DOC FEES

[User_3336]

If you are replying to me - the PRICE I PAID for Reidman was USING A FL ADDRESS. They did however (and I just noticed it this moment) use the DEALERSHIPS ADDRESS on the contract.

Rick

Zeigler pretty well has the best price on any genuine MOPAR esp. Florida does have weird regulations on extended warranties.
So, a little unfair to beat up Zeigler on a Florida quote, when otherwise, they beat any other price.

 

[RSConsulting]

Zeigler pretty well has the best price on any genuine MOPAR esp. Florida does have weird regulations on extended warranties.
So, a little unfair to beat up Zeigler on a Florida quote, when otherwise, they beat any other price.

And as I said - REIDMAN - a RAM DEALER - SOLD ME THE SAME POLICY AT THE NON-FLORIDA PRICE. THEY HAVE THE BEST PRICE - PERIOD. Ziegler is a RAM DEALERSHIP (and Jeep, Ford and a couple of others) - that also markets extended warranties as a PROFIT CENTER. Reidman BEAT THE NON-FLORIDA QUOTE ALSO.

And as I've also said - I CALLED THE STATE INSURANCE COMMISSIONER'S OFFICE when this whole Florida "regulation thing" started. They REGULATE THE INDUSTRY BY LICENSING - to make sure people ARE NOT SELLING BOGUS POLICIES. EXTENDED WARRANTIES ARE IN FACT - INSURANCE.

THEY
DO
NOT
REGULATE
PRICING...

Therefore - there is NO LEGAL REASON WHY FLORIDA POLICIES COST MORE. I don't care ONE WHIT what any dealer say. Call the Florida State Insurance Commissioner's Office - and ask for yourself. Yes - I'M YELLING - because I've said this OVER AND OVER AGAIN - and no one seems to GET IT.

And Fl Statute 634.1815 is left intentionally vague - for the intents and purposes that DISCOUNTING is NOT REBATING (again, from the SIC Office) - a REBATE is something "given back" in the paperwork. Rebate does not appear in the "definitions" in 634.011, for a REASON. A rebate is that which is GIVEN BACK IN WRITING in return for FULL CONSIDERATION PAID. REBATES are given on THE BACK END - NOT THE FRONT END (loading).

What states allow insurance rebating?

Only two states within the United States permit rebating (Florida and California); however, they are closely scrutinized for any wrongdoing. Rebating occurs when any part of the commission or anything else of value is given to the insured as an inducement to buy a policy.

What is an example of rebating in insurance?

An example of rebating is when the prospective insurance buyer receives a refund of all or part of the commission for the insurance sale. Rebates can be made in the form of cash, gifts, services, payment of premiums, employment, or almost any other thing of value.

DISCOUNTS ARE NOT REBATES - REFUNDS ARE.

Something like - "I'll give you your financing @ 2.5% (instead of 4.5)" - like the honda dealer did to INDUCE ME TO BUY the extended warranty at FULL PRICE - IS ILLEGAL under 634.1815.

Something like - "OK - you can get it online @ 2,990 so I'll match that price, instead of the $4,4415 is DISCOUNTING (not REBATING). Aside from the initial cost of licensing and compliance - the POLICY ITSELF costs the same.

I really am done arguing - please do respond though, to get the last word in...

Rick

 

[Silent Bob]

And as I said - REIDMAN - a RAM DEALER - SOLD ME THE SAME POLICY AT THE NON-FLORIDA PRICE. THEY HAVE THE BEST PRICE - PERIOD. Ziegler is a RAM DEALERSHIP (and Jeep, Ford and a couple of others) - that also markets extended warranties as a PROFIT CENTER. Reidman BEAT THE NON-FLORIDA QUOTE ALSO.

And as I've also said - I CALLED THE STATE INSURANCE COMMISSIONER'S OFFICE when this whole Florida "regulation thing" started. They REGULATE THE INDUSTRY BY LICENSING - to make sure people ARE NOT SELLING BOGUS POLICIES. EXTENDED WARRANTIES ARE IN FACT - INSURANCE.

THEY
DO
NOT
REGULATE
PRICING...

Therefore - there is NO LEGAL REASON WHY FLORIDA POLICIES COST MORE. I don't care ON WHIT what any dealer say. Call the Florida State Insurance Commissioner's Office - and ask for yourself. Yes - I'M YELLING - because I've said this OVER AND OVER AGAIN - and no one seems to GET IT.

Rick

1. Are you sure you purchased an FCA Mopar Maximum Care Plan and not some other service contract? If so please provide us with the website or phone number of "Reidman"

2. The state does not set the price they just require everyone pays the same price.

The relevant Florida law is The 2016 Florida Statutes Title XXXVII INSURANCE Chapter 634

It says three key things

1 ) Extended warranties are insurance
2 ) Only FL licensed brokers can sell policies in Florida
3 ) When you sell a policy the seller's profit is called a COMMISSION and if a seller REBATES any part of their COMMISSION to one customer they must post prominently the REBATE amount and offer the same REBATE to every customer.

Hence they can not negotiate on an individual basis like they can when they sell the car. In any other context such anti competitive rules would be price fixing and restraint of trade.

Here are the main points

License Required

A service warranty association providing or offering service warranties to residents of this state must be licensed by the Office of Insurance Regulation (OIR). A service warranty association located in Florida is exempt from the licensing requirements as long as the service warranties are only sold and marketed to nonresidents of this state. However, there are certain reporting requirements to the OIR. For a complete review of these requirements, please review Section 634.403, Florida Statutes.

Fixed Price for all intents and purposes

634.1815 Rebating; when allowed.—
( 1 ) No salesperson shall rebate any portion of his or her commission except as follows:
( a ) The rebate shall be available to all consumers in the same actuarial class.
( b ) The rebate shall be in accordance with a rebating schedule filed with and approved by the service agreement company issuing the service agreement to which the rebate applies. The service agreement company shall maintain a copy of all rebating schedules for a period of 3 years.
( c ) The rebating schedule shall be uniformly applied so all consumers who purchase the same service agreement through the salesperson for the same coverage shall receive the same percentage rebate.
( d ) The rebate schedule shall be prominently displayed in public view in the salesperson’s place of business, and a copy shall be made available to consumers on request at no charge.
( e ) The age, sex, place of residence, race, nationality, ethnic origin, marital status, or occupation of the consumer shall not be used in determining the percentage of the rebate or whether a rebate is available.
( 2 ) No rebate shall be withheld or limited in amount based on factors which are unfairly discriminatory.
( 3 ) No rebate shall be given which is not reflected on the rebate schedule.
( 4 ) No rebate shall be refused or granted based upon the purchase of or failure to purchase collateral business.

 

[RSConsulting]

1. Are you sure you purchased an FCA Mopar Maximum Care Plan and not some other service contract?

2. The state does not set the price they just require everyone pays the same price.

snip

And I swore I wasn't going to respond again.

1 - Really dude? Want to see the contract? And you can GOOGLE them - or search on the forum - someone HERE turned me onto them when I purchased.

On second thought - I IM'd you the policy - no need to spread my personal info out here.

People really kill me sometimes.

2 - this discussion has gone circular. You believe what you want to believe - I'll believe what I know from my own experience to be true.

 

[User_3336]

And I swore I wasn't going to respond again.

Yes, you did, but you did. LOL

 

[PM-Performance]

Many but not all Florida dealers insist they must charge a DOC fee, typically $900. The one I spoke to today said you'll pay it one way or another.

Stop buying in FL and Tx.
They play games and insert silly doc fees. Pretty sure they have been sued numerous times atleast in FL and they atleast need to tell you now the fee is ******** and Inform you of it. They used to hide it

 

[Hydroblueguy]

Many but not all Florida dealers insist they must charge a DOC fee, typically $900. The one I spoke to today said you'll pay it one way or another.

Every state is different, bought my 19 in North Carolina and paid 699 doc fees. I told them I wouldn’t pay that, they tried telling me the doc fee was set by the state? Anyway I told them they could put it down as a 699 doc fee, but they would take another 500 off our agreed upon price and they did! I live in Iowa and I have paid between 95-200 is all in the state of Iowa. I was also told it was a way for them to recoup there advertising fees. Not my fault they have to advertise to see trucks lol

 

[Smashius]

I thought the 8%+ APR was a typo. Yikes.

And I bought my truck 12/26/20 in Ohio, no doc fee.

 

[RSConsulting]

Every state is different, bought my 19 in North Carolina and paid 699 doc fees. I told them I wouldn’t pay that, they tried telling me the doc fee was set by the state? Anyway I told them they could put it down as a 699 doc fee, but they would take another 500 off our agreed upon price and they did! I live in Iowa and I have paid between 95-200 is all in the state of Iowa. I was also told it was a way for them to recoup there advertising fees. Not my fault they have to advertise to see trucks lol

Yeah - the advertising thing really kills me. This Ram is the first vehicle I've bought "off the lot" in awhile - my last 4 were all special ordered. Def not paying for advertising, for a vehicle that needed none.

It's all "profit centers" they build in to milk every $$ they can off a sale. Or the pity "we have to pay all these employees" dance - you mean the 10 that have been sitting around doing nothing the whole time I've been here? Maybe LET SOME OF THEM GO, if the dealership is that broke.

Rick

 

[KCViper]

I always work my buys from a OTD (out the door) number. This way they can't change numbers....or they can, but I'm locked into my OTD number and I don't care how they work "their" number. It's worked well for me over the years!!

 

[User_3336]

I always work my buys from a OTD (out the door) number. This way they can't change numbers....or they can, but I'm locked into my OTD number and I don't care how they work "their" number. It's worked well for me over the years!!

Yep, I love the OTD offer. Dealership finds it hard that an ordinary Joe knows how to calculate sales tax, tags, etc

Another thing you have to be careful around here is about the DOC FEE. Some dealers say, for example, $699 doc fee included in advertised price, HOWEVER, they add the doc fee on anyway (and you can calculate it as they added it twice then).

 

[NorthStar]

Stop buying in FL and Tx.
They play games and insert silly doc fees. Pretty sure they have been sued numerous times atleast in FL and they atleast need to tell you now the fee is ******** and Inform you of it. They used to hide it

Seriously? The most I’ve ever paid for a doc fee here in Texas is $150...and that was only twice otherwise I’ve been able to negotiate it away once in the finance office after I have my OTD number in writing. Threaten to walk over $150 and they typically cave...

 

[User_3336]

Seriously? The most I’ve ever paid for a doc fee here in Texas is $150...and that was only twice otherwise I’ve been able to negotiate it away once in the finance office after I have my OTD number in writing. Threaten to walk over $150 and they typically cave...

I threatened to walk out over a $135 set of floor mats for my RAM.. The dealer that charged me twice for the doc fee refunded it quickly after I called them out.

 

[PM-Performance]

Seriously? The most I’ve ever paid for a doc fee here in Texas is $150...and that was only twice otherwise I’ve been able to negotiate it away once in the finance office after I have my OTD number in writing. Threaten to walk over $150 and they typically cave...

Seriously. When I was scouting aGT500 to buy Tx and Fl were the worst states to deal with. They added silly doc fees and refused to negotiate them off and said it’s just part of doing business in those states.
I bought in a diff state and moved on

 

[NorthStar]

Seriously. When I was scouting aGT500 to buy Tx and Fl were the worst states to deal with. They added silly doc fees and refused to negotiate them off and said it’s just part of doing business in those states.
I bought in a diff state and moved on

It is a violation of Texas law to charge more than $150 doc fee. Dealers know better and can be fined for doing so. Granted, the fine is the cost of the Doc Fee ($150) but I’ve never seen nor heard of anyone paying for them 150 for a doc fee in Texas. Now, if it is a TRX or another model that is in high demand, then they can add a sticker on the windshield with a heavy markup but don’t confuse that with Doc Fee.

Texas Administrative Code

 

[PM-Performance]

It is a violation of Texas law to charge more than $150 doc fee. Dealers know better and can be fined for doing so. Granted, the fine is the cost of the Doc Fee ($150) but I’ve never seen nor heard of anyone paying for them 150 for a doc fee in Texas. Now, if it is a TRX or another model that is in high demand, then they can add a sticker on the windshield with a heavy markup but don’t confuse that with Doc Fee.

Texas Administrative Code

Then they just changed it in the last year or 2. Because it was very common to see like $900 doc fees in both states 2 years ago.
Florida was still able to still get away with it as long as they made it clear these were dealer fees they added on for no reason and not required

 

[NorthStar]

Then they just changed it in the last year or 2. Because it was very common to see like $900 doc fees in both states 2 years ago.
Florida was still able to still get away with it as long as they made it clear these were dealer fees they added on for no reason and not required

Texas adopted it in 2016 and amended it in 2017. It’s at the bottom of the page of the link I provided.

 

[PM-Performance]

Texas adopted it in 2016 and amended it in 2017. It’s at the bottom of the page of the link I provided.

Well I can assure you %1000 they were still doing it going into 2019 because I dealt with it first hand. This was major dealers too, not just small dealers that were under the radar

The one dealer has dealers in both states and I was trying to deal with them in both states

 

[securityguy]

makes sense. save 1k on a truck you buy every 7 years ... but feel free to blow 1k in a month because ya know ... 'Murica

I can easily blow $1K in a night just by going downtown and seeing all of those nice ladies hanging out on the street corner......................

 

[securityguy]

Keep in mind, when it goes to write that service contract they may not do it. FL law prevents discounting of service contracts....

Correct...I use my other address in Virginia when I buy my warranties from out of state dealers.