Anti-Spin Diff vs. E-Locker

[VaderRebel]

The manual from my 19’ says nothing about the View attachment 23467 LS differential being able to lock (pg 161), and only has 3 short paragraphs that discuss it.

The manual wouldn't say anything about the LS locking because it doesn't. It's a clutch system like in a manual transmission. Pressure creates the distribution of traction, not a locking mechanism.

 

[cjr4497]

The new Rams come with electronic locking rear diffs. There is no difference between the two options. they both electronically lock both rear axles together. When not locked they act as an open differential, one wheel drive.

A limited slip differential (lsd) is not offered anymore. If your truck has an open rear you can buy very good aftermarket limited slip diffs. A torsion style is better and more expensive than a clutch style. More than likely there are after market e lockers for the rear of these trucks as well.

I wish ram would offer a lsd front diff for the rebel. That would make it a beast and give extra piece of mind off road. I have read that something I'm the front of the gen 4 Rams was too weak to handle a lsd and that is why the aftermarket didn't offer it, at least when I was doing some research. I am guessing the axles or something they connected too was too weak.

Hopefully the 5th gens are beefier up front and can handle a lsd up front.

 

[SpeedyV]

The new Rams come with electronic locking rear diffs. There is no difference between the two options. they both electronically lock both rear axles together. When not locked they act as an open differential, one wheel drive.

A limited slip differential (lsd) is not offered anymore. If your truck has an open rear you can buy very good aftermarket limited slip diffs. A torsion style is better and more expensive than a clutch style. More than likely there are after market e lockers for the rear of these trucks as well.

I wish ram would offer a lsd front diff for the rebel. That would make it a beast and give extra piece of mind off road. I have read that something I'm the front of the gen 4 Rams was too weak to handle a lsd and that is why the aftermarket didn't offer it, at least when I was doing some research. I am guessing the axles or something they connected too was too weak.

Hopefully the 5th gens are beefier up front and can handle a lsd up front.

There’s a whole lot written here that is completely incorrect. Many threads and posts have discussed and compared the open, anti-spin, and ELocker options on these trucks.

 

[firecadet613]

The new Rams come with electronic locking rear diffs. There is no difference between the two options. they both electronically lock both rear axles together. When not locked they act as an open differential, one wheel drive.

A limited slip differential (lsd) is not offered anymore. If your truck has an open rear you can buy very good aftermarket limited slip diffs. A torsion style is better and more expensive than a clutch style. More than likely there are after market e lockers for the rear of these trucks as well.

I wish ram would offer a lsd front diff for the rebel. That would make it a beast and give extra piece of mind off road. I have read that something I'm the front of the gen 4 Rams was too weak to handle a lsd and that is why the aftermarket didn't offer it, at least when I was doing some research. I am guessing the axles or something they connected too was too weak.

Hopefully the 5th gens are beefier up front and can handle a lsd up front.

I've got a limited slip in my 2019.

 

[devildodge]

Thank you build and price misinformation

 

[riccnick]

The new Rams come with electronic locking rear diffs. There is no difference between the two options. they both electronically lock both rear axles together. When not locked they act as an open differential, one wheel drive.

A limited slip differential (lsd) is not offered anymore. If your truck has an open rear you can buy very good aftermarket limited slip diffs. A torsion style is better and more expensive than a clutch style. More than likely there are after market e lockers for the rear of these trucks as well.

I wish ram would offer a lsd front diff for the rebel. That would make it a beast and give extra piece of mind off road. I have read that something I'm the front of the gen 4 Rams was too weak to handle a lsd and that is why the aftermarket didn't offer it, at least when I was doing some research. I am guessing the axles or something they connected too was too weak.

Hopefully the 5th gens are beefier up front and can handle a lsd up front.

Yeah, sorry but you could not possibly be more misinformed here my man (or woman)

The trucks come with either an open rear, an anti-spin (lsd), or the E-Locker.

And clutch type and torsion type lsd's both have their pro's and cons, and for 90% of applications, manufacturers repeatedly go with clutch type for their low noise and easy street driving characteristics over the more durable yet harsher torsion type diffs.

The front (and rear) axles have been significantly beefed up for the 5th gen. Lots of info on this in the press releases stating that the running gear has been made larger for higher payloads, towing, and off-road-ability.

Welcome to the forums, cruise around a bit, there is TONs of good info on here about the engineering behind these new trucks.

 

[diamondmi]

I'm about to order my 2019 Laramie Longhorn with just about everything. Was considering the off-road package for just in case situations, mostly snow in NJ, but don't think I'll need it. I'm thinking I'll just get a pair of snows for the winter.

However, reading this thread, one other thing I'm debating is the anti-spin diff or Electronic-locking rear axle. From what I can gather reading the entire thread, if I get E-locking I have to manually engage it with the button. However, with the E-locking rear, I will not have the anti-spin?

I probably won't be going off road (maybe a beach if I ever get to the Outer Banks again). I'm more interested in just having good traction in the snow and wet weather. Taking a Laramie out the other day for a test drive in the rain and making a right from a stop sign, the back tires broke loose. Not sure if that truck had anti-spin, but that was not safe trying to get into traffic. If I had the 4WD auto on, would that prevent that kind of slipping in rain from a stop sign?

I'll be ordering the 3.92 rear also.

 

[SpeedyV]

I'm about to order my 2019 Laramie Longhorn with just about everything. Was considering the off-road package for just in case situations, mostly snow in NJ, but don't think I'll need it. I'm thinking I'll just get a pair of snows for the winter.

However, reading this thread, one other thing I'm debating is the anti-spin diff or Electronic-locking rear axle. From what I can gather reading the entire thread, if I get E-locking I have to manually engage it with the button. However, with the E-locking rear, I will not have the anti-spin?

I probably won't be going off road (maybe a beach if I ever get to the Outer Banks again). I'm more interested in just having good traction in the snow and wet weather. Taking a Laramie out the other day for a test drive in the rain and making a right from a stop sign, the back tires broke loose. Not sure if that truck had anti-spin, but that was not safe trying to get into traffic. If I had the 4WD auto on, would that prevent that kind of slipping in rain from a stop sign?

I'll be ordering the 3.92 rear also.

Traction control and Auto 4WD will help, even if you have an open diff. Anti-slip is good when you encounter unexpected slippage, especially in 2WD. Nothing beats a locker if you anticipate losing traction, e,g. off road, boat ramp, getting someone else unstuck, etc. Even though I’ll rarely need it, I went with the ELocker as a part of the Off-Road Group.

 

[diamondmi]

"Traction control and Auto 4WD will help, even if you have an open diff. Anti-slip is good when you encounter unexpected slippage, especially in 2WD. Nothing beats a locker if you anticipate losing traction, e,g. off road, boat ramp, getting someone else unstuck, etc. Even though I’ll rarely need it, I went with the ELocker as a part of the Off-Road Group."

I'm new to this. Is "traction control" the same as anti-slip? And I'm assuming if you get e-locker, you don't get the anti-slip. Meaning you would always have to manually engage the e-lock in anticipation of slippage? If I always kept it in 4WD auto, would that work similarly to the anti-slip? Lots of questions.

Thanks,
Mark

 

[parnine]

I'm about to order my 2019 Laramie Longhorn with just about everything. Was considering the off-road package for just in case situations, mostly snow in NJ, but don't think I'll need it. I'm thinking I'll just get a pair of snows for the winter.

However, reading this thread, one other thing I'm debating is the anti-spin diff or Electronic-locking rear axle. From what I can gather reading the entire thread, if I get E-locking I have to manually engage it with the button. However, with the E-locking rear, I will not have the anti-spin?

I probably won't be going off road (maybe a beach if I ever get to the Outer Banks again). I'm more interested in just having good traction in the snow and wet weather. Taking a Laramie out the other day for a test drive in the rain and making a right from a stop sign, the back tires broke loose. Not sure if that truck had anti-spin, but that was not safe trying to get into traffic. If I had the 4WD auto on, would that prevent that kind of slipping in rain from a stop sign?

I'll be ordering the 3.92 rear also.

I went through this same dilemma and this is my takeaway -
"However, with the E-locking rear, I will not have the anti-spin?" - that is correct, you get one or the other or neither.

"If I had the 4WD auto on, would that prevent that kind of slipping in rain from a stop sign" - No. Both tires breaking loose can happen with all configurations if you apply enough gas and the tires can not maintain contact, how you drive is as, if not more, important than the LSD, e-locker, 4wd etc.

If I were to order, I would get the e-Locker. With the new traction control technology it in essense simulates the LSD (check out youtube) so with e-locker you have 'some level of simulated LSD' for general use via traction control, and then you can force the lock when needed.

I went for best deal and bought off the lot, and LSD suffices for my needs. IMHO you only really need the e-locker if you are serious off road.

 

[diamondmi]

Well, looks like I'm somewhat out of luck. Dealer says they put a stop on any more orders of 2019 Rams. I either have to find what I want out there or order the 2020. Will wait and see. Thanks for all your help. It was very informative!

 

[StuartV]

I really like the E locker, turn it on, it locks when below 28 or so mph, still allows you to turn too. Much better than the LSD for me.

I want to know more about what that means where it says "still allows you to turn, too."

I'm thinking that just means that when you're going over 28 (or, from a later post, 20), the e-Locker disengages, so at higher speeds you can turn.

But, if you are going slower than 20 (or whatever), the rear would be locked up and you would not want to be turning on dry pavement.

Thanks! That's what I'm a bit confused about. If in 4WD on sand (obviously ! ) why would you need an anti-slip as there are 2 front wheels to help pull you through if one of the rear slips. It's a matter of just pulling it out of the slip, and 4WD has 3 wheels to do that. Slip is not an issue, airing down and constant momentum prevents any spin or digging in. I would assume they would only be needed for off roading (rocks) which I don't do, or slipper wet roads, which would be nice, but is it worth the $$. I live in the suburbs near the beach, not desert, forrest, or snow country. Thanks everyone for your thoughts!

And I'm also debating eTorque. Is it needed and worth the extra $1,200 invoice addional cost. It would take years to make that back in gas, and who buys trucks to be "green". lol

If you don't have LSD or e-Locker, then when you're in 4WD, you have 2 open diffs, which means that you could have 1 front wheel and 1 rear wheel spinning and the other 2 doing nothing. With LSD in that situation, at least both wheels at the rear would be getting some of the power. In other words, with no LSD or e-Locker, you could have power going to as few as 2 wheels (in 4WD mode). With LSD or e-Locker, you would always have power going to at least 3 wheels.

My choice is LSD. I'm never going to do any serious off-roading in my truck. If I had an e-Locker, that would mean that 95% of the time, my truck would be exactly the same as a truck with 2 open diffs.

With LSD, my truck always has, well, limited-slip at the rear. Driving in wet, snowy, or icy conditions, or just pulling into traffic while making a sharp turn are all reasons to have LSD. Traction control helps, but it's still not as good as LSD + Traction Control.

As I mentioned in another post, I've had several occasions over the years of losing traction at highway speeds. Hydroplaning, black ice, whatever. In those situations, an e-Locker is exactly useless. One, because you don't have it turned on. And, two, because at those speeds, it would not be engaged even if it was turned on.

I don't really have 4WD so I can go off-roading. I have it primarily for the extra safety that it brings to a vehicle with a very light back end. And for that, an e-Locker is useless.

As for eTorque, @Cmerkert, nobody else can decide what something is "worth" to you. But, I wanted the eTorque, and not so much for saving money on gas (though that would be nice). I wanted a little bit for gas savings for the purpose of going further between gas stops. And I wanted it because all the reviews made it sound like the eTorque makes the truck drive just a little bit nicer.

I've had my new truck for almost a week now. 475 miles. I drove my 4th gen 1500 with a Hemi for 10 years and 193K miles. I would say the new setup definitely drives smoother and feels more responsive. It's little things like the way it starts to pull after braking, making a corner, and getting back into the throttle. Not a huge difference, but a little nicer. I HATED the Start/Stop in other vehicles I've driven that had it (Jeep and Mercedes). But, the S/S in my new truck is totally unobtrusive. Most of the time I don't even notice it (though I'll check and see that it has shut off). If that nets me an extra 1 or 2 MPG, cool.

 

[RAM/Cudaowner]

The Dealer Sales People ,the Parts People,And the Service People cannot explain WHY the description does not match the product.
For $495 dollars....I would like to know EXACTLY how my product works....Not some Various Answers From Different Departments., And the Ordering /Description
Section must be Really off Base.
I have No Wires going into my "Electronically Controlled" Differential.

 

[RAM/Cudaowner]

Define pricey $700 to 800 for the part. $200 to 300 for installation.

Folks here are telling me the Antispin is indeed still a purely mechanical unit... and so swapping in an aftermarket part should be do-able. I further understand that Ram is still using a 9.25" ring gear, same size as the 4th Gen and therefore hopefully lots of options out there.




That should not happen. FCA's TCS BLD is pretty dang good and should have locked up the other wheel.

Yeah....I think the web site is Mis-leading on how the unit works.
I am Still looking for the Dealer to Clarify the Description.

 

[devildodge]

The limited slip works exactly the same way it has since forever. In the muscle car days Mopar called it SURE-GRIP and now they call it anti spin.

The eLocker works just how you think also. Push a button to engage, then it automatically disengages and engages at speeds around 20 MPH. Then you can disengage with the button. Has to be done each start up.

Both have a different way to get the same thing done, and even the open diff is going to have a good bit of anti spin qualities with the help of traction control.

And just like all the other options, personal preference far outweigh any reason for all 3 of them.

 

[Rob5589]

I am going to look into the E-locker further. Just for reference, I was a differential mechanic many moons ago so I have a decent understanding of how they work. E-lockers are very popular in the off road segment as are air lockers. The ability to turn them off in certain situations is what is attractive.

Back then, the Sure Grip (Anti-Spin) was a cone style LSD. It had a cone shaped "clutch" gear that would literally dig into the case in order to apply torque to both axles. Technically they were not rebuildable although we had come up with a way to mill down the outer end of the cone then shim between the cone and side gear to make up for the removed material. It worked perfectly fine but was a once and done.

The Jeep Rubicon lockers work as a LSD until locked. My completely uneducated guess is that the RAM locker possibly works in the same way. I will have to jack mine up and see what it does while on stands.

A downside to the RAM's locker is it disengages as 20 mph, per the owners manual. So they designed it for low speed type crawling, which is where a locker excels. Snow, ice, slick roads, etc, are not where you want a locker. Something like a Truetrac would work well in those situations as would the factory LSD.

There is a great YT video that demonstrates traction control vs LSD vs a locker that really shows how they all work. I will see if I can locate it.

 

[Cravenfan]

Holy crap...this is confusing, so I'm following this thread...I may end up ordering a 2020 Limited...so I'm wondering what to get also. This is what I'm reading;

- Electronic ($545 option) good at low speed, but you have to engage it each time with the button, as it kicks off after going over 20mph, but this option also comes with the hill decent (I think), which could come in handy in certain situations.
- Anti-spin ($495 option), needs the truck to spin one of the rear tires (one tire drive) and then kicks in the other rear tire for traction. I think this goes back to some of the older cars, you could, "burn out," but the first 10' was one tire track, then the other wheel kicked in and from that 10' to 40' you had two marks on the pavement?

Assuming the same thing...low speeds, when I know I'm going to be on ice, slippery conditions, etc. at low speed, electronic seems to be the right way to go. Hit it and roll. But, I am a bit confused as to how the Auto-4x4 interacts with this. I assume when you have the electronic button pressed and in auto-4x4, both rear wheels are now moving the truck under 20mph and if there is slippage on the front, those engage with the auto-4x4 mode?

If you live in the city, never are going to venture out and live in a southern state, you probably won't need either. Where I live and I get into the North Maine Woods a half dozen times a year, electronic may be the right fit for me.

Is that a decent summary of the above 4 pages?

 

[Rob5589]

Holy crap...this is confusing, so I'm following this thread...I may end up ordering a 2020 Limited...so I'm wondering what to get also. This is what I'm reading;

- Electronic ($545 option) good at low speed, but you have to engage it each time with the button, as it kicks off after going over 20mph, but this option also comes with the hill decent (I think), which could come in handy in certain situations.
- Anti-spin ($495 option), needs the truck to spin one of the rear tires (one tire drive) and then kicks in the other rear tire for traction. I think this goes back to some of the older cars, you could, "burn out," but the first 10' was one tire track, then the other wheel kicked in and from that 10' to 40' you had two marks on the pavement?

Assuming the same thing...low speeds, when I know I'm going to be on ice, slippery conditions, etc. at low speed, electronic seems to be the right way to go. Hit it and roll. But, I am a bit confused as to how the Auto-4x4 interacts with this. I assume when you have the electronic button pressed and in auto-4x4, both rear wheels are now moving the truck under 20mph and if there is slippage on the front, those engage with the auto-4x4 mode?

If you live in the city, never are going to venture out and live in a southern state, you probably won't need either. Where I live and I get into the North Maine Woods a half dozen times a year, electronic may be the right fit for me.

Is that a decent summary of the above 4 pages?

So the E locker will lock the rear axle solid, no bias toward one wheel or the other. The anti-spin uses spring tension to divide traction to both wheels. That spring tension can be overcome, however, if one wheel has solid traction and the other has less traction; eg, one on pavement, one on grass. Then you may end up with unequal traction.
The e locker will disengage at 20 mph in hi ranges, 30 in low range. The hill descent will only work in low range. I would not choose a locker on icy roads as it will "push" you forward when trying to turn. For icy roads a limited slip (anti-spin) is preferred.
The 4 wheel auto and traction control combo actually work well for snowy conditions on road. I used the 4 auto recently and the combo of the two worked perfectly.

 

[Willwork4truck]

What he said above. Deep snow, muddy or sand conditions should favor E Locker. Basic snow, wet roads and Ice as well as “forget about it” , favors anti-spin.
2wd boar ramp? E Lock maybe better but you probably have 4x ordered.

 

[StuartV]

What he said above. Deep snow, muddy or sand conditions should favor E Locker. Basic snow, wet roads and Ice as well as “forget about it” , favors anti-spin.
2wd boar ramp? E Lock maybe better but you probably have 4x ordered.

Yeah. 2WD on a boat ramp and an e-Locker is going to do zip, if there's no traction for either rear wheel.