Hemi s Back

[LOWRMPG]

Incorrect again. The 6.4 SRT has 485 hp and 475 lb/ft of torque.

The 6.4 in the 2500 makes 405hp. I still say the 5.7 numbers need to go up, especially if you're paying $1200 more for a weaker motor in 26.

 

[silver billet]

The 6.4 in the 2500 makes 405hp. I still say the 5.7 numbers need to go up, especially if you're paying $1200 more for a weaker motor in 26.

The 6.4 BGE makes 410 hp before 2025. They dropped it 5 hp for 2025.

The 5.7 numbers are fine where they are. It is 100% competitive with the other 3 v8s in the segment. They just need to add the 6.4 SRT (at 485 hp) for those like me who would like a decent bump in power, while maintaining all the advantages of a NA iron block v8 over a small turbo.

Eventually a new V8 should be developed, but this takes time, which they don't have at the moment. The quickest and cheapest way to get butts back in the seat of new rams is to add their existing V8's back into the lineup while they work on a successor.

Edit: There is way too much confusion over the two 6.4s.
The 6.4 BGE in the 2500 makes 410 hp and 429 lb/ft of torque
The 6.4 SRT used everywhere else makes up to 485 hp and 475 lb/ft of torque.

But even the BGE in the 2500, those are PEAK numbers. At WOT and at one specific spot in the RPMs. That's not how we drive trucks. Most of the time we use "power under the curve", and the BGE feels much stronger than the 5.7 when just "lugging" off the line. It's tuned to make more power lower down, and you absolutely do feel this power when towing over the 5.7. Ask anyone who has owned both in a 2500.

So while my preference is for the SRT, I'd also take the BGE in a 1500. I just don't think Ram would do that, the marketing is a far easier sell with the SRT.

 

[BowDown]

Exactly, it's the SRT, the engine we've been asking for. Nice to see you finally catch up to the rest of us.

No, you've been asking for the 6.4

 

[BowDown]

No. They use iron because of duty cycle and how it handles heat.



You bet with your money as you see fit.

Show me an example of an engine failure due to an aluminum block and failed duty cycles. Handle heat, an aluminium block handles heat fine if not better than an iron block; wonder why dodge used aluminium heads for the 5.7 if aluminium is so bad?

 

[silver billet]

No, you've been asking for the 6.4

No, you assumed we were talking about the BGE. Your mistake.

 

[silver billet]

Show me an example of an engine failure due to an aluminum block and failed duty cycles. Handle heat, an aluminium block handles heat fine if not better than an iron block; wonder why dodge used aluminium heads for the 5.7 if aluminium is so bad?

Why don't you actually research this instead of spilling nonsense on the forums? For example, TFL interviewed the 7.3 engineers and asked them pretty much point blank why they didn't use the ecoboost; the answer, as I've been saying, "duty cycle" and "mpg".

All the heavy duty engines use iron block v8's. That remains an attraction for the hemi, but if a newer v8 is released in the future with an aluminum block then at that point I'd still purchase that over a tiny turbo.

 

[silver billet]

A Google Gemini summary:

Modern heavy-duty truck gas engines (like those in 2500, 3500, F250, and F350 models) predominantly use cast iron blocks instead of aluminum for several key reasons, primarily related to the demands of heavy-duty applications:

• Strength and Durability: Cast iron is significantly stronger and more rigid than aluminum. Heavy-duty trucks are designed to haul and tow substantial loads, putting immense stress on the engine. An iron block can withstand the higher internal pressures and temperatures associated with prolonged, strenuous work, making it more resistant to warping, cracking, and deflection. This translates to greater reliability and longevity for the engine, which is crucial for commercial and work vehicles.
• Cost-Effectiveness: Cast iron is generally much cheaper to produce and machine than aluminum. For mass-produced heavy-duty vehicles, even small cost savings per unit can add up significantly, making iron a more economical choice for manufacturers.
• Vibration Damping and Noise Reduction: Cast iron has superior vibration-damping properties compared to aluminum. This helps to reduce engine noise and vibrations, contributing to a smoother and quieter ride, which is a desirable characteristic for trucks that might be driven for long hours.
• Thermal Stability: While aluminum dissipates heat faster, cast iron retains heat better. For heavy-duty applications where engines operate at high temperatures for extended periods, cast iron's thermal stability helps maintain the engine's structural integrity and consistent operating temperatures. This is especially beneficial in cold weather starts, as cast iron retains heat longer.
• Tolerance to Stress and Boost: Iron blocks are inherently better at handling large amounts of power, including significant boost from turbochargers or superchargers. Their rigidity means less distortion under extreme cylinder pressures, leading to better ring seal and potentially more power output in high-stress situations. The margin of error is also larger with an iron block; what might be a minor issue in an iron block could be catastrophic in an aluminum one.

While aluminum offers advantages like lighter weight (improving fuel economy and overall vehicle dynamics) and better heat dissipation (preventing overheating in some scenarios), these benefits are often outweighed by the need for maximum durability, strength, and cost-effectiveness in the heavy-duty truck segment. For passenger cars and lighter-duty vehicles, aluminum blocks are far more common due to their weight-saving advantages and the less extreme demands placed on the engine.

 

[WXman]

Some guys just don't get it. The Hurricane makes BIG power from only 3 liters. How? By stuffing BIG air into the cylinders. This excessive pressure WILL wear the engine out faster than a larger engine that doesn't have to work as hard. It's not up for debate. The laws of physics don't take a break.

I have a buddy who's been a Ford master tech for 25 years now. He bought a new Ford truck a few years back and went with the V8. I asked him one day why he didn't get an EcoBoost. His reply: "I work on them all day every day. I don't want to work on them at home too."

These guys with Hurricane engines in their Rams are singing proudly right now, but just wait until it fails outside of warranty and they get that gigantic bill for labor to work on it. It's an over-complicated, too sophisticated, poorly designed engine which is typical of junk from Europe. Great while it's new and running perfectly, not going to be great when it breaks down.

It's like going to the gym. There's the little dude who's on the juice heavy and he's bench pressing 500 lbs. Veins popping out everywhere. People stand around and watch. A few spots over is this big burly looking dude. He's only benching 450 lbs. but he's not breaking a sweat doing it. Yeah, the little dude is putting up more weight.....but he's going to have a heart attack and die before he reaches age 50.

 

[BowDown]

No, you assumed we were talking about the BGE. Your mistake.

Nope, you said 6.4, not the SRT 6.4

 

[BowDown]

Why don't you actually research this instead of spilling nonsense on the forums? For example, TFL interviewed the 7.3 engineers and asked them pretty much point blank why they didn't use the ecoboost; the answer, as I've been saying, "duty cycle" and "mpg".

All the heavy duty engines use iron block v8's. That remains an attraction for the hemi, but if a newer v8 is released in the future with an aluminum block then at that point I'd still purchase that over a tiny turbo.

You keep referring to heavy duty yet the 1500 is not heavy duty so your heavy duty comments are irrelevant and this context. The 1500 is light duty.
You don't see a Cummins 5.9 in the 1500, why? Because that's a heavy duty engine and the 1500 to light duty truck

 

[BowDown]

Some guys just don't get it. The Hurricane makes BIG power from only 3 liters. How? By stuffing BIG air into the cylinders. This excessive pressure WILL wear the engine out faster than a larger engine that doesn't have to work as hard. It's not up for debate. The laws of physics don't take a break.

I have a buddy who's been a Ford master tech for 25 years now. He bought a new Ford truck a few years back and went with the V8. I asked him one day why he didn't get an EcoBoost. His reply: "I work on them all day every day. I don't want to work on them at home too."

These guys with Hurricane engines in their Rams are singing proudly right now, but just wait until it fails outside of warranty and they get that gigantic bill for labor to work on it. It's an over-complicated, too sophisticated, poorly designed engine which is typical of junk from Europe. Great while it's new and running perfectly, not going to be great when it breaks down.

It's like going to the gym. There's the little dude who's on the juice heavy and he's bench pressing 500 lbs. Veins popping out everywhere. People stand around and watch. A few spots over is this big burly looking dude. He's only benching 450 lbs. but he's not breaking a sweat doing it. Yeah, the little dude is putting up more weight.....but he's going to have a heart attack and die before he reaches age 50.

By this forum's own comments, most don't keep a truck more than three to four years so this is completely irrelevant to them.

Secondly, a turbo engine built correctly will last as long as a naturally aspirated engine. They don't use the same components so they can be made to wear the same

 

[StuartV]

Even if we assume equal durability and longevity, I rather like the sound and feel of a V8. That half second 0 to 60 time I can live with.

But that's my own personal preference, the great thing is we all have choice now.

"Half second"?

From what I can tell, comparing Limited or Tungstens (CrewCab, 4x4), the Hemi is good for about 6.4 seconds.

The SST SO is good for 5.0.

The SST HO is good for 4.4.

If the difference was only half a second, I might consider the Hemi again. 2 SECONDS is redonkulous.

A 1500 Limited with a Hemi is just a dog compared to a 1500 Limited with the SST HO.

I had a '19 Hemi and now have a '25 SST HO and can confirm seat of the pants agree with the magazine tests.

470 vs 410 tq is indeed a significant power improvement and something you'll definitely feel in a truck. The HP is that different but HP is for people that dont know. Torque is what's really doing the work and king

Uhhhh, no. Power is what is doing the work. Always.

What people that don't know are "not knowing" is that HP = Torque x RPMs / 5252.

So, when you are taking off from a stop and, for example, turning 2000 RPMs, then the motor with MORE TORQUE AT 2000 RPMs is the motor that is putting down more power AT 2000 RPMs. So, yeah, more torque wins BECAUSE is translates to more power - at that RPM.

That is why, for example, a motorcycle that only puts out 45 ft-lbs, but revs to 13,000 RPMs will smoke a bike with 100 ft-lbs that only revs to 6,000. The bike with 45 is making more power and power is what wins.

People that don't know think "torque" is what is doing the work. People that DO know know that it is the power AT THE RPM you are running at that is what is doing the work.

The Hemi makes its power up high in the RPMs and is relatively gutless in the low and midrange. The SST motors can use their turbos to make boost, and thus torque/power, at lower RPMs while still having a top end that smokes the Hemi. That extra power down in the low/mid range is why even the SST SO gives so much better performance than the Hemi.

Absolutely, I didn't say it wasn't, but half a second 0 to 60 time isn't that big a deal for me, especially when I look at other variables that I find more interesting or better in the long term with a naturally aspirated V8.

As for towing, they both have enough torque to tow almost the same weight, give or take a couple hundred pounds.

I guess we'll see how the sales go and the next couple years with the DT RAM.

Again, with practically the same tow capacity, practically the same MPG, I just don't see the Hemi not outselling the Hurricane with Rams historical fan base.

Half a second is not that big a deal. 2 full seconds is huge.

The reason diesels are better for towing is because they generally make a lot more torque - which means they make more power - at the RPM range that you normally drive in. Going down the road at a steady 2000 RPMs and being able to maintain speed up a slight hill without downshifting is what, for example, an EcoDiesel is good at and a Hemi sucks at. My Hemis would downshift to go up a slight hill even when not towing.

And that is where the SST is going to be significantly better than the Hemi for towing. Even the SST SO is making a lot more power at 2000 RPMs than the Hemi. It's got significantly more peak torque AND makes a lot more torque in the low/midrange. I think the towing experience, SST vs Hemi, will not really be very close at all.

And, yes, the Hemi might outsell the SST among RAM's historical fan base. But, among all RAM truck buyers? I think the Hemi is going to have such a low uptake that it will be off the market again after 2, maybe 3, years.

Personally, if I bought a brand new 1500 in a higher trim, like a Limited, Longhorn, or Tungsten, I would be totally embarrassed to be driving a Hemi and getting smoked at lights by somebody in a Big Horn with an SST SO.

I have only been driving RAM trucks since 2009 when I switched away from Ford (after almost 20 years of nothing but), so I don't consider myself a long-time RAM loyalist. To ME, RAM and Hemi always stood for leadership in innovation AND performance. The Hemi WAS King. Now, it's going to be 3rd out of 4 in the RAM lineup and 2nd out of 3 in the list of trucks with V8's from the big 3. Definitely not how I think (or thought) of RAM trucks.

 

[StuartV]

Some guys just don't get it. The Hurricane makes BIG power from only 3 liters. How? By stuffing BIG air into the cylinders. This excessive pressure WILL wear the engine out faster than a larger engine that doesn't have to work as hard. It's not up for debate. The laws of physics don't take a break.

Exactly. That's why those older cast-iron Harley motors would last SO much longer than the new-fangled Honda motors with aluminum blocks that are making twice the power with 1/3 less displacement.

Superior engineering will never get a smaller turbocharged aluminum motor to last longer than an old design with a cast iron block.

</sarcasm>

 

[SD Rebel]

"Half second"?

From what I can tell, comparing Limited or Tungstens (CrewCab, 4x4), the Hemi is good for about 6.4 seconds.

The SST SO is good for 5.0.

The SST HO is good for 4.4.

If the difference was only half a second, I might consider the Hemi again. 2 SECONDS is redonkulous.

A 1500 Limited with a Hemi is just a dog compared to a 1500 Limited with the SST HO.

I had a '19 Hemi and now have a '25 SST HO and can confirm seat of the pants agree with the magazine tests.

Well, half a second was clearly a little biased flippant response by me, but I've seen closer to 1 sec between the two 0-60, typically 6.1 vs 5.0. Even if the delta is closer to 1-1.5 seconds between the 5.7L and 3.0 SO, I'm still fine with it.

I've driven both, and even defended the Hurricane as a fine engine and important in RAMs lineup, however I wouldn't choose one for my own personal preference.

 

[StuartV]

Well, half a second was clearly a little biased flippant response by me, but I've seen closer to 1 sec between the two 0-60, typically 6.1 vs 5.0. Even if the delta is closer to 1-1.5 seconds between the 5.7L and 3.0 SO, I'm still fine with it.

I've driven both, and even defended the Hurricane as a fine engine and important in RAMs lineup, however I wouldn't choose one for my own personal preference.

No worries. In the end, all that matters is what makes us each happy.

I put 265,000 miles on Hemis. I had the exhaust leak repair done at least 6 or 7 times. The motor always seemed like a ... "modest" performer, to me. With poor fuel economy. And, it's loud when it's working hard.

I like performance. I like quiet performance even better. And I especially do NOT like the combo of loud AND poor performance. When I hear loud trucks, cars or motorcycles, and I see that they are loud and STILL slow, I just have to shake my head.

If I want to hear a glorious engine note, I will get on my 1301cc V-twin motorcycle, which is also fast AF. No concern there about being all bark and no bite.

As my grandmother used to tell me, that's why there's chocolate and vanilla.

 

[Ramroo]

Everyone has some good opinions on Hemi and Hurricane.

I think the V8 people have a valid argument on longevity of that motor. But the E torque with that motor negates that argument IMO. You can’t find parts as it is, and as these E torques and components age and if Hemi goes away, you’re going to be broke for a while.

Old school guys, find a non ET V8, stare straight ahead at stop lights and keep that dog till your kids take yours keys away.

 

[SD Rebel]

No worries. In the end, all that matters is what makes us each happy.

I put 265,000 miles on Hemis. I had the exhaust leak repair done at least 6 or 7 times. The motor always seemed like a ... "modest" performer, to me. With poor fuel economy. And, it's loud when it's working hard.

I like performance. I like quiet performance even better. And I especially do NOT like the combo of loud AND poor performance. When I hear loud trucks, cars or motorcycles, and I see that they are loud and STILL slow, I just have to shake my head.

If I want to hear a glorious engine note, I will get on my 1301cc V-twin motorcycle, which is also fast AF. No concern there about being all bark and no bite.

As my grandmother used to tell me, that's why there's chocolate and vanilla.

I get you for sure, too loud and slow isn't great. Though mild with a nice sound, I can get behind that, give me a sense of occasion while I drive my mundane daily driver!

For speed, I have my E90 M3 and bikes (SV650S, Buell 1125R) both V-Twins, though none of those are exactly quiet anymore.

 

[BowDown]

No worries. In the end, all that matters is what makes us each happy.

I put 265,000 miles on Hemis. I had the exhaust leak repair done at least 6 or 7 times. The motor always seemed like a ... "modest" performer, to me. With poor fuel economy. And, it's loud when it's working hard.

I like performance. I like quiet performance even better. And I especially do NOT like the combo of loud AND poor performance. When I hear loud trucks, cars or motorcycles, and I see that they are loud and STILL slow, I just have to shake my head.

If I want to hear a glorious engine note, I will get on my 1301cc V-twin motorcycle, which is also fast AF. No concern there about being all bark and no bite.

As my grandmother used to tell me, that's why there's chocolate and vanilla.

As have I, 277K on my 2003 and 93k on this truck. Would I have bought a 1500 (Limited) with the SRT power tuned for a truck? Hell yeas over the 5.7. Would I buy a 1500 with the SRT 6.4 over the HO Hurricane? No because I understand how the 2 will drive and where the usable power is

 

[silver billet]

You keep referring to heavy duty yet the 1500 is not heavy duty so your heavy duty comments are irrelevant and this context. The 1500 is light duty.
You don't see a Cummins 5.9 in the 1500, why? Because that's a heavy duty engine and the 1500 to light duty truck

I've also made the decision to upgrade my shocks to more heavy duty shocks, yet my truck isn't "heavy duty". Imagine that

As for the cummins, they don't build the 5.9 anymore even the 2500. Please keep up. And I'd never purchase the 6.7 because A) it's probably 12k+ CAD over and above the hemi, and B) it has diesel issues which I refuse to get into. The heavy duty gasser is where its at for my towing needs.

 

[silver billet]

Nope, you said 6.4, not the SRT 6.4

I said 6.4. You assumed BGE. This thread has mentioned both of them several times. Now that it has been made very clear to you which engine I am referring to, maybe you can move on and stop arguing completely inane points.