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F-150 Lightning

Biga

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I'm not a big EV fan but this one would be my top pick. I like they kept it looking pretty much like a traditional truck with body on frame and a two piece body design. Some of the others in the pipeline look more like crossovers with the back roof cut off.
 

SpeedyV

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I'm not a big EV fan but this one would be my top pick. I like they kept it looking pretty much like a traditional truck with body on frame and a two piece body design. Some of the others in the pipeline look more like crossovers with the back roof cut off.
I mean, your choices for “serious” EV trucks will soon be…two (Hummer and F-150). It’s early days. But to me, they’re offering a tantalizing glimpse into the near-term potential of EVs.
 

Scram1500

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Moparian

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Until an EV gets 400--500 miles per charge, charging takes roughly the same time as filling up for gas and said charging stations are as abundant as gas stations they will never be accepted by the mainstream driver. Thats not even factoring in the fact that our electric grid isnt anywhere close to being ready to support an entire nation driving EV's.
 

HotHareSpey

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Moparian I disagree. Hybrids and Electric vehicles are very popular in rural areas that are cold or hot. There’s no question it’s money in your pocket.

I bought a 2019 2.0 turbo Accord that gets 30+mpg. I was spending more money on gas driving my RAM than I do owning the Accord as a daily to work and back (120mile RT)

so if I can drive an electric vehicle to work and back and charge it while I’m in the office, it’s a no brainer

I see more hybrids on the road than pickups - and that’s saying something where I live. The next popular vehicle is Jeep Wrangler - and Jeeps new hybrid gets 25mp per charge before gas kicks in. Guess who makes Jeep! Talk about unimpressive and that little kicker set you back at a starting price of 50-60k depending on options
 

mikeru82

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Moparian I disagree. Hybrids and Electric vehicles are very popular in rural areas that are cold or hot. There’s no question it’s money in your pocket.

I bought a 2019 2.0 turbo Accord that gets 30+mpg. I was spending more money on gas driving my RAM than I do owning the Accord as a daily to work and back (120mile RT)

so if I can drive an electric vehicle to work and back and charge it while I’m in the office, it’s a no brainer

I see more hybrids on the road than pickups - and that’s saying something where I live. The next popular vehicle is Jeep Wrangler - and Jeeps new hybrid gets 25mp per charge before gas kicks in. Guess who makes Jeep! Talk about unimpressive and that little kicker set you back at a starting price of 50-60k depending on options
I think you missed the part where Moparian touched on the power grid not being able to support tens of millions of cars being charged nightly, in addition to the normal load that is already present. And people are crying out for the government to stop using dams and coal for power generation. Not to mention the negativity towards nuclear power. Wind mills and solar panels will never be able to replace these forms of power generation. So where will we be getting the electric power to charge all of these EV's?
 

Ram4Lou

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I’m curious about how well the A/C system works and how much drain it has on the overall distance that can be traveled in summer months. Most of my travels are in and between Houston and New Orleans so pretty hot and humid most of the year. What is everyone’s experience with EV A/C performance, especially in traffic?
 

ldoh

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If one can get passed the appearance, the tri-motor cybertruck's 500+mile range at $69,900 is compelling. Some rumors have the final cybertruck design being a bit softer.
 

ldoh

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For me, aside from quality, the most important parts of an EV are the batteries, charging options/network, and automated drive. I think Tesla still has the lead in all areas although GM has closed the automated driving gap.
 

Drewster

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I think you missed the part where Moparian touched on the power grid not being able to support tens of millions of cars being charged nightly, in addition to the normal load that is already present. And people are crying out for the government to stop using dams and coal for power generation. Not to mention the negativity towards nuclear power. Wind mills and solar panels will never be able to replace these forms of power generation. So where will we be getting the electric power to charge all of these EV's?
Electrical Engineer here - millions of vehicles charging overnight, even tens of millions isn't that big of an issue. Especially as more homes get smart meters, the slow and steady draw of overnight charging to recoup one day's driving is far less than kicking your Air Conditioning, electric water heater, etc. Even today, Tesla and GM vehicles can work with smart meters or have settings to charge in off-peak hours. Recharging 8 hours to top off your battery from a 30 mile commute is not the same as trying to recharge the entire capacity of the battery in a hurry.

The problem is getting infrastructure for fast charging out in the boonies. To charge an EV quickly you need several hundred kW of power, and getting high power transmission lines out to an old, dusty gas station on Route 66 is a tall order. We'll likely see solar panels/ batteries for the immediate need, which will get more and more interesting as more cars become electric.
 

ldoh

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The problem is getting infrastructure for fast charging out in the boonies. To charge an EV quickly you need several hundred kW of power, and getting high power transmission lines out to an old, dusty gas station on Route 66 is a tall order. We'll likely see solar panels/ batteries for the immediate need, which will get more and more interesting as more cars become electric.

It's always a problem until we see the light. Service sector businesses might flourish in those smaller towns 150-200 miles between major destinations. If so there could be more investment opportunities and places where many might prefer to live versus tax-heavy, crime ridden, and elevator rich condo'd urban areas.
 

Drewster

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It's always a problem until we see the light. Service sector businesses might flourish in those smaller towns 150-200 miles between major destinations. If so there could be more investment opportunities and places where many might prefer to live versus tax-heavy, crime ridden, and elevator rich condo'd urban areas.
Absolutely! It's a problem that's worth solving since it will drive innovation and jobs into loads of areas and sectors of the market that would otherwise be stagnant
 

mikeru82

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Electrical Engineer here - millions of vehicles charging overnight, even tens of millions isn't that big of an issue. Especially as more homes get smart meters, the slow and steady draw of overnight charging to recoup one day's driving is far less than kicking your Air Conditioning, electric water heater, etc. Even today, Tesla and GM vehicles can work with smart meters or have settings to charge in off-peak hours. Recharging 8 hours to top off your battery from a 30 mile commute is not the same as trying to recharge the entire capacity of the battery in a hurry.

The problem is getting infrastructure for fast charging out in the boonies. To charge an EV quickly you need several hundred kW of power, and getting high power transmission lines out to an old, dusty gas station on Route 66 is a tall order. We'll likely see solar panels/ batteries for the immediate need, which will get more and more interesting as more cars become electric.
I was likely being conservative when I said tens of millions. There were an estimated 280 million vehicles in use in the US last year. So the more realistic number is in the hundreds of millions if EV's ever fully replace ICE powered vehicles. I respect your EE background. I work in the electric power industry myself. I've had discussions with EE's about this very subject. We currently have brown-outs and black-outs in some areas of the country. Some are to shed load and some are in an attempt to avoid starting wildfires. I can't imagine adding a possible 280 million EV's plugged into an already stressed power system. Add to that the moves to remove dams in the West, stop burning coal for power generation, and people protesting about removing nuclear power plants. Lots of people mistakenly think that we can make up for that lost power generation with wind and solar power. A lot would need to be done to support all those EV's.

I agree with you about the lack of infrastructure in rural and remote areas. I don't know of any fast charging stations within 100 miles of where I live. There's no way I'm driving an EV anywhere that I'll have to stop for a charge. Most people won't accept driving a car that takes much longer to charge than it currently takes to fuel with gas or diesel.
 

Drewster

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I can't imagine adding a possible 280 million EV's plugged into an already stressed power system. Add to that the moves to remove dams in the West, stop burning coal for power generation, and people protesting about removing nuclear power plants. Lots of people mistakenly think that we can make up for that lost power generation with wind and solar power. A lot would need to be done to support all those EV's.
The thing is that our grid is not universally stressed all of the time. If you look here, you can see why the rolling blackouts are around 6pm - where everyone gets home and tries to cool their home. If EV's are charging during off-peak hours, that same grid that was stressed by 150MW of power at 6PM now has an extra 40-50MW of power available at midnight - almost 30% of the entire capacity. So yes, the grid is stressed, but we don't actually need to add 30% to support EV's, we just need to be more efficient about how we use our available capacity.

The biggest concern for our infrastructure - in addition to quick charging in remote areas - is actually climate change. As I mentioned before, an EV charging 3% of its capacity after a 32 mile commute is nothing compared to running a 4,000+ watt Household HVAC. That's one of the things that really screwed Texas this past February - we weren't ready for every home in Texas to suddenly heat their home that wasn't built for cold, and the same applies during the summer when AC systems across the nation work harder and harder as the climate goes up.
 

392DCGC

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I haven't read much into the reveal yet, but I have a good bit of ownership experience with plug-in hybrids and EVs. I am surprised the effiiciency seems to be as low as 500~ Wh/mi. Ford did a good job accurately rating the Mach-E, so hopefully the Lightning gets the same treatment. Tesla on the otherhand consistently overestimates its cars using optimistic figures that are rarely achievable real-world. Owning the Lightning as a grocery getting dad-mobile will be fine, but if you are trying to do any towing with it, good luck is all I have to say. EVs are terrible at towing, and you will be lucky to get 100 miles of range near its max load (extended-range version). Even less if it's cold. And as others have mentioned, the EV charging infrastructure is an absolute joke right now. That's one nice thing about Telsa - how seamless and broad their charging network is to use. Not exactly an abundance of public chargers around, and many are on proprietary networks where you'll need multiple accounts set up to use them. A lot of these networks charge stupid prices per kWh as well (nowhere near the rates you pay to charge at home). Traveling/charging an EV on networks as they are priced right now is no cheaper than gas, and likely more expensive than gas when towing. Chargers are typically placed in highways and urban areas as well, so good luck towing your boat or camper out to BFE - it's just not going to happen.

I'm not an EV hater. Between my wife and I, we've had 3 Teslas and a few PHEVs (she currently drives a Pacifica PHEV, and we love it). EVs will work well for a lot of people, particularly those who can charge at home. But in terms of the worker who needs a vehicle they can reliably and quickly keep "fueled" or the family who wants to tow their toys around, the tech and infrastructure is nowhere near there yet.

I’m curious about how well the A/C system works and how much drain it has on the overall distance that can be traveled in summer months. Most of my travels are in and between Houston and New Orleans so pretty hot and humid most of the year. What is everyone’s experience with EV A/C performance, especially in traffic?
EV A/C works far better than combustion engine A/C because they're all using electrically driven variable speed compressors. Power draw is quite low since it's variable, and it works just as well at 80 MPH as it does idling in traffic, unlike an engine belt-driven A/C where the A/C performs noticeably better when you aren't idling.
 

mmcbeat

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With my current driving habits the new Lightening would fit the bill. Mostly short city trips. All charging could be done in my garage. That truck is a ”grocery getter” deluxe. It has a huge weather proof storage area under the hood. Guess you would have to back into a parking spot at the grocery store.
 

Limited2021

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People want wind energy but from what I understand about windmills the cost of building, installing and maintenance you will never recoup the initial investment back from the energy it can produces so it it really saving the environment. The material have to come from some place. We have thousands of them around my area at any given time only about 2/3's of them are actually running the other third are in need of maintenance of some kind. See lots of blades getting replaced from lighting strikes, brakes failing and they self destruct. I would be curious what the actual up keep cost is for one windmill is verses the energy it produces but I bet we will never know what the true numbers are. Birds of pray won't fly by them so the rabbit and rodent population takes off. There is a lot more to wind energy than slapping up a windmill and thinking we are green now. Just sayin.
 

LakesAZ

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I like the idea of an EV truck, but I will wait and see how this all turns out for Ford. I would be more excited to see a RAM EV! And of course a build up of charging stations is needed also.
 

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