Offroad Group

[arod412]

The factory ORG shocks only have longer travel. They DO NOT increase ride height. It's the ORG springs.

You can't compare factory shocks to aftermarket shocks that have adjustable spring perch settings.

Only way you can prove that is by getting the part number of the springs and compare.

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[HSKR R/T]

Only way you can prove that is by getting the part number of the springs and compare.

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It's been done. There was even a recall for incorrect springs being installed at the factory on the Built to Serve trucks

 

[HSKR R/T]

Here ya go. They replaced springs, not shocks.

 

[arod412]

Here ya go. They replaced springs, not shocks.

Probly had the correct shocks (again...see my pictures..different part numbers for offroad ones) and only had to replace the springs.

Will look closely at the springs that I have to compare non offroad vs offroad because I'm glad I can look at the difference.

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2021 Jeep Wrangler Unlimited Sahara

 

[HSKR R/T]

Probly had the correct shocks (again...see my pictures..different part numbers for offroad ones) and only had to replace the springs.

Will look closely at the springs that I have to compare non offroad vs offroad because I'm glad I can look at the difference.

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Once again, the shock travel is longer, but it does nothing to add to the ride height.

 

[HSKR R/T]

Probly had the correct shocks (again...see my pictures..different part numbers for offroad ones) and only had to replace the springs.

Will look closely at the springs that I have to compare non offroad vs offroad because I'm glad I can look at the difference.

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Or could just be different dampening for off road use compared to standard shocks.

 

[arod412]

Or could just be different dampening for off road use compared to standard shocks.

Could be.

Just by looking at my pictures, I want to measure the bottom half of the strut from the lower control arm to the bottom of the spring...because it looks like the spring sits just a little higher (on the shock) on the offroad package. Obviously I can't measure the spring because it's compressed under weight of the truck. Would confirm if the spring is 1" higher on the shock itself.

I can confirm from my old Laramie "floaty" ride is different compared to my back country ride. Definitely more stiffer from the shocks

Tomorrow I have a couple car meets after work, and offroading Saturday...so I will try to get those numbers

I know it might seem a little obsessed about it...but it's been on my mind to find the difference. Trust me, I'm listening to all of ya...it's good info.

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[djevox]

I'm not disagreeing with you at all. But shocks can give you a lift. You can get a lift different ways. You can always throw in a hockey puck for a 1" lift.

I'm just saying that Bilstein 5100 comes with just shocks. You have to use the stock spring and transfer them over.

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A tophat spacer (I’m assuming that’s what you’re referencing when you say “hockey puck”) is not stock on the vehicle, so I’m not sure why this is even referenced. The person was asking “does ORG have a spring or a shock lift”.

 

[John Galt]

Front and rear. If you get air suspension, the default is set to the 1" lift, and the standard height is eliminated, and it has 4 settings instead of 5.

What a gyp!

 

[djevox]

What a gyp!

They didn’t have a choice with that. If they go higher, the truck will start eating front axles, with the caveat that they are keeping the suspension in a safe middle ground and not at the limits. Their goal is to get millions of trucks out with as few recalls as possible. (or like they did this year with allocating billions to warranty claims)

 

[scottmoyer]

But don't tell me that a shock can't increase height. It can in different position.

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I will clearly say that the shock can't increase ride height. The perch attached to the shock housing allows the stock spring to sit higher or lower, raising or lowering the truck ride height. The shock itself is not doing that. It is still the spring and it's placement.

Trying to manipulate the misunderstanding of a shock versus a spring into "you were right that a shock can provide lift" is comical. The shock absorbs impact. The shock housing may be modified to allow for spring height adjustments, but that is not the function of the shock.

 

[Jake103]

A shock will never increase ride height. Although the shocks may be different as in different dampening, rebound and travle. The coils themselfs give the lift. Its like the old 2001 ram 1500 offroad package back in the day everyone argued how it got a 1" factory lift. If I remember right The offroad package coils were slightly taller than a regular 1500 but they were stiffer resulting in a taller ride height. Same thing with the newer offroad package.

 

[arod412]

I will clearly say that the shock can't increase ride height. The perch attached to the shock housing allows the stock spring to sit higher or lower, raising or lowering the truck ride height. The shock itself is not doing that. It is still the spring and it's placement.

Trying to manipulate the misunderstanding of a shock versus a spring into "you were right that a shock can provide lift" is comical. The shock absorbs impact. The shock housing may be modified to allow for spring height adjustments, but that is not the function of the shock.

Now I'm confused by your statement. Your saying that shocks can't increase height.

But then you state that the spring pearch can sit higher or lower on the shock itself to increase height, but that's not the shock?

That is where I'm confused because that IS the shock moving the placement of the spring higher or lower. That's all what I have been trying to say.

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2021 Jeep Wrangler Unlimited Sahara

 

[arod412]

A shock will never increase ride height. Although the shocks may be different as in different dampening, rebound and travle. The coils themselfs give the lift. Its like the old 2001 ram 1500 offroad package back in the day everyone argued how it got a 1" factory lift. If I remember right The offroad package coils were slightly taller than a regular 1500 but they were stiffer resulting in a taller ride height. Same thing with the newer offroad package.

You can use a smaller spring , and use a shock that has a higher pearch that can give you lift. Not all springs are the same, not all struts are the same...spring placement on the shock is important.

I think that the confusion might be fronts struts, vs rear shocks. They are 2 different things. 100% agree on the rears...it's all springs. Front uses struts so spring placement on shock does play a role...that's what I'm working on.

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[CalvinC]

Are we having a general discussion on suspension componentry, or specifically about the OP's question?

Regarding the latter just to be clear, On coil-spring (non-air ride) trucks, the Off Road Package features differently-tuned shocks front and rear, and an added 1" ride height on both ends courtesy of taller springs.

Discussing the latter... recent threads on the right track. Ultimately all lift comes from the spring. Where a front coil over locates & preloads the spring can influence the impact on the ride height that the spring provides.

 

[HSKR R/T]

You can use a smaller spring , and use a shock that has a higher pearch that can give you lift. Not all springs are the same, not all struts are the same...spring placement on the shock is important.

I think that the confusion might be fronts struts, vs rear shocks. They are 2 different things. 100% agree on the rears...it's all springs. Front uses struts so spring placement on shock does play a role...that's what I'm working on.

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I think the only one confused about the ORP package and how it works is you. You are the only one in this discussion trying to say something different.

 

[arod412]

I think the only one confused about the ORP package and how it works is you. You are the only one in this discussion trying to say something different.

Not confused at all...curious is more like it. I learned alot more when working on my wife jeep, than on my ram. It's alot more simpler setup without struts coming into play. I have already proven what I said and stand by it.

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[CalvinC]

As long as everyone is happy.

 

[arod412]

As long as everyone is happy.
View attachment 159051

Haha love it. I'm more of the type of guy in a room full of people that is the only one that would stand up and ask questions, while everybody else just nodds their head at whatever the speaker says.

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[scottmoyer]

Going back to your first response, "My research shows that part number for front and rear shocks are different from non offroad trims vs off road trims. So the 1" inch is from the shocks."

This is incorrect. You've derailed the original conversation to now include coil overs and aftermarket Bilstein shocks that have the spring perch in different locations allowing for different height adjustments utilizing the same spring. Again, the perch the spring sits in is an attachment to the shock, it is not the function of the shock. Shocks do not give you extra height. The spring perch can based on where it's located.

Bilstein is offering an inexpensive, aftermarket way to get some extra lift without buying new springs, but that is not how the factory worked the 1" provided by the ORG. The springs are different, as are the shocks, to support that extra 1" of extension.