BIG payload surprise - 2020 Ram 1500 Limited

[dougf]

My factory ordered 2020 Ram 1500 Limited is due to arrive any day now.
Options:
5.7 Hemi E-torque
3.92 axle
Electronic locking rear axle
Off-road group
Trailer brake control
Rambox
MF tailgate
Bed utility group
Limited Level 1 equipment group
33gal fuel tank

When I spec'd this out prior to order using the towing tow guide at RamTrucks.com, it listed tow capacity of 11,220 and payload 1770. I plan to tow ~4500lb dry weight, gvwr 7500 trailer, so I thought it would be well within the trucks capability. I will only be towing 2 or 3 times a year, interstate up to 1000 miles round trip, mostly interstate (although I generally don't exceed 65mph when towing.) Otherwise, the truck will be used locally for light duty and some long (non-towing) trips now and then.

Here is the surprise. Once the VIN was available, I used the Ramtrucks.com towing guide and looked up my new truck by VIN and got a big surprise. Tow capacity of 10900 (just fine), but PAYLOAD listed a 1009lb! Wow. I lost 700lb payload somewhere with all the options. With a tongue weight of ~600lb, tank of gas ~240lb, and my wife and I at ~320lb, I've already exceeded payload without ANY cargo loaded into the bed. How dangerous is it to load an extra 100-200lbs in the bed since I'm already exceeding the limit when empty? This is a BIG disappointment I wasn't counting on.

 

[devildodge]

At this point, we have provided so much information about this that I can no longer feel the pain.

A Limited is only surpassed by a Laramie Longhorn in the amount of base weight

The configurations are just that...a configuration. When you use the chart or the online configurator you are getting the base truck in that configuration.

Crew Cab 5'7 bed 4x4 Hemi. That is a configuration.

When you put in your VIN you get the accurate measurement of all your options. And they are heavy and add up fast.

Also, one more time, Max towing is with only 300lbs of cargo 70lbs for hitch and 10% tongue weight.

That 300 lbs is for all passengers, gear, water bottles, chips, hand sanitizer, tow straps, etc..you get the point. I weigh 295 myself.

And most safe setups require 12 to 14 % tongue weight to haul correctly.

So unless you and your passenger weigh under 300lbs and you take nothing else in the truck...you will never hit it.

Pages and pages of threads now describing this.

Sorry, @dougf you are not the first to fall into this...but I sure hope with all the info we post you may be one of the last.

We try our best to explain this every time it happens.

 

[devildodge]

Payload is measured with driver and passenger(300 lbs) and a full tank of gas so you can take those out of the equation.

Payload is not measured with driver and passenger.

Payload is GVWR minus Base weight. Base weight is no cargo, full fluids.

Max towing is with 300lbs for passengers.

It is GCWR minus Base weight minus 300lbs passengers/cargo minus 70lbs for hitch minus 10% tongue.

 

[devildodge]

Wow. I lost 700lb payload somewhere with all the options. With a tongue weight of ~600lb, tank of gas ~240lb, and my wife and I at ~320lb, I've already exceeded payload without ANY cargo loaded into the bed. How dangerous is it to load an extra 100-200lbs in the bed since I'm already exceeding the limit when empty? This is a BIG disappointment I wasn't counting on.

Gas doesn't count. So you would be safe loading 100 to 200 lbs in the truck if it is just you and your wife in there.

You might be okay after all.

 

[RVTRKN]

Look at the door tag for your front and rear GAWR, then fill your tanks gear and persons in the truck, go to a certified scale to see what your axle weights truely are. Then you'll know what you can load/pull with your truck. I think you'll be pleasently surprized how much you have for tongue weight availability. Then weight everything combined to get the true configuration.

 

[zappel]

I landed up in exactly your situation. I bought a 2019 Ram 1500 Hemi with eTorque. The day it arrived and I looked at the payload sticker and saw 1320 pds I knew I had problems. My TT has a GVWR if 7495 pds. Listed hitch weight of 591 pds. My actual hitch weight is around 800 pds.
The dealer had luckily assured me that the payload was 1700 pds.
I towed with that truck for 1500 km and gave it back for a 3500 Diesel Limited.
The dealer actually did the right thing and absorbed most of the hit.
The 1500 pulled Ok, stopped Fine but I was over my payload and my rear axle limits.
The 3500 was a trade off when not towing, The ride is a harsher experience compared to the 1500 which was like any luxury car. I just wasn’t prepared to worry about weight every trip and safety, as well as the legal implications with insurance.


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[dougf]

I apologize for posting the question without digging deeper into the towing threads. However, I still a bit confused by the responses.

Is the 300lb cargo taken into account in the payload rating or not? Some response suggest yes and others no. Probably the biggest issue is that I don't understand the terminology well enough.

If 300lb cargo is NOT part of the payload rating (but 240lb fuel IS), then I appear to be right on the edge for payload.

The 300lb cargo does not appear to be an issue for my tow capacity (which I'm well under for my trailer). At 300lb cargo + full fluid (assuming fluid includes fuel), then I appear to be fine to load 100-200lbs into the bed when towing. (since tow capacity is 10900 and by trailer GVWR is ~7500)

I do plan to load it up and hit the scales to check GAWR.

Thanks to everyone for the clarifications.

 

[zappel]

My understanding is that payload includes a 180 pd driver and full fuel.
The VIN no I used on Ram website for my vehicle was different to the payload sticker in both of them.
The only one that counts is the one in the door.


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[dougf]

I landed up in exactly your situation. I bought a 2019 Ram 1500 Hemi with eTorque. The day it arrived and I looked at the payload sticker and saw 1320 pds I knew I had problems. My TT has a GVWR if 7495 pds. Listed hitch weight of 591 pds. My actual hitch weight is around 800 pds.
The dealer had luckily assured me that the payload was 1700 pds.
I towed with that truck for 1500 km and gave it back for a 3500 Diesel Limited.
The dealer actually did the right thing and absorbed most of the hit.
The 1500 pulled Ok, stopped Fine but I was over my payload and my rear axle limits.
The 3500 was a trade off when not towing, The ride is a harsher experience compared to the 1500 which was like any luxury car. I just wasn’t prepared to worry about weight every trip and safety, as well as the legal implications with insurance.


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I guess I am facing the same dilemma. However, I still haven't taken delivery but I'll lose a $1000 deposit if I don't. I won't be able to hit the scales unless I do take delivery. Thanks for your feedback.

 

[Zeronet]

Payload is measured with driver and passenger(300 lbs) and a full tank of gas so you can take those out of the equation.

Not true. Payload does NOT include ANY allowance for driver/passengers, it does include a full tank of fuel though.

 

[Zeronet]

My understanding is that payload includes a 180 pd driver

Not true. There is no allowance in PAYLOAD for driver/passengers.

Payload is based on the weight of the truck itself, factory installed options and full fluids (including fuel). Anything/anyone you add to the truck will reduce the remaining available payload.

I think the confusion comes from the MAX TOWING numbers that DO have an allowance for the weight of the driver and a weight distribution hitch.

 

[zappel]

I doubt they can take your deposit. They might tell you they will but highly unlikely. I think the CAT scale from my TT will not be too different from what you will see depending obviously on how you load. We travel light, no water etc.


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[devildodge]

One more time

Payload. Payload is the amount of cargo and passengers and tongue weight you can put onto your truck.

Payload is GVWR minus base weight.

Base weight includes full fluids. Gas, oil, coolant, windshield washer fluid. So gas is not payload

GAWR will be more than GVWR. Front is 3900 and rear is 4100. You could exceed GVWR, but do not exceed GAWR

GAWR. Gross axle weight rating
GVWR. Gross vehicle weight rating
GCWR gross combined weight rating

Max towing is a mythical number.

It includes the 300lb allowance for passengers and cargo. 70lbs for hitch and a 10% tongue weight.

Your truck will be fine if your numbers posted are true.

Go to a CAT scale. Do not exceed 3900 steer 4100 drive and a total of 17000 with 3.92 or 13900 with 3.21.

Understood? Ask anything that wasn't clear I will answer.

 

[dougf]

One more time

Payload. Payload is the amount of cargo and passengers and tongue weight you can put onto your truck.

Payload is GVWR minus base weight.

Payload includes full fluids. Gas, oil, coolant, windshield washer fluid.

GAWR will be more than GVWR. Front is 3900 and rear is 4100. You could exceed GVWR, but do not exceed GAWR

GAWR. Gross axle weight rating
GVWR. Gross vehicle weight rating
GCWR gross combined weight rating

Max towing is a mythical number.

It includes the 300lb allowance for passengers and cargo. 70lbs for hitch and a 10% tongue weight.

Your truck will be fine if your numbers posted are true.

Go to a CAT scale. Do not exceed 3900 steer 4100 drive and a total of 17000 with 3.92 or 13900 with 3.21.

Understood? Ask anything that wasn't clear I will answer.

Thanks a lot. Yes, I think this clears it up. Appreciate your patience.

 

[dougf]

I doubt they can take your deposit. They might tell you they will but highly unlikely. I think the CAT scale from my TT will not be too different from what you will see depending obviously on how you load. We travel light, no water etc.


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Thanks for the feedback. I'm going to have to think hard before backing out, since, according to other responses I should be ok, but I am right at the limit. My primary use is light, with very occasional towing ... although towing trips can be up to 1000 round trip highway and a few short camping trips a year. Probably only 5-7% of the miles will be towing. I really look forward to the driving experience in the 1500 Limited when not towing. I guess I'm curious why you went all the way to a 3500 instead of a 2500. If I do move up, I think a 2500 would be fine.

 

[Jimmy07]

One more time

Payload. Payload is the amount of cargo and passengers and tongue weight you can put onto your truck.

Payload is GVWR minus base weight.

Base weight includes full fluids. Gas, oil, coolant, windshield washer fluid. So gas is not payload

GAWR will be more than GVWR. Front is 3900 and rear is 4100. You could exceed GVWR, but do not exceed GAWR

GAWR. Gross axle weight rating
GVWR. Gross vehicle weight rating
GCWR gross combined weight rating

Max towing is a mythical number.

It includes the 300lb allowance for passengers and cargo. 70lbs for hitch and a 10% tongue weight.

Your truck will be fine if your numbers posted are true.

Go to a CAT scale. Do not exceed 3900 steer 4100 drive and a total of 17000 with 3.92 or 13900 with 3.21.

Understood? Ask anything that wasn't clear I will answer.

Minor clarification on fuel- each ram truck is built, filled with fluids, but only 5 gallons of fuel (on the build sheet, and that’s how they’re shipped to the dealers), THEN, each truck is weighed, and the cargo capacity sticker is then created. So, anything more than 5 gallons of fuel in the tank would go against the “payload” limit.
BUT...I’ll never understand the fascination with the “payload” number, as it’s just a left over number that has nothing to do with the truck’s capabilities or any laws. Tire ratings, axle weight ratings, proper weight distribution, and proper vehicle weight registration is all that matters.

 

[Zeronet]

The payload numbers reflect a FULL tank of fuel. This is one of the reasons that opting for the 33 gallon fuel tank results in a 73 lb payload reduction. About half of that weight is the weight of the additional fuel.

 

[devildodge]

Ok. Good luck with your numbers it is all fake and no standard.

I have a few threads here that detail it all. With pics and charts.

Good luck in your searches

 

[devildodge]

Thanks for the feedback. I'm going to have to think hard before backing out, since, according to other responses I should be ok, but I am right at the limit. My primary use is light, with very occasional towing ... although towing trips can be up to 1000 round trip highway and a few short camping trips a year. Probably only 5-7% of the miles will be towing. I really look forward to the driving experience in the 1500 Limited when not towing. I guess I'm curious why you went all the way to a 3500 instead of a 2500. If I do move up, I think a 2500 would be fine.

Hope it helps. Towing is an opinion. I just try to give the facts.

Any questions feel free to ask. Good luck. Your truck should be fine for what You have and you have done some homework and i appreciate that. My family travels on the road too.

I appreciate people taking the time to be safe.

 

[devildodge]

Minor clarification on fuel- each ram truck is built, filled with fluids, but only 5 gallons of fuel (on the build sheet, and that’s how they’re shipped to the dealers), THEN, each truck is weighed, and the cargo capacity sticker is then created. So, anything more than 5 gallons of fuel in the tank would go against the “payload” limit.
BUT...I’ll never understand the fascination with the “payload” number, as it’s just a left over number that has nothing to do with the truck’s capabilities or any laws. Tire ratings, axle weight ratings, proper weight distribution, and proper vehicle weight registration is all that matters.

Wrong about fuel.

the part about registration is true about that being the only legal worry.

But the truck does have a limit. And the axle limits are more than gross vehicle rating...but maxing them is not the answer.

But, towing is an opinion. I tow below max and relax. My opinion.