Water leak and wet carpet (solved)

[Lablvr2]

I apologize ahead of time for the slightly long post.
By posting this I hope in some way to help some of the folks who are frustrated with the mystery water leaks on these new 5th generation Rams. Recently I discovered my driver side footwell carpet was slightly damp. I finally had some spare time a few days later to investigate further. I pulled the driver side sill plate up and then pulled the carpet back only to discover a small puddle of accumulated water and damp underpad. I did not want to take my truck to the dealer only to have them take panels apart and risk damaging something or not put in the effort to determine where the leak was coming from so I decided to track the leak down myself. I will preface this by saying that I am mechanically inclined and no stranger to working on or taking apart my own vehicles however running down these leaks are not that difficult and with patience and the right tools can be done pretty easy.

I, like many on this forum searched and have read all the threads pertaining to these mystery leaks and looked at the various things that could be causing them such as incorrectly installed sunroof drains or body seams that are missing sealant. My truck actually has a September production date and by then I'm guessing the quality checks were much better. I found that all the sunroof drains were installed correctly and after pulling out the driver side fender lining and inspecting the body seams including performing my own leak test I did not find those were the issue. I decided to leave the carpet pulled up on the driver side and the sill trim panel off and by chance that evening we had a storm blow through. The next morning I went to inspect and sure enough the puddle of water was back but I discovered something very interesting. After carefuI inspection I found moisture underneath the wire harness channel that the sill plate panels snap into.

It is important to know I always back my truck in my driveway and have a slight decline. I proceeded to pull the rear sill plate panel and B pillar trim panels off and also removed the left rear seat assembly and the C pillar panels as seen in the attached pictures. I could clearly see that water was under the passenger rear wire harness channel also. My rear carpet was not wet at all but I did notice there was slight dampness underneath where the rear etorque battery is mounted to the rear of the cab. I decided to spray water on the outside of the cab around the rear window and around the rear driver side sunroof drain. Sure enough and with the drain seated in the rear of the cab properly there was a steady stream of water as seen in the pic making its way down through the lowest points of the body pan underneath the wire channel and all the way down to the front footwell. I was elated and frustrated all at the same time because I could not understand why if the grommet was installed correctly it was still allowing water to pass by. I concluded that the grommet was probably actually slightly smaller than the hole in the rear of the cab and somehow was not sealing properly so to rectify I pulled it out and placed a bead of clear silicone around it and inserted it back into the cab. After leak testing again the water leak was gone.

I feel fortunate that I was able to catch this sooner than later. I know this may not be the exact fix for everyone experiencing wet carpet issues but it's certainly a place to start and easy enough for anyone to check themselves before they waste valuable time taking their vehicle in and having it sit at a dealer for days on end. If you don't feel comfortable pulling panels off and removing seats then at least this might give you some information and a starting point to pass on to a dealer so they can investigate. Hope everyone finds this helpful.

 

[duke2001]

I apologize ahead of time for the slightly long post. By posting this I hope in some way to help some of the folks who are frustrated with the mystery water leaks on these new 5th generation Rams. Recently I discovered my driver side footwell carpet was slightly damp. I finally had some spare time a few days later to investigate further. I pulled the driver side sill plate up and then pulled the carpet back only to discover a small puddle of accumulated water and damp underpad. I did not want to take my truck to the dealer only to have them take panels apart and risk damaging something or not put in the effort to determine where the leak was coming from so I decided to track the leak down myself. I will preface this by saying that I am mechanically inclined and no stranger to working on or taking apart my own vehicles however running down these leaks are not that difficult and with patience and the right tools can be done pretty easy. I, like many on this forum searched and have read all the threads pertaining to these mystery leaks and looked at the various things that could be causing them such as incorrectly installed sunroof drains or body seams that are missing sealant. My truck actually has a September production date and by then I'm guessing the quality checks were much better. I found that all the sunroof drains were installed correctly and after pulling out the driver side fender lining and inspecting the body seams including performing my own leak test I did not find those were the issue. I decided to leave the carpet pulled up on the driver side and the sill trim panel off and by chance that evening we had a storm blow through. The next morning I went to inspect and sure enough the puddle of water was back but I discovered something very interesting. After carefuI inspection I found moisture underneath the wire harness channel that the sill plate panels snap into. It is important to know I always back my truck in my driveway and have a slight decline. I proceeded to pull the rear sill plate panel and B pillar trim panels off and also removed the left rear seat assembly and the C pillar panels as seen in the attached pictures. I could clearly see that water was under the passenger rear wire harness channel also. My rear carpet was not wet at all but I did notice there was slight dampness underneath where the rear etorque battery is mounted to the rear of the cab. I decided to spray water on the outside of the cab around the rear window and around the rear driver side sunroof drain. Sure enough and with the drain seated in the rear of the cab properly there was a steady stream of water as seen in the pic making its way down through the lowest points of the body pan underneath the wire channel and all the way down to the front footwell. I was elated and frustrated all at the same time because I could not understand why if the grommet was installed correctly it was still allowing water to pass by. I concluded that the grommet was probably actually slightly smaller than the hole in the rear of the cab and somehow was not sealing properly so to rectify I pulled it out and placed a bead of clear silicone around it and inserted it back into the cab. After leak testing again the water leak was gone. I feel fortunate that I was able to catch this sooner than later. I know this may not be the exact fix for everyone experiencing wet carpet issues but it's certainly a place to start and easy enough for anyone to check themselves before they waste valuable time taking their vehicle in and having it sit at a dealer for days on end. If you don't feel comfortable pulling panels off and removing seats then at least this might give you some information and a starting point to pass on to a dealer so they can investigate. Hope everyone finds this helpful.

Great post, thanks from someone who has had water leaks. I am still vigilant, even though my dealer service personnel say all is fixed!

 

[Gtbrown]

Wow, fantastic post. I'm waiting for my Limited to be delivered, and marked this post for future reference.

 

[Lablvr2]

Great post, thanks from someone who has had water leaks. I am still vigilant, even though my dealer service personnel say all is fixed!

You have to be vigilant for sure. After reading all the posts about sunroof drains not seated correctly my situation is a great example of when it actually is installed correctly but still causing a leak. Could be a bad batch of gromments and don't want folks to eliminate it as a possible cause just because they visually see it installed correctly. It's worth the time to investigate for sure.

 

[Smashy71]

You did a nice job and no need to apologize for a lengthy post imo. Left unchecked this would be pretty bad in the future.

 

[Jared B]

Thanks for the informative post. Sucks that you had that issue but at least you were able to track it down and address it yourself. Definitely a good post for anyone else having similar issues.

 

[Edwards]

Awesome detective work! I may eyeball them from the inside this weekend just to make sure.

 

[Hackmunch]

so no sunroof no water problems?

 

[duke2001]

Not necessarily, be mindful of potential problem with driver’s side fender seal.

 

[duke2001]

I apologize ahead of time for the slightly long post. By posting this I hope in some way to help some of the folks who are frustrated with the mystery water leaks on these new 5th generation Rams. Recently I discovered my driver side footwell carpet was slightly damp. I finally had some spare time a few days later to investigate further. I pulled the driver side sill plate up and then pulled the carpet back only to discover a small puddle of accumulated water and damp underpad. I did not want to take my truck to the dealer only to have them take panels apart and risk damaging something or not put in the effort to determine where the leak was coming from so I decided to track the leak down myself. I will preface this by saying that I am mechanically inclined and no stranger to working on or taking apart my own vehicles however running down these leaks are not that difficult and with patience and the right tools can be done pretty easy. I, like many on this forum searched and have read all the threads pertaining to these mystery leaks and looked at the various things that could be causing them such as incorrectly installed sunroof drains or body seams that are missing sealant. My truck actually has a September production date and by then I'm guessing the quality checks were much better. I found that all the sunroof drains were installed correctly and after pulling out the driver side fender lining and inspecting the body seams including performing my own leak test I did not find those were the issue. I decided to leave the carpet pulled up on the driver side and the sill trim panel off and by chance that evening we had a storm blow through. The next morning I went to inspect and sure enough the puddle of water was back but I discovered something very interesting. After carefuI inspection I found moisture underneath the wire harness channel that the sill plate panels snap into. It is important to know I always back my truck in my driveway and have a slight decline. I proceeded to pull the rear sill plate panel and B pillar trim panels off and also removed the left rear seat assembly and the C pillar panels as seen in the attached pictures. I could clearly see that water was under the passenger rear wire harness channel also. My rear carpet was not wet at all but I did notice there was slight dampness underneath where the rear etorque battery is mounted to the rear of the cab. I decided to spray water on the outside of the cab around the rear window and around the rear driver side sunroof drain. Sure enough and with the drain seated in the rear of the cab properly there was a steady stream of water as seen in the pic making its way down through the lowest points of the body pan underneath the wire channel and all the way down to the front footwell. I was elated and frustrated all at the same time because I could not understand why if the grommet was installed correctly it was still allowing water to pass by. I concluded that the grommet was probably actually slightly smaller than the hole in the rear of the cab and somehow was not sealing properly so to rectify I pulled it out and placed a bead of clear silicone around it and inserted it back into the cab. After leak testing again the water leak was gone. I feel fortunate that I was able to catch this sooner than later. I know this may not be the exact fix for everyone experiencing wet carpet issues but it's certainly a place to start and easy enough for anyone to check themselves before they waste valuable time taking their vehicle in and having it sit at a dealer for days on end. If you don't feel comfortable pulling panels off and removing seats then at least this might give you some information and a starting point to pass on to a dealer so they can investigate. Hope everyone finds this helpful.

How much problem to pull out the driver's side fender lining? Did you by chance take any pictures of that area? Thanks for reply.

 

[Lablvr2]

How much problem to pull out the driver's side fender lining? Did you by chance take any pictures of that area? Thanks for reply.

I am sorry but I actually did not take pics of that but it took me 5 mins with the wheel on. Four fir tree fasteners and about 16 screws holding it to the wheel well. You will have to turn the wheel hard left and right to get all the outer screws and 2 at top back. When removed you have clear view of cab joints and welds. Mine looked perfect. I read some posts where guys are also removing windshield cowl but I don't think that is needed since you can see the seams from the bottom.

 

[Rich]

Not necessarily, be mindful of potential problem with driver’s side fender seal.

Does anyone have details and photos of this area? Or post a link to a thread with the details.

Thanks for the first post here. Could the OP maybe edit the original post to add some line breaks to add paragraphs breaks to make it easier to read? It sure is useful information!

 

[Lablvr2]

Does anyone have details and photos of this area? Or post a link to a thread with the details.

Thanks for the first post here. Could the OP maybe edit the original post to add some line breaks to add paragraphs breaks to make it easier to read? It sure is useful information!

I added some line breaks to my post.

 

[Rocketman]

Great information and awesome
detective work, much appreciated


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[silverbullet]

Think FCA is hiring? Very good post.

 

[Edwards]

This gets worse. I found another leak area, dammit!

After I seated my drain tubes I had an almost 8 hour drive before Christmas through very heavy rain and discovered my drivers carpet was wet a few days later. It's not happened since so I've been keeping an eye on things and this post had me thinking this was it.

While attempting to check my seals as @Lablvr2 outlined, I did not see any water trails below the driver's side drain. I did however find water remnants on one of the "patches" Ram put over the unused bolt hole closest to the driver's outside wall. It was also not centered over the hole and after removing I could see daylight through it.

Water is clearly getting in through these patched rear seat bolt holes. There are 8 rearward rear seat bolt holes. I presume four are used for the reclining seats and the other four are used for other rear seats. Someone will need to confirm. At least on my Limited, four are unused and simply taped over with round, black, fabric-based tape patches. Three were not centered and were allowing water to splash up and then weep wherever it desired inside the cab. I also had traces of rust in three areas from the bottom of the seat assemblies where they bolted next to these.

You can see in this pic the worst one. This is the one closest to the driver's side rear door. I had already started peeling it up before thinking to take a pic for you. That's why it has the folded in edge but you could see before this that it was clearly not centered over the bolt hole so it never sealed.


IMHO, this tape sucks. I removed all four of them, cleaned off the area, and replaced with larger squares of Gorilla tape that was far thicker. I may even figure out the bolt size and put bolts in these unused holes from the bottom. That would be an easy fix if you didn't want to take it apart from the inside.

This is pitiful.

 

[wildh24]

Bummer. My f150 had crappy fabric tape like that too. They had a really crappy drain system that got clogged and let water pool in the rocker panels. That's why they all are Rusty there.

Thanks for the posts. I'll keep watching. I had some water in the passenger foot well along the door area. I need to check again. Not sure if it was a leak or if the mysteriously empty water bottle my daughter had a soccer practice caused it. My guess is the latter.

 

[Edwards]

I also pulled both sunroof drains to silicone them while I was that far in. I measured the thickness of the cab rear wall (at the drain hole location) and the grommets used to seal the sunroof drain tubes. @Lablvr2 nailed it. The grommets look like they were designed to be inserted into walls 2.5 times thicker.

That means that for however long those sizes were used, they will never seal right. The inner grommet diameter was the same as the hole but since they don't seal tight inside/outside they get flexed by the hard drain hoses and I believe that's what causes the leaking.

After I applied the silicone and reinserted them (they make an audible "pop" when lubed like that!), you could see a crescent shaped area of white, uncured silicone around the top against the cab. Looking down, it was wider at the top and then narrowed as it got to the sides of the grommet. That's due to the hose flexing them and if no silicone was there, it's basically holding the top of the seal channel open to the elements.

 

[Rich]

This gets worse. I found another leak area, dammit!

After I seated my drain tubes I had an almost 8 hour drive before Christmas through very heavy rain and discovered my drivers carpet was wet a few days later. It's not happened since so I've been keeping an eye on things and this post had me thinking this was it.

While attempting to check my seals as @Lablvr2 outlined, I did not see any water trails below the driver's side drain. I did however find water remnants on one of the "patches" Ram put over the unused bolt hole closest to the driver's outside wall. It was also not centered over the hole and after removing I could see daylight through it.

Water is clearly getting in through these patched rear seat bolt holes. There are 8 rearward rear seat bolt holes. I presume four are used for the reclining seats and the other four are used for other rear seats. Someone will need to confirm. At least on my Limited, four are unused and simply taped over with round, black, fabric-based tape patches. Three were not centered and were allowing water to splash up and then weep wherever it desired inside the cab. I also had traces of rust in three areas from the bottom of the seat assemblies where they bolted next to these.

You can see in this pic the worst one. This is the one closest to the driver's side rear door. I had already started peeling it up before thinking to take a pic for you. That's why it has the folded in edge but you could see before this that it was clearly not centered over the bolt hole so it never sealed.
View attachment 15672

IMHO, this tape sucks. I removed all four of them, cleaned off the area, and replaced with larger squares of Gorilla tape that was far thicker. I may even figure out the bolt size and put bolts in these unused holes from the bottom. That would be an easy fix if you didn't want to take it apart from the inside.

This is pitiful.

Another good find! Do you have any diagrams or photos that would make it easier to locate these and check them? I'm not quite sure where they are from your description and I wouldn't want to start taking my cab half apart searching. Thanks again!

 

[Edwards]

Another good find! Do you have any diagrams or photos that would make it easier to locate these and check them? I'm not quite sure where they are from your description and I wouldn't want to start taking my cab half apart searching. Thanks again!

No, sorry I didn't take a photo. Two ways to plug them:

1. Figure out the size/pitch of the rearward seat bolts (4) and put some locktite on them and install from underneath the truck in the unused holes.
2. Remove rear seats. There are two bolts per rail, smaller Torx at the front and larger hex at the rear. The suspect patches are over secondary rear holes that are covered by the rear of the seat rails when installed. The rear of each rail uses one bolt hole and hides another so there are 4 used and 4 patched.

In the photo I posted above, that's the rear of the driver's side rail on the 40% rear seat, closest to the driver's side rear door. You can see the bolt hole used by the rail and the patched one is covered by the wide flange that makes up the seat rail meaning you have to remove the rear seats to see these.

Both holes (used and patched) have welded in nuts and appear identical in size.