Bye Bye Mopar muscle cars

[SD Rebel]

It just goes to show EVERYONE with a single functioning brain cell that it's all a political game at our expense

Yup!

I don't even think for many of these politicians they even truly care about what they say or do, it's about the money and power and probably all in on it.

 

[Mystic Rhythms]

Good points, though I wouldn't say ICE vehicles will be more expensive to run in the future, we don't know that yet, and it could take decades before EVs make up the majority of the car population.

In Washington state the Gov has signed a bill that you cannot license a new vehicle with a gas motor after 2030.
Assuming this isn't delayed that will push more people toward EVs, whether they are ready or not.

 

[SD Rebel]

In Washington state the Gov has signed a bill that you cannot license a new vehicle with a gas motor after 2030.
Assuming this isn't delayed that will push more people toward EVs, whether they are ready or not.

Actually that's pretty much Global, the 2030 and 2035 year where no new vehicles can be sold that are ICE. Most manufacturers have already stated they will be in compliance even before then.

However, that doesn't ban existing combustion vehicles already produced. It will take decades (after 2030/2034) before EVs actually overtake the majority of vehicles on the road in terms of numbers. People who aren't ready aren't going to be left without vehicle options.

 

[silver64]

They aren't forcing everyone to drive EV by 2030, they are forcing the stop sale of new ICE vehicles. More affordable gas vehicles already on the road won't go away for many years after that and EVs should come down in price by then, including batteries.

Though manufacturers prefer you buy a new vehicle and recycle your old one. They wanted that now as well, which is why German manufactures make their cars so expensive to repair after 7 years of so. They want them so expensive to repair you buy a new car and send yours to the scrap heap to be recycled. Though in reality, it will end up in some poor college students hands who thought driving around in a late model Audi would be cool, until the first big repair comes along.

Maybe consider another possibility, that EVs cut down on repairs/maintenance in the life of a vehicle, with modern battery technology and production of scale, should be get a lot cheaper in the future. I don't know honestly, it could go either way.

It is behavior modification via government regulation which forces people into eventually buying an EV. That IS forcing people to buy a product they don't want. Its not the market driving consumers to run to EV's because they are so wonderful. The government pushing this is never good for consumers or low income people. We will have twice the cars in the junk yard than we have today not to mention all the other effects of this bad idea. Power grids unable to support every neighborhoods power demands in the hottest of summers and the pollution effect of lithium mining. Not to mention the fire departments who don't have the foam needed to extinguish EV battery fires and then submerge the cars in water for several days so they don't reignite. There's so many bad things about EV's that people blind themselves to its incredible. We have been dealing with ICE engines and have perfected them over the last 100 plus years and strapped enough anti pollution apparatus on them so that they don't pollute anything like they used too. The only reason to push people in the EV direction is the government deciding its a good idea and I can count on one hand good government ideas that really benefitted regular Americans. Sermon over!

 

[silver64]

Actually that's pretty much Global, the 2030 and 2035 year where no new vehicles can be sold that are ICE. Most manufacturers have already stated they will be in compliance even before then.

However, that doesn't ban existing combustion vehicles already produced. It will take decades (after 2030/2034) before EVs actually overtake the majority of vehicles on the road in terms of numbers. People who aren't ready aren't going to be left without vehicle options.

Germany has already stated they will continue to allow ICE engines and most other European countries will follow suit. None of them have the infrastructure to support an all EV environment.

 

[SD Rebel]

Germany has already stated they will continue to allow ICE engines and most other European countries will follow suit. None of them have the infrastructure to support an all EV environment.

That would be cool if they follow, though I haven't read that yet. Germany originally mandated earlier than any country to be full EV by 2030, then recently change it to 2045.

Targets can change, hopefully for the better in this example. UK is still 2032, France is still 2035 for example. Italy however has been wanting to delay it until 2040, instead of the EU plan of 2035.

 

[SD Rebel]

It is behavior modification via government regulation which forces people into eventually buying an EV. That IS forcing people to buy a product they don't want. Its not the market driving consumers to run to EV's because they are so wonderful. The government pushing this is never good for consumers or low income people. We will have twice the cars in the junk yard than we have today not to mention all the other effects of this bad idea. Power grids unable to support every neighborhoods power demands in the hottest of summers and the pollution effect of lithium mining. Not to mention the fire departments who don't have the foam needed to extinguish EV battery fires and then submerge the cars in water for several days so they don't reignite. There's so many bad things about EV's that people blind themselves to its incredible. We have been dealing with ICE engines and have perfected them over the last 100 plus years and strapped enough anti pollution apparatus on them so that they don't pollute anything like they used too. The only reason to push people in the EV direction is the government deciding its a good idea and I can count on one hand good government ideas that really benefitted regular Americans. Sermon over!

Forcing is making me have to buy an EV. I don't have to buy an EV now or in the future if I don't want to, at least with the current rules. I understand your point however on regulations, but in the end, I don't have gun to my head or the financial incentives to do otherwise, at least not yet.

I'm 47 years old, I have a relatively new truck and plenty of cars (and many on the used market after 2035) that would easily last my lifetime of driving. That being said, if they decide to force me by making fuel prices too high and making it too expensive to register and own a ICE vehicle, then we got an issue. However, things are just one administration away from changing if push comes to shove.

I agree with you on pollution, it's not an improvement over fossil fuels.

 

[Klink]

Forcing is making me have to buy an EV. I don't have to buy an EV now or in the future if I don't want to, at least with the current rules. I understand your point however on regulations, but in the end, I don't have gun to my head or the financial incentives to do otherwise, at least not yet.

I'm 47 years old, I have a relatively new truck and plenty of cars (and many on the used market after 2035) that would easily last my lifetime of driving. That being said, if they decide to force me by making fuel prices too high and making it too expensive to register and own a ICE vehicle, then we got an issue. However, things are just one administration away from changing if push comes to shove.

I agree with you on pollution, it's not an improvement over fossil fuels.

I hear where you are coming from, but you just made silver's point.

 

[SD Rebel]

I hear where you are coming from, but you just made silver's point.

Absolutely. I'm not black and white on this. Globally, countries are targeting 2030 & 2035 to end ICE new car sales, including manufacturers, however it's a flexible on-going thing, it could change again tomorrow.

Germany and Italy are just two countries, and the EU hasn't actually changed their targets for 2035, yet.

A regime change in the US could change everything, as early as the next couple of elections.

 

[Klink]

Absolutely. I'm not black and white on this. Globally, countries are targeting 2030 & 2035 to end ICE new car sales, including manufacturers, however it's a flexible on-going thing, it could change again tomorrow.

Germany and Italy are just two countries, and the EU hasn't actually changed their targets for 2035, yet.

A regime change in the US could change everything, as early as the next couple of elections.

Let's hope and pray we get the regime change. For so many reasons, not just automotive.

 

[SD Rebel]

Let's hope and pray we get the regime change. For so many reasons, not just automotive.

Lets hope so. We also need the manufacturers on-board, they spent billions on the current plan, not just in the US but globally, they will want synergy for overall production.

That being said, there are manufacturers who have changed their tune towards synthetic fuels, which if cost can be brought down, would likely be a better alternative to EVs.

 

[djevox]

Start watching at the 10 minute mark to see the actual car. The exhaust note is interesting.

That video was hilarious when the electric car was “revving”. Personal opinion: That “exhaust” tone is offensive. To me, it screams the inevitable death of the American muscle car.

Great, but how are we going to argue about catch cans, which weight motor oil, when to change the plugs, throttle bodies, exhaust, cold air intakes, etc.? This is a sad day for keyboard warriors and know-it-alls

Maybe we can tout the source of the electricity, renewable vs. carbon based, my electrons are cleaner than your electrons kind of thing.

Don’t worry, we can argue different wire weaves, sizing, gold plated connectors, and how much better v8’s were to people almost half our age.

 

[Dewey]

That video was hilarious when the electric car was “revving”. Personal opinion: That “exhaust” tone is offensive. To me, it screams the inevitable death of the American muscle car.

Don’t worry, we can argue different wire weaves, sizing, gold plated connectors, and how much better v8’s were to people almost half our age.

I agree. When he said it’s as loud as the Hellcat I got a chuckle out of that. Maybe it’s loud but that’s where the comparison ends. Offensive is the right word. Interesting was a poor choice of words from me.

The car looks fine but I would rather see them go in a different direction and jam a 426 Hemi under the hood.

 

[silver64]

I agree. When he said it’s as loud as the Hellcat I got a chuckle out of that. Maybe it’s loud but that’s where the comparison ends. Offensive is the right word. Interesting was a poor choice of words from me.

The car looks fine but I would rather see them go in a different direction and jam a 426 Hemi under the hood.

yeah a screaming Monkey is loud and so is a lions roar but I'm pretty sure you can figure out which one is more intimidating!

 

[Dewey]

For future reference this is what a real car sounds like.

 

[djevox]

For future reference this is what a real car sounds like.

The Gov’t tells me that’s wrong, so I’m offended by that video. Cancel it now….

 

[Dewey]

California to ban the sale of new gasoline cars.

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[SD Rebel]

California to ban the sale of new gasoline cars.

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The 2035 ban on sale of new gas cars isn't just a California thing and most manufacturers have already stated they won't be making any ICE cars well before then.

 

[Dewey]

The 2035 ban on sale of new gas cars isn't just a California thing and most manufacturers have already stated they won't be making any ICE cars well before then.

Good thing we can still buy used. Unfortunately that will take the used vehicle market to way worse levels than we have already. I can’t even imagine. Good thing is when Republicans take over again everything will flip as usual. Maybe Dodge will then make REAL Hellcats again.

 

[SD Rebel]

Good thing we can still buy used. Unfortunately that will take the used vehicle market to way worse levels than we have already. I can’t even imagine. Good thing is when Republicans take over again everything will flip as usual. Maybe Dodge will then make REAL Hellcats again.

We are just two elections away!