

 

[jdmartin]

The difference here between buying now vs waiting, is that he’s looking at multiple brands. If this was a conversation about just the 2021 vs 2022 Ram 1500, then buying vs waiting would be kind of a moot point because I don’t see a lot changing other than the possibility of UConnect 5.

But because he’s also looking at other brands of trucks that have some rather huge changes coming in the next model year, then he might want to wait to see what they bring to the table. We’ll know soon enough what these other brands have in store, and maybe at that point the OP can decide if he wants to wait, or buy now.

I guess I don't understand the OP's point anyway. He has a truck that has 20k miles on it that (I think) he bought new in 2012. I'm assuming that it's not a broken down POS with those miles, so it seems to me he either wants to trade because he just wants something else and is sick of driving that vehicle or because he wants new technology. If he just wants something else, then I don't see what the point is in waiting because there's always going to be different vehicles offered, and if he wants new technology I don't see the point in waiting because technology is always going to change - unless he's waiting for something specific that doesn't exist yet like flying cars

I have a favorite saying: "Don't let the perfect be the enemy of the good". Yes, maybe GM or Toyota or Ford or Tesla or Honda or Daewoo will come out with an even badder-asser truck next year. In the meantime, he gets to just keep driving the truck he obviously no longer wants when there's plenty of good trucks out there now and he might get hit by a train between now and the time that Daewoo launches the 2022 ***-smasher 4000

 

[Granite2WD]

I guess I don't understand the OP's point anyway. He has a truck that has 20k miles on it that (I think) he bought new in 2012. I'm assuming that it's not a broken down POS with those miles, so it seems to me he either wants to trade because he just wants something else and is sick of driving that vehicle or because he wants new technology. If he just wants something else, then I don't see what the point is in waiting because there's always going to be different vehicles offered, and if he wants new technology I don't see the point in waiting because technology is always going to change - unless he's waiting for something specific that doesn't exist yet like flying cars

I have a favorite saying: "Don't let the perfect be the enemy of the good". Yes, maybe GM or Toyota or Ford or Tesla or Honda or Daewoo will come out with an even badder-asser truck next year. In the meantime, he gets to just keep driving the truck he obviously no longer wants when there's plenty of good trucks out there now and he might get hit by a train between now and the time that Daewoo launches the 2022 ***-smasher 4000

If he's seriously considering Toyota they are coming out with an all-new totally redesigned truck this year. Considering that hasn't happened since 2007, that could be worth waiting for.

 

[Captain Obvious]

Looking at a Longhorn with 10th anniversary package. Package seems to cover most "optional" things - only additional things I can see I would consider "must haves" would be the hemi and potentially a sunroof.

Get the Hemi, if for no reason other than resale value. V6 and 4x2 are death for resale.

Whats a good price on this truck with current incentives? (Not counting tax/dox fees as these vary by state) - sticker is 66k i think...am I crazy to expect someone to sell this for 52k after incentives (assuming I'm not doing 0%/72 months)....for that matter how much do I give up to use the 72 month promo?

I bought two weeks ago and gave up 1500 in rebates to get 0/72. I did the math and 0/72 saves me over $3k on interest over the life of the low interest (2.5%) 60 month loan that I would usually use. I took my sizeable down payment that I would have put down and invested it, I guarantee I'll make that $1500 back and then some. If someone is letting me buy a truck with their money for free, I'm generally taking that offer 10/10 times.

 

[Shamrock92]

Ok - so alot to respond to here...if I miss anything my apologies.

- 1st - why upgrade....well the 2012 was my old man's, when he passed it became mine. Now its a fine running vehicle - but it is as basic as they come. 6cy, 2wd - crank windows, vinyl floor and bench seat. Surprised the thing came with AC honestly.

It's the most basic transportation available - it owes me nothing. Cost me nothing and if the damn thing wouldn't get hung up on wet grass - I'd probably keep it...but just can't do 2WD - need 4 and prefer a 8 cylinder for when I have to haul something infrequently.

- Why not wait for 2022 Tundra (or anything else) . This ones easier - 2022 Tundra is going to be different for sure....and it is very unlikely to have a 8 cylinder option. 6 and 6cy turbos are being widely reported...only makes sense as Toyota struggles with the reality of US market requirements on fleet avg fuel economy and the fact the Prius ain't the powerhouse seller it was a decade ago (thanks Tesla). As far as waiting for the "next" thing....at a point you just will get tired of waiting....every year has some new and exciting option it seems...about half actually stick for more than a few years.

- Safety...easiest answer - don't wreck. Safety ratings I take with a grain of salt...its a stat dealers love to push when it favors their line and dismiss when it doesn't. Similar to payload/hauling - theres a legit difference in a truck rated for 6500 pound of towing and one with 11k....comparing 10,200 to 10,600fir example is nothing - they are equal to me - but its about HOW it handles that weight. If the 10,200 feels more comfortable - that is your better truck (even if its rated slightly less).

- The whole consumer reports (or car and driver) review...depends ALOT on the target audience of the publication. Neither do I consider that great....Car and Driver focuses on sports enthusiasts/car drivers. So the smooth riding, quick accelerating RAM gets high marks. CR on the other hand was in love with the Honda Accord for a decade plus...why - because of perceived reliability and resale. Face it - their writers cater to a bunch of middle aged, upper middle class folk with conservatively invested 401ks, plans to retire at 67 and then maybe open a freaking B&B in Vermont. Car and Driver readers are middle aged and want to be 22 again - back before the divorces took their toll and before they gave up all hope. Magazines are no longer relative to media...they might as well be MySpace pages. I buy and drive what I like. If someone else likes it to..that's nice but not needed for me to enjoy it.

As far as trucks as work vehicles...alit depends on the "work" your doing. Towing a trailer, driving to multiple sites or using your truck as a mobile office - you might get 3 answers from most people on which is "best". The Ram has nicest ride/comfort level and is capable of hauling. Toyota is good at towing - but as a daily driver is a gas hog with the 8 cylinder and interior wise is very poorly configured if you have the center console (its huge - but good for storage only). Ford has a ton of outlets, a great console to work off of and power in the bed and gets good mileage - but ride is below Ram to me and looks wise just doesn't turn heads.

Finally - sticker v price paid...American brands are caught in the incentive trap....they started giving huge rebates/0% for 286 month type incentives....and it sold a TON of rides...but when they tried to take those away...they get crushed. So now they have to inflate stickers to get the number they need. Toyota incentives are in the 2-3k range...just to keep from letting the Big 3 run away...calculate the interest on a 60 month- 25k auto loan at 3% and tell me how 0 for 60 is that much better. By the time you put 5k down and have a 10k trade...thats about the typical price of a car these days.

On the other hand - "investing" that 25k - yes. You can make money - but it takes discipline, luck (if your putting it into the stock market for example...returns can go negative) and requires you to either reduce principle each month to make those payments - or be prepared to save as much as your payment each month. I have done this before on purchases (or used a 401k/life insurance loan for lower rates) - but no one is handing out 0% when rates are high...there could be a big bump in rates in 2022...now is the time to lock in if you want to.

 

[Shamrock92]

And yes - I would trade 1500 rebate for 0% right now if I was a typical buyer.

I don't expect auto rates to surge...but I think the days of 2% are limited...3-4% feels closer to the level we should be at. Banks are just having trouble finding borrowers (quality ones at least)- so money has been artificially cheap of late. That may change as the recovery develops.

 

[Shamrock92]

Spent some time on the website.

Going with a Laramie and the options I want - my sticker comes to right at 59k.

So assuming 15% off sticker with incentives- should put me right at 50k as an OTD price. Sound reasonable ?

If I go this route - I am ordering. Yes, I know some dealers hate it...don't care. It makes comparison shopping super easy...just email my build - say give me your price. Just going to be hard to get all my picks - and if I'm laying out more than 50k - I want exactly what I want (after all - I will be married to this thing for a decade at least)

I'd love to do it local - but who knows....will also contact dealers on the forum on my side of the nation...I mean $500 savings would quickly be eaten uo by transport/travel cost...but 5k...that is worth it.

 

[securityguy]

Spent some time on the website.

Going with a Laramie and the options I want - my sticker comes to right at 59k.

So assuming 15% off sticker with incentives- should put me right at 50k as an OTD price. Sound reasonable ?

If I go this route - I am ordering. Yes, I know some dealers hate it...don't care. It makes comparison shopping super easy...just email my build - say give me your price. Just going to be hard to get all my picks - and if I'm laying out more than 50k - I want exactly what I want (after all - I will be married to this thing for a decade at least)

I'd love to do it local - but who knows....will also contact dealers on the forum on my side of the nation...I mean $500 savings would quickly be eaten uo by transport/travel cost...but 5k...that is worth it.

You need to add into your final cost TAX, TITLE, TAGS and any DEALER FEES. You may be hard pressed to get $50K OTD but not undoable.

 

[Shamrock92]

Sorry 50k OTD does not include tax (as this varies between 0 and 9% depending on state) - dealer fee (again 200-1k) or tags (40-1500) as all of these vary wildly by venue.

Many states for example have no sales tax - but tags run something like 2% of the average value of your vehicle. Dealer fees are capped in some states - others have no cap.

It is a OTD price of vehicle itself - the dealer take....not the governments.

 

[Silent Bob]

And yes - I would trade 1500 rebate for 0% right now if I was a typical buyer.

I don't expect auto rates to surge...but I think the days of 2% are limited...3-4% feels closer to the level we should be at. Banks are just having trouble finding borrowers (quality ones at least)- so money has been artificially cheap of late. That may change as the recovery develops.

If you order your truck this month you can lock in the 0% financing.

 

[silver billet]

My opinion: the current Toyota will give you less problems than the current Ram. The upcoming Toyota, who knows. However the current Ram is the nicest truck, and it's what I want to drive. If that means going to a mechanic an extra 3-4 times over over the course of my ownership, so be it. I'm fully prepared for that scenario, both "mentally" (lol) and with my pocket book (I saved so much going with the Ram that I can afford to pay more for out of pocket repairs, while STILL getting the truck I actually want to drive.

Makes it a no brainer. But still, Toyota's drivetrain is legendary at this point and rock solid. Thirsty as all get out, but it will never let you down. The ZF is also rock solid. The Hemi.... that is the question. Some people have 0 issues and get 250K miles out without any trouble. Others blow a lifter and camshaft after 30,000K. It's also a noisy engine, lots of mechanical chatter from injectors, piston slap, and exhaust manifold bolts breaking off. Not hating on the Hemi, just my observations.

 

[Silent Bob]

exhaust manifold bolts breaking off

That happened on my 2014 Hemi at 75,000 miles

 

[securityguy]

This is why I get new vehicles every 2 years Most all of my vehicles get sold/traded at 1.5-2.5 years with a max of 20K miles on them. Time to move on to something new!

 

[Rebelguy2020]

So I'm considering Ram (along with Toyota) and want to get opinions from the ram side on my pick so far.

Looking at a Longhorn with 10th anniversary package. Package seems to cover most "optional" things - only additional things I can see I would consider "must haves" would be the hemi and potentially a sunroof.

Tested a Laramie today and was very impressed - enough to drop Ford/GM from my search...Ford just doesn't do much for me and despite being a GM fan and current owner - the new offerings were underwhelming.

My biggest worry with Ram is reliability...yes I am aware its a topic thats been beat to death . Power train wise- I don't feel Toyota has any real advantage here...both power plants have been around and both are solid. Its the interior where Ram worries me....I come from the old school pickup crowd...less power is better when it comes to an interior. That said - I think I'm ready to take the chance....yes, Toyota has a better rep (because it has less thrills inside) - but is it really better to eliminate all the luxury perks to avoid having issues? Given I use my truck under 10k miles a year and keep them a decade...this time I think I'd rather have a full featured truck rather than a truck with decade old features in it.

Other concern is resale. Like I said - I keep my vehicles - but its nice to know if I want to trade in - id see some money back. Hell, my current 2012 Silverado WT cost 16500 out the door and is bringing 11k on the sale (granted it has under 20k miles...and is as basic a truck ever made...but still nice resale).

Whats a good price on this truck with current incentives? (Not counting tax/dox fees as these vary by state) - sticker is 66k i think...am I crazy to expect someone to sell this for 52k after incentives (assuming I'm not doing 0%/72 months)....for that matter how much do I give up to use the 72 month promo?

Also looked at the 2500 power wagon and Rebel...kinda thinking the 2500 is just too much truck for my needs (I know - some people will say no such thing) and the Rebel is nice...but feels a bit younger (or in my case middle aged/old man trying to look young).

Any options I am overlooking the value in ? Air suspension is interesting to me...if it were closer to a grand - id probably say yes...but given the choice of a 6 with air suspension or hemi...I'm going bigger engine - the ride wasn't that horrible on the Laramie I drove today without it.

TIA for help

I like the way you are thinking, so many people are so loyal to a specific brand that they will miss out on some of the best features that would actually be better for them.
Sounds like you are doing your research and that’s important, you are buying the truck that you want with the features that will serve you best, it’s probably the biggest purchase next to a house, and you are like me, I keep my trucks for many years. If you were to end up buying a truck solely based on the best selling truck, or the most reliable truck or the cheapest price for a truck and regretted making that purchase because it’s not what you really wanted, and then being stuck with it for years.

I have absolutely no regrets buying my 2020 Rebel diesel, it is by far the most expensive, the most luxurious, the most capable and the most fuel efficient truck I have ever purchased in my sixth decade of life. The Ram brand has specific features that were important for me that are not available from other manufacturers, like the Rambox, the in floor storage on the crew cabs, the rear coil suspension or the air ride suspension and the best interior. Best looking exterior in my opinion!

The main deal for me was the small displacement fuel efficient diesel, it is not only way better on mpg than my previous Ram with the Hemi (not really a fair assessment because it was a 2011 with the 5 speed transmission and older technologies like the hydraulic power steering...). I’m not sure about the gas prices where you live but here in Northern Ontario Canada, diesel fuel is way cheaper than regular gasoline yesterday I filled up with diesel and it cost $15 dollars less than if I were to fill up with regular gas, the difference would have been greater if I was to put the recommended 89 octane the Hemi requires.

I had been shopping around and tried a diesel truck from my home town dealer, but it did not have the options that I really wanted so I kept searching and finally found one that was on order at a dealer 500 miles south, it was $5,000 more but had more than $10,000 worth of options, and the discount was exceptional.

I wish you good luck in your search and I hope you will enjoy your new ride when the time comes.

 

[wallyuwl]

Spent some time on the website.

Going with a Laramie and the options I want - my sticker comes to right at 59k.

So assuming 15% off sticker with incentives- should put me right at 50k as an OTD price. Sound reasonable ?

If I go this route - I am ordering. Yes, I know some dealers hate it...don't care. It makes comparison shopping super easy...just email my build - say give me your price. Just going to be hard to get all my picks - and if I'm laying out more than 50k - I want exactly what I want (after all - I will be married to this thing for a decade at least)

I'd love to do it local - but who knows....will also contact dealers on the forum on my side of the nation...I mean $500 savings would quickly be eaten uo by transport/travel cost...but 5k...that is worth it.

If it were me, I would buy a RAM. Your current truck doesn't have 4wd and you want/need that. The new Tundra will be 10 or 11 months yet, no V8, will be expensive, and will still have 1st year problems. Ford are really expensive for what they are (I had a 2018 XLT F150) and not as nice as RAM for interior or driving manners, and even with a new interior GM still drive like tanks and have a bad powertrain (their problematic 8 speed unless you get the 6.2 with the 10 speed co-developed with Ford, and DI engines that need valves walnut blasted every 40k). The RAM also tows better than the F150 did even with a lower tow rating (3.92 adds 3k lbs tow capacity to RAM).

However, I would look and see if a 2020 Laramie was around with features close to what you want. Use the inventory search on ramtrucks.com. 2020 are about $1000 cheaper than 2021 msrp for the same truck. They also have over $2k better rebate and dealers will want them gone (12 to 14% off MSRP dealer discount before incentives should be attainable). Dealers can trade, too, if there is a dealer around that is known to have good prices but doesn't have the truck you want. Just be sure the build date is after July 31, as that is supposedly when the new AC parts started being used.

If nothing close to what you want is available, order from Mark Dodge or one of the other dealers giving forum members good deals.

Look into conquest cash, GM owners were getting another $2k in Oct and Nov. Not sure if Conquest is active now. Also if you order sign up for a PenFed savings account; after 60 days of membership you can get a code for $1000 off the new truck.

 

[HeliPilot]

Not relevant to todays market, but I purchased my 2019 Limited Ram for $53,000 just over 2 years ago. Sticker was $67,500. The truck has been great for 40,000 miles. I'm selling it in a couple weeks in order to pick up a TRX. Reliability has not been an issue with mine, and the price was right at your original target. If I had listened to the Forum 2 years ago, I would not have ended up with a trouble free first model year purchase. There are no guarantees in life. If you want it, get it.

 

[86grand]

So I'm considering Ram (along with Toyota) and want to get opinions from the ram side on my pick so far.

Looking at a Longhorn with 10th anniversary package. Package seems to cover most "optional" things - only additional things I can see I would consider "must haves" would be the hemi and potentially a sunroof.

Tested a Laramie today and was very impressed - enough to drop Ford/GM from my search...Ford just doesn't do much for me and despite being a GM fan and current owner - the new offerings were underwhelming.

My biggest worry with Ram is reliability...yes I am aware its a topic thats been beat to death . Power train wise- I don't feel Toyota has any real advantage here...both power plants have been around and both are solid. Its the interior where Ram worries me....I come from the old school pickup crowd...less power is better when it comes to an interior. That said - I think I'm ready to take the chance....yes, Toyota has a better rep (because it has less thrills inside) - but is it really better to eliminate all the luxury perks to avoid having issues? Given I use my truck under 10k miles a year and keep them a decade...this time I think I'd rather have a full featured truck rather than a truck with decade old features in it.

Other concern is resale. Like I said - I keep my vehicles - but its nice to know if I want to trade in - id see some money back. Hell, my current 2012 Silverado WT cost 16500 out the door and is bringing 11k on the sale (granted it has under 20k miles...and is as basic a truck ever made...but still nice resale).

Whats a good price on this truck with current incentives? (Not counting tax/dox fees as these vary by state) - sticker is 66k i think...am I crazy to expect someone to sell this for 52k after incentives (assuming I'm not doing 0%/72 months)....for that matter how much do I give up to use the 72 month promo?

Also looked at the 2500 power wagon and Rebel...kinda thinking the 2500 is just too much truck for my needs (I know - some people will say no such thing) and the Rebel is nice...but feels a bit younger (or in my case middle aged/old man trying to look young).

Any options I am overlooking the value in ? Air suspension is interesting to me...if it were closer to a grand - id probably say yes...but given the choice of a 6 with air suspension or hemi...I'm going bigger engine - the ride wasn't that horrible on the Laramie I drove today without it.

TIA for help

I wouldn't expect a deal that good without some negotiating. My longhorn was around 72k and paid around 54k. The dealer's first offer was around 63k and we settled at 54.

 

[Shamrock92]

So Carmax locally has a '19 Limited - 27k, listed at 49k.

Nice truck- with options it would probably be above 70k as a 2021...but 50k for 3 yo used seems high. If it were 45k I'd probably look - but I think the price vs new - its gonna set a while.

As to finding a 2020...I'd like to - one local has a 2020 that checks some of the boxes...but not crazy about color and again - if I am dropping 50k+ - I want what I want...not what they have in stock that day. Otherwise I would probably go with the Tundra - knowing if something better comes along I can trade out and not lose 30% of what I paid in a year.