Ramcares repair scam\fraud

[BowDown]

My 2020 with 30k miles, many of those in gravel roads, didn't have hardly any rock chips when I took it off for the off-road bumper.

Gravel roads with traffic Infront of you and approaching throwing up rocks? Simply driving down the road isn't going to produce this type of damage.
No paint will stand up to rock strikes, I stand by that 1000%

 

[HSKR R/T]

You drove down a gravel road.... how would you get paint damage on the front of your truck? Gravel doesn't travel forward does it?

Unless you were driving too close to the car in front of you.

You obviously don't travel gravel roads, or the highways they intersect with.

 

[HSKR R/T]

Gravel roads with traffic Infront of you and approaching throwing up rocks? Simply driving down the road isn't going to produce this type of damage.
No paint will stand up to rock strikes, I stand by that 1000%

Well, I'm not the only vehicle that drives in gravel roads. I didn't feel it was needed to go into that much detail. As anyone who travels gravel roads would simply realize it's a given.

 

[Darksteel165]

A majority of the chips on my BackCountry came this past winter from rock salt on the freeway getting kicked up from vehicles or bouncing down the road behind a salt truck. At 70-80 mph it’s unavoidable.

I touched them all up with a Dr Colorchip kit a few months ago and been good since. I’ll touch them up as needed. I would never expect a painted bumper to remain chip free forever. Only permanent solution is wrap them.

Salt went through your paint?
I was touching up my bumper every other week. I think I filled between 30-50 chips.
The picture I posted was just from the winter months because I didn't want to go outside in the freezing cold and use touch-up paint

You drove down a gravel road.... how would you get paint damage on the front of your truck? Gravel doesn't travel forward does it?

Unless you were driving too close to the car in front of you.

I could be mistaken but I think that's kind of his point. I have never driven on a gravel road, or anything except pavement so how could I have over 150 "rock chips". I would of needed to spend my entire time driving 5 feet behind people to chip my bumper but not my hood for 99% of my driving time. Just doesn't make sense to me.

I also don't drive behind people, I hate people I want to be nowhere near them. I either go close to the limit on cruise control so people fly by me, or I go 9 over the limit and fly by others. I don't just sit behind people when driving ever.

 

[Dewey]

Salt went through your paint?
I was touching up my bumper every other week. I think I filled between 30-50 chips.
The picture I posted was just from the winter months because I didn't want to go outside in the freezing cold and use touch-up paint


I could be mistaken but I think that's kind of his point. I have never driven on a gravel road, or anything except pavement so how could I have over 150 "rock chips". I would of needed to spend my entire time driving 5 feet behind people to chip my bumper but not my hood for 99% of my driving time. Just doesn't make sense to me.

I also don't drive behind people, I hate people I want to be nowhere near them. I either go close to the limit on cruise control so people fly by me, or I go 9 over the limit and fly by others. I don't just sit behind people when driving ever.

Large rock salt chipped the paint just like a stone would. After a 600 mile road trip in a snow storm for 450 miles of that trip is where most of my chips happened.

I have a heated garage so touching up chips isn’t really a big deal. Not my idea of fun but I expected it with a painted steel bumper.

 

[BowDown]

Well, I'm not the only vehicle that drives in gravel roads. I didn't feel it was needed to go into that much detail. As anyone who travels gravel roads would simply realize it's a given.

I went off what you said without any assumptions, that said, I painted cars for 10 years, to my knowledge, there's no paint that will stand up to that abuse, not even powder coating, which isn't paint, will tolerate that. So the fact that you state that you have little damage suggests that there's not much traffic on that road or it isn't traveled frequently or traveled at speeds greater than 15-20mph or there's few vehicles travelling close Infront of you or you have a StarTrek deflector shield around your truck when on gravel roads with traffic.

What's being asked and expected of paint on a steel bumper that's subjected to rocks in this thread simply isn't reasonable or possible.

 

[HSKR R/T]

I went off what you said without any assumptions, that said, I painted cars for 10 years, to my knowledge, there's no paint that will stand up to that abuse, not even powder coating, which isn't paint, will tolerate that. So the fact that you state that you have little damage suggests that there's not much traffic on that road or it isn't traveled frequently or traveled at speeds greater than 15-20mph or there's few vehicles travelling close Infront of you or you have a StarTrek deflector shield around your truck when on gravel roads with traffic.

What's being asked and expected of paint on a steel bumper that's subjected to rocks in this thread simply isn't reasonable or possible.

Or that you don't travel gravel roads to have an opinion

 

[OCD Solutions]

Well the OP says he hasn’t driven any gravel roads so that point is kinda moot isn’t it.


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[Cbty2050]

Or that you don't travel gravel roads to have an opinion

You deserve chips in your paint if you drive that close to someone on a gravel road.

 

[theblet]

You deserve chips in your paint if you drive that close to someone on a gravel road.

or a boot in the @ss

 

[BowDown]

Or that you don't travel gravel roads to have an opinion

Nope, wrong and wrong. Driven down plenty of gravel roads just have enough sense not to drive fast and not to drive close to traffic. Now if there's an option for a paved road versus a gravel road yeah I'm taking the pave road even if it's a tad bit longer.

You're welcome to your opinion on rocks versus paint on a steel bumper but it doesn't change the fact.
This is not a paint defect, this is not a warrantable issue and I side with RAM on the outcome of this.

Now if they told him they were going to cover it and then switched midstream, that's BS either you say you're going to cover it and you do or you say you're not going to cover it and you don't however asking for something like this to be under warranty isn't realistic.

 

[BowDown]

or a boot in the @ss

Boot in the box

 

[Darksteel165]

Now if they told him they were going to cover it and then switched midstream, that's BS either you say you're going to cover it and you do or you say you're not going to cover it and you don't however asking for something like this to be under warranty isn't realistic.

That's the entire point of the thread if you actually read it. They told me it would be covered, then a week before bringing it in I called to make sure it still would be covered and told and emailed it was. Then after the repair they (different department and person) changed their minds and said not covered.

My bumper shouldn't look like this in 10 months of driving on solid roads not tailgating people.

They already knew I was going to buy an aftermarket bumper if they were not going to cover it as the paint job was estimated at $1700.

Corporate made it right in a 15 minute phone call, just waiting for my check now. This is when Ram customer support refused to even talk to me about the case as the cases were "closed" or "suspended"

 

[HSKR R/T]

Nope, wrong and wrong. Driven down plenty of gravel roads just have enough sense not to drive fast and not to drive close to traffic. Now if there's an option for a paved road versus a gravel road yeah I'm taking the pave road even if it's a tad bit longer.

You're welcome to your opinion on rocks versus paint on a steel bumper but it doesn't change the fact.
This is not a paint defect, this is not a warrantable issue and I side with RAM on the outcome of this.

Now if they told him they were going to cover it and then switched midstream, that's BS either you say you're going to cover it and you do or you say you're not going to cover it and you don't however asking for something like this to be under warranty isn't realistic.

Nobody ever said I was tailgating people on gravel roads, and the point was, I travel gravel roads, my parents love on a gravel road, and don't have near as many chips. I like how you assume the way I drive, and how close I am to other vehicles, simply because I made a simple comment about driving gravel roads. But hey, you're the expert here, obviously. What the hell do I know. It's not like I grew up in rural areas driving primarily gravel roads. Stick to the pavement and let those who know how to drive handle the gravel.

 

[BowDown]

That's the entire point of the thread if you actually read it. They told me it would be covered, then a week before bringing it in I called to make sure it still would be covered and told and emailed it was. Then after the repair they (different department and person) changed their minds and said not covered.

My bumper shouldn't look like this in 10 months of driving on solid roads not tailgating people.

They already knew I was going to buy an aftermarket bumper if they were not going to cover it as the paint job was estimated at $1700.

Corporate made it right in a 15 minute phone call, just waiting for my check now. This is when Ram customer support refused to even talk to me about the case as the cases were "closed" or "suspended"

I did read it and that's why I made the point however the bigger point is this is not defective paint as you claimed, its exactly what the paint shop said, rock chips from rocks. In other words, the original premise that led you to ask FCA/RAM for a remedy was flawed

 

[BowDown]

Nobody ever said I was tailgating people on gravel roads, and the point was, I travel gravel roads, my parents love on a gravel road, and don't have near as many chips. I like how you assume the way I drive, and how close I am to other vehicles, simply because I made a simple comment about driving gravel roads. But hey, you're the expert here, obviously. What the hell do I know. It's not like I grew up in rural areas driving primarily gravel roads. Stick to the pavement and let those who know how to drive handle the gravel.

I didn't assume anything and made that exact comment. You said you drive on a gravel road and didn't have damage, myself and others questioned how you drove however as someone else already pointed out, the OP didn't drive on gravel roads so your comment had zero value relative to the conversation at all.
As to being an expert, no I'm not. What I did was paint cars for 10 years which taught me to easily spot paint flaws. As to gravel road driving, I have a 78 acre farm in Magnolia AR with, guess what? Miles of gravel roads/trails, doesn't take a genius to know how to drive on gravel.

It doesn't take an expert to see this is rock chips and not a paint failure, many here see the same hence the comments. RAM saw it as well as did the shop that actually resprayed the OP's bumper. This isn't a situation where an expert is needed, just common sense but that's left the chat

 

[HSKR R/T]

I didn't assume anything and made that exact comment. You said you drive on a gravel road and didn't have damage, myself and others questioned how you drove however as someone else already pointed out, the OP didn't drive on gravel roads so your comment had zero value relative to the conversation at all.
As to being an expert, no I'm not. What I did was paint cars for 10 years which made me a professional at it, so with that being said and I'm guessing by your comment you believe me to be wrong, exactly which automotive paint is available that is rock chip proof?

It doesn't take an expert to see this is rock chips and not a paint failure, many here see the same hence the comments. RAM saw it as well as did the shop that actually resprayed the OP's bumper. This isn't a situation where an expert is needed, just common sense but that's left the chat

The problem is, he took it to a dealer, explained up front the amount of rock chips was excessive and unacceptable, RAM agreed and said to take it to a body shop for repairs, then renigged after the fact. He wasn't hiding the cause of the damage. Just felt it was excessive for where he drives. And yes, a bad paint job will chip/flake easier than a good one. No, I'm not saying there is paint that won't get rock chips. My mention of traveling gravel roads was anecdotal in that I drove my truck in more "extreme" conditions and didn't have the experience he is having. Meaning, there very well could be an issue with the quality of the paint job on his bumper leading to it chipping easier. I'm sure your "professional "opinion would support that an poor paint job would have more issues than a good one. But, at this point, not sure you would admit that because it would mean agreeing with me.

 

[BowDown]

The problem is, he took it to a dealer, explained up front the amount of rock chips was excessive and unacceptable, RAM agreed and said to take it to a body shop for repairs, then renigged after the fact. He wasn't hiding the cause of the damage. Just felt it was excessive for where he drives. And yes, a bad paint job will chip/flake easier than a good one. No, I'm not saying there is paint that won't get rock chips. My mention of traveling gravel roads was anecdotal in that I drove my truck in more "extreme" conditions and didn't have the experience he is having. Meaning, there very well could be an issue with the quality of the paint job on his bumper leading to it chipping easier. I'm sure your "professional "opinion would support that an poor paint job would have more issues than a good one. But, at this point, not sure you would admit that because it would mean agreeing with me.

Pretty sure I said that in post 51 and that was the only reason I was in agreement with him in this situation but I'll say it again.
FCA initially denied his claim then subsequently decided to pay it then once he got the work done, they denied it again. I said it in post 51 and I'll say it again, that's bull. You told the man you'd pay the claim, pay the damn claim, period. They shouldn't have changed their minds so that's on them. I can separate the 2 situations and speak to both which is what I did and IMO, correctly.

As to the quality of his paint job, the pics he has shown look like rock strikes, not a failure in paint adhesion.

This is a rock chip IMO

This is poor surface prep and paint adhesion failure, why? too many relatively straight lines. Paint has come off below the headlight as well which eliminates the possibility of something striking it. There appears to be no sealer on the part nor any flex agent in the paint or clear given the relatively straight lines. This looks like a service king half donkey job to me and by that I mean this part was replaced and repainted by a shop. Service king is notorious for doing work like this and or having your clear completely delaminate from the paint after 2 or 3 years.

The problem with the premise of this being a factory bad paint job is that the paint process is automated and done by robots which means repeatability. It that were indeed the case, more than likely every truck on the line that day, that week would have the same issue however that issue would manifest itself in the form of the 2nd pic, not the 1st.

And yes, a poor paint job would have more issues than a good one (oh S, I agreed with you) but we haven't established that he had a poor point job, have we? The repair shop said it was rock chips, made no mention of a poor paint job.

The shop that repainted the bumper, what did they do? If you and the OP are indeed correct, that shop better had sanded that bumper down to the steel then re-primered with a etching-high build primer then sealed it before repainting because guess what's going to happen if they simply wet sanded the bumper and resprayed?
Give that man a cookie, yep, that "poor factory paint job" is underneath the new good paint job. What happens when you spray paint then get it wet?

 

[Darksteel165]

The shop did sand it all down and primed.
It was 12.2 hours of bodywork and 4.9 hours of painting.

Only 2.4 hours of that 12.2 were marked for other things, such as removal\reinstall etc.

So that's 14.7 hours of actual work to remove the paint, sand, prime, paint, clear, etc.

Also the second dealership told Ram it looked like rock chips, and that was before Ram told me they were going to cover it. There was\is nothing new from when they approved it, and confirmed it was re-approved. Bowdown, bow out.

 

[irishwake63]

The shop did sand it all down and primed.
It was 13.8 hours of bodywork and 4.9 hours of painting.

Only 2.4 hours of that 13.8 were marked for other things, such as removal\reinstall etc.

So that's 16.3 hours of actual work to remove the paint, sand, prime, paint, clear, etc.

Also the second dealership told Ram it looked like rock chips, and that was before Ram told me they were going to cover it. There was\is nothing new from when they approved it, and confirmed it was re-approved. Bowdown, bow out.

all that time for a bumper? Thats crazy