Recommended vs REQUIRED oil spec

[NewLove]

What timing.

Decided to do my first oil change this weekend. At my 4th stop, I finally found the Pennzoil Euro 5/40 and it was the only oil I could find stamped MS-12991.

Problem was: they had one, single quart on the rack. I went up to the counter and asked if they were getting any more and the parts guy laughed and said "oh yeah, we have cases and cases in the back. The Dodge dealer buys so much of this stuff. Say it's required for warranty."

Now that's just an anecdotal story from some guy on the internet, but let me tell you... after hearing that from some random guy that has zero skin in the game sitting behind a parts counter, I'm going to stick with putting only MS-12991 in my pickup... clearly the local dealer has made their decision and I wouldn't want to be on the other end of a claim doing something different from what they have decided.

There’s not many that have it stamped on the product.


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[Aseras]

The Dodge dealer buys so much of this stuff. Say it's required for warranty."

I mean its good the dealer is using the right oil, but wtf are they buying it at retail? Even with a hefty discount and no tax it is way cheaper to buy it by the drum for a dealership that has the volume to support it.

 

[Boston]

What timing.

Decided to do my first oil change this weekend. At my 4th stop, I finally found the Pennzoil Euro 5/40 and it was the only oil I could find stamped MS-12991.

Problem was: they had one, single quart on the rack. I went up to the counter and asked if they were getting any more and the parts guy laughed and said "oh yeah, we have cases and cases in the back. The Dodge dealer buys so much of this stuff. Say it's required for warranty."

Now that's just an anecdotal story from some guy on the internet, but let me tell you... after hearing that from some random guy that has zero skin in the game sitting behind a parts counter, I'm going to stick with putting only MS-12991 in my pickup... clearly the local dealer has made their decision and I wouldn't want to be on the other end of a claim doing something different from what they have decided.

That's exactly the only Hangup I have about the ecodiesel. Being confident enough to have a dealership that sees enough of them to know what oil to put in.
They don't sell many diesel 1500 in boston area so how deep is the well of knowledge when it's time for servicing?
I really do wonder how many of the prior gen engine failures were caused by dealer using wrong oil.

Fwiw there are similar threads on the right oil to use that meets the same standard also used in other Fiat products. These threads while three years old can get real nasty https://www.124spider.org/threads/oil-filter-master-thread.15041/

 

[alamgirian6329]

That's exactly the only Hangup I have about the ecodiesel. Being confident enough to have a dealership that sees enough of them to know what oil to put in.
They don't sell many diesel 1500 in boston area so how deep is the well of knowledge when it's time for servicing?
I really do wonder how many of the prior gen engine failures were caused by dealer using wrong oil.

Fwiw there are similar threads on the right oil to use that meets the same standard also used in other Fiat products. These threads while three years old can get real nasty https://www.124spider.org/threads/oil-filter-master-thread.15041/

the service advisor was visibly upsetat my dealer in Mass - when I was being picky about Engine oil - allI got was , “We will use whatever factory suggests”.
I just happened to randomly see the tech through glass window lining up Rotella bottles - so then I had service advisor stop - research and indeed confirm that Rotella recommendation was outdated. He was geniunely apologetic but already had told me earlier “Its a $28000 job to swap yhe motor in these, so we will be putting what factory recommends”

so then he blamed (rightfully so, I might add) Chrysler/RAM not making it clear to dealers what Oil to use. He said he put a note on my VIN/Truck to use only right oil there on out.
I have picked 4 oil changes worth of Penzoil Platinum MS12991 oil from 6-7 diff NAPA stores.
I wonder if dealer will change oil with my oil and if I provide filters - how much would they charge.
Obv Ill keep receipt of my oil (one receipt per 12 quarts) for warranty.

 

[NewLove]

I just bought Amsoil Euro. It exceeds all factory Recommendations.


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[md-lucky]

I just bought Amsoil Euro. It exceeds all factory Recommendations.


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Which one?

On their website neither 5/40 option shows MS-12991...

 

[Aseras]

Amsoil reps have said that the MS-129991 spec is backwards and stupid compared to what FCA claims it is for. Most of the oils that meet the spec are high SAPS crap oils that should have no business being put in a diesel with a DPF.

 

[NewLove]

Which one?

On their website neither 5/40 option shows MS-12991...

SAE 5W-40 FS Synthetic European Motor Oil

Shop SAE 5W-40 FS Synthetic European Motor Oil at AMSOIL. Find premium synthetic oil, filters and more online. Fast, free shipping available.

www.amsoil.com

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[WXman]

I found another good oil. Castrol Edge 5W40 is a low-mid SAPS oil (1.15% which is right on the threshold of being classified as low SAPS), meets the API SN requirement, and is $22 for 5 quarts at my local Walmart.

https://msdspds.castrol.com/bpglis/FusionPDS.nsf/Files/C63EE5E2EB1E5ECC80258324003C196B/$File/BPXE-AFNM4W.pdf

 

[md-lucky]

I appreciate what the Amsoil reps "said," but that link clearly doesn't have the MS-12991.

Unless the Amsoil reps are willing to stroke the check if FCA denies a warranty claim for not meeting their requirements I don't think I would run it.

 

[NewLove]

I appreciate what the Amsoil reps "said," but that link clearly doesn't have the MS-12991.

Unless the Amsoil reps are willing to stroke the check if FCA denies a warranty claim for not meeting their requirements I don't think I would run it.

Personally think that the MS1299... is just a marketing tactic for FCA


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[NewLove]

It just needs to have the API SN certification


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[Boston]

the service advisor was visibly upsetat my dealer in Mass - when I was being picky about Engine oil - allI got was , “We will use whatever factory suggests”.
I just happened to randomly see the tech through glass window lining up Rotella bottles - so then I had service advisor stop - research and indeed confirm that Rotella recommendation was outdated. He was geniunely apologetic but already had told me earlier “Its a $28000 job to swap yhe motor in these, so we will be putting what factory recommends”

so then he blamed (rightfully so, I might add) Chrysler/RAM not making it clear to dealers what Oil to use. He said he put a note on my VIN/Truck to use only right oil there on out.
I have picked 4 oil changes worth of Penzoil Platinum MS12991 oil from 6-7 diff NAPA stores.
I wonder if dealer will change oil with my oil and if I provide filters - how much would they charge.
Obv Ill keep receipt of my oil (one receipt per 12 quarts) for warranty.

I spend more time than ever in the Carolinas where diesels are way more common and every other HD truck is Cummins powered.

 

[Potown]

This could be a helpful link:

https://www.dealers-mopar.com/resources/pdf/chemical/chemical-catalog.pdf

 

[Funeman]

Just had this pop up on my watch list in Amazon. Meets the 12991 and API specs, even though I'm getting the warning at the top of the page that it doesn't fit my 2020 Ram 1500. Anyone have experience with Valvoline Euro? https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07ZCQWMWS/?coliid=IIV1V2Y6QXVUL&colid=211RYHIMFMKOV&psc=1

 

[WXman]

Just had this pop up on my watch list in Amazon. Meets the 12991 and API specs, even though I'm getting the warning at the top of the page that it doesn't fit my 2020 Ram 1500. Anyone have experience with Valvoline Euro? https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07ZCQWMWS/?coliid=IIV1V2Y6QXVUL&colid=211RYHIMFMKOV&psc=1

Post #63 in this thread:

Conflicting Oil Standards in Owners Manual

Where the hell can we buy the oil we need in 5 quart jugs? https://www.walmart.com/ip/9-Pack-Valvoline-Advanced-Full-Synthetic-SAE-5W-40-MST-Motor-Oil-1-Quart/550176332?variantFieldId=multipack_quantity The 9-pack will do an oil change on these Gen 3 trucks.

5thgenrams.com

Note that the "MST" branding is being replaced by "European Vehicle" branding on the bottles, so some labels have MS-12991 listed on them and some don't, but it's the oil I started using a long while ago and Valvoline told me they're updating their spec sheets soon and they stand behind this oil for our application.

 

[Potown]

Kind of a cool video on different oil types. Seems like Amsoil is top of the pack.

 

[Aseras]

It just needs to have the API SN certification


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SN, all the api S specs are gasoline engine specs. Diesel Engines specs are C and F specs.

Oil Categories

The American Petroleum Institute (API) is the only national trade association that represents all aspects of America’s oil and natural gas industry. Our more than 600 corporate members, from the largest major oil company to the smallest of independents, come from all segments of the industry.

www.api.org

FCA has morons writing the manuals.

 

[EugeneYYZ]

SN, all the api S specs are gasoline engine specs. Diesel Engines specs are C and F specs.

Oil Categories

The American Petroleum Institute (API) is the only national trade association that represents all aspects of America’s oil and natural gas industry. Our more than 600 corporate members, from the largest major oil company to the smallest of independents, come from all segments of the industry.

www.api.org

FCA has morons writing the manuals.

They just "working there" they dont using their brains and curiosity

 

[Funeman]

Post #63 in this thread:

Conflicting Oil Standards in Owners Manual

Where the hell can we buy the oil we need in 5 quart jugs? https://www.walmart.com/ip/9-Pack-Valvoline-Advanced-Full-Synthetic-SAE-5W-40-MST-Motor-Oil-1-Quart/550176332?variantFieldId=multipack_quantity The 9-pack will do an oil change on these Gen 3 trucks.

5thgenrams.com

Note that the "MST" branding is being replaced by "European Vehicle" branding on the bottles, so some labels have MS-12991 listed on them and some don't, but it's the oil I started using a long while ago and Valvoline told me they're updating their spec sheets soon and they stand behind this oil for our

Post #63 in this thread:

Conflicting Oil Standards in Owners Manual

Where the hell can we buy the oil we need in 5 quart jugs? https://www.walmart.com/ip/9-Pack-Valvoline-Advanced-Full-Synthetic-SAE-5W-40-MST-Motor-Oil-1-Quart/550176332?variantFieldId=multipack_quantity The 9-pack will do an oil change on these Gen 3 trucks.

5thgenrams.com

Note that the "MST" branding is being replaced by "European Vehicle" branding on the bottles, so some labels have MS-12991 listed on them and some don't, but it's the oil I started using a long while ago and Valvoline told me they're updating their spec sheets soon and they stand behind this oil for our application.

Just followed up with Valvoline via the question and answer section of their listing in Amazon and they're now saying it does NOT meet specifications for MS-12991. Ridiculous that 3 or 4 months ago it did, but now suddenly it doesn't. I pasted the response to my question which is showing up on the Q&A for the 5L bottle.

"A: Unfortunately, the Valvoline - 881166 European Vehicle Full Synthetic SAE 5W-40 Motor Oil does not meet the MS-12991 specification. Please give us a call at 800-832-6825 x5 for a recommendation of the appropriate oil.
By Valvoline Product Support on February 8, 2021"

Guess I have to find something new now since I didn't buy a supply of the bottles when it did in fact have the MS-12991 standard on the label.