4-Corner Air Suspension with Off-Road Package Question

DavidNJ

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We are not really ever going to off-road the truck. If I was, I'd get a Gladiator and put a long-arm suspension on it.

However, we do tow. And whether at the race track or a car show, we always seem to be driving up to a fence where the ground gets very undulating. Often, it is past dark when we leave (the races don't end to midnight to 1 am) and we never know what dip you might drive over. So we do want the plates shielding the fuel tank, transfer case, and front suspension.

In other threads, people have brake simulated limited-slip included with the traction control makes getting the electronic locking diff a better choice than the limited slip, even if not off-roading. At worst it seemed to be a draw.

The cost of those two options is more than the Off-Road package which includes both plus some extras.

Don't need all-terrain tires, but they aren't that extreme and I change them anyway (I'm a tire snob). Don't really care.

Would probably use the hill descent maybe 3-4 times over the life of the truck.

Will be getting the air suspension...a big reason to get the RAM, although there are many others.

Now the question. Normally, the air suspension has 5 levels: Entry/Exit, Aero, Normal, Off-Road 1, and Off-Road 2. The Rebel is 1" higher and loses Normal, which is the mode I'd use most. It makes Off-Road 1 the new Normal and Off-Road 2 becomes Off-Road 1.

The Off-Road package is less expensive than the Protection Group plus the Electrically-Locking Diff, and adds the off-road tires and hill descent control. However, we wouldn't want to lose the 5th air suspension position.

So, does the Off-Road Package with 4-corner Air Suspension lose the 5th (and most important) setting? Its about a $145 difference plus getting the hill descent control.

Thanks,

David
 

devildodge

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Yes. OFFROAD does the same as Rebel. You lose normal because it has a 1inch lift it is always just in one position higher...The truck will always be an inch higher, but a non offroad truck will sit the same in offroad 2 as an ORP in Offroad 1

That is why there are packages, to give you stuff cheaper, but if losing that inch is a deal breaker for OFFROAD guess you will have to spend more money and get less.

Hope this helps. Lots of reading material on the subject here. We have beat the suspension settings to death here.
 

clazer

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You’ll have 4 settings, but you can choose for the truck to stay in aero mode. It will be like the non-off-road normal mode.
 

DavidNJ

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Yes. OFFROAD does the same as Rebel. You lose normal because it has a 1inch lift it is always just in one position higher...The truck will always be an inch higher, but a non offroad truck will sit the same in offroad 2 as an ORP in Offroad 1

That is why there are packages, to give you stuff cheaper, but if losing that inch is a deal breaker for OFFROAD guess you will have to spend more money and get less.

Hope this helps. Lots of reading material on the subject here. We have beat the suspension settings to death here.
Searched a lot...didn't find it. Only found one video which kinda showed in in a view, but didn't say explicitly.

Yes, a package is cheaper. But here it is also disabling a feature for marketing...in order to say it is 1" higher. If the buyer doesn't get the air suspension, then it really is 1" higher and with different shocks. If anything, they should have keep it and called it Street Mode. Anyway, when ordering the air suspension it should be cheaper because the springs and shocks don't change.

In the old days there were different prices to reflect overlapping packages such as the air suspension and off-road package. Or Bed Utility Package and RamBox.

It just makes the decision harder. Interestingly, the Falken Wildpeak tires are 3-Peak Mountain Snow Flake rated...a real snow tire. Surprising, since I thought they needed a winter tread compound for that which would mean no wear rating. But a reason there is extra value.


You’ll have 4 settings, but you can choose for the truck to stay in aero mode. It will be like the non-off-road normal mode.
But you lose actual aero mode. Still the same, lost feature in the name of misguided marketing.
 

devildodge

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The only setting you lose is what in your opinion. Cause I think that may be where we are miss communicating.

You get entry/exit, just one inch higher. You get areo mode, just one inch higher. You do not get normal because you are one inch higher. You get offroad 1 but it is normal height, and offroad 2 is the same as all off road 2.

So if the one inch lift is your complaint, you do realize you also lose the active air dam, so areo mode is not suffering much more from being one inch higher.

And I am a bit confused about your packaging thoughts, but that is irrelevant.

Good luck with your purchase. You get so much with the ORP for the price, but you do lose some things, mainly the active airdam and being one inch lower in entry/exit, areo and normal all together.

My opinion the ORP far outweighs those few "short"comings
 

SpeedyV

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The only setting you lose is what in your opinion. Cause I think that may be where we are miss communicating.

You get entry/exit, just one inch higher. You get areo mode, just one inch higher. You do not get normal because you are one inch higher. You get offroad 1 but it is normal height, and offroad 2 is the same as all off road 2.

So if the one inch lift is your complaint, you do realize you also lose the active air dam, so areo mode is not suffering much more from being one inch higher.

And I am a bit confused about your packaging thoughts, but that is irrelevant.

Good luck with your purchase. You get so much with the ORP for the price, but you do lose some things, mainly the active airdam and being one inch lower in entry/exit, areo and normal all together.

My opinion the ORP far outweighs those few "short"comings
I believe Entry/Exit is the same on ORG and non-ORG trucks, as the air bags should be dropping fully on both. All other modes would be 1” higher on ORG-equipped trucks. I know @Edwards has commented about wanting to reprogram Aero to drop 1.6” instead of 0.6” from Normal in order to have his truck ride at the same height as a non-ORG truck in Aero mode.
 

devildodge

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I believe Entry/Exit is the same on ORG and non-ORG trucks, as the air bags should be dropping fully on both.
I wasn't sure if they would drop the same distance since the suspension is raised 1 inch. That is interesting...so really just "missing" normal mode.
 

SpeedyV

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I wasn't sure if they would drop the same distance since the suspension is raised 1 inch. That is interesting...so really just "missing" normal mode.
It’s just an electronic 1” lift. It would be fun if Tazer or some other company figured out how to hack the sensor signal; we could program our favorite ride heights or even do leveling.
 

Edwards

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It’s just an electronic 1” lift. It would be fun if Tazer or some other company figured out how to hack the sensor signal; we could program our favorite ride heights or even do leveling.
From reading the two folks who I believe had their ride heights dealer adjusted, I think it's a simple integer value in a table somewhere as to what each ride height setting looks for in the sensor. Change those values, and the truck should change actual height to match.

Seems simple enough but since Ram, and hence the downstream dealers, act more like 1970's auto manufacturers vs. electronic goods manufacturers, we're stuck with it "as designed." If Ram moves forward in time with more settings instrumented and end-user downloads, we'd be in a whole new ball game.
 

edrclark

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Searched a lot...didn't find it. Only found one video which kinda showed in in a view, but didn't say explicitly.

Yes, a package is cheaper. But here it is also disabling a feature for marketing...in order to say it is 1" higher. If the buyer doesn't get the air suspension, then it really is 1" higher and with different shocks. If anything, they should have keep it and called it Street Mode. Anyway, when ordering the air suspension it should be cheaper because the springs and shocks don't change.

In the old days there were different prices to reflect overlapping packages such as the air suspension and off-road package. Or Bed Utility Package and RamBox.

It just makes the decision harder. Interestingly, the Falken Wildpeak tires are 3-Peak Mountain Snow Flake rated...a real snow tire. Surprising, since I thought they needed a winter tread compound for that which would mean no wear rating. But a reason there is extra value.




But you lose actual aero mode. Still the same, lost feature in the name of misguided marketing.
Be careful, the OEM wildpeaks are NOT three peaks rated. You would have to purchase retail tires to get that
 

TruckDriver

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So, does the Off-Road Package with 4-corner Air Suspension lose the 5th (and most important) setting? Its about a $145 difference plus getting the hill descent control.

Thanks,

David
Here's a snippet of what I wrote in another thread about the ORP/Rebel A/S settings. In short, I don't think you're missing anything - I could've swore this conversation table was in manual, but now you made me look, so here's the data (maybe we can sticky this somewhere).
TruckDriver said:
The rebel has 4 modes: Entry/Exit, Aero, Normal, Off-Road.

The truck rides great/smooth in Aero - stiffer in Normal - very stiff in OffRoad.

OffRoad will auto lower to Normal or Aero (depending on where you left the system last) after 27mph as OR mode is maxing the suspension geometry for daily driving.

There's also a setting for 'Auto Aero' which will lower from Normal > Aero at 67mph+ and raise back to Normal below 27mph.

Entry/Exit will auto raise after 17mph to your last setting (Aero/Normal)
Based on the fact that general air suspension lifts are not compatible with the Rebel/ORP packages, it leads me to believe the 1" lift from factory is both electronically and supsension component controlled as the bag part #'s are the same.

point of note: the Rebel's NRH will always be higher than the standard air ride even at highway speed - per the manual page 325(ish), all trucks return to NRH at highway speed automatically, you can't drive in OR1 or OR2 indefinitely

Mode5 Position Air RideORP/Rebel AirNotesSpeed Limit
Entry/Exit-2" from NRH-3" from NRHBoth systems are at bump stopsmax 25mph
Aero-.6" from NRH-.6" from NRHif on 'auto' will [email protected] >62, return @ <35
Normal (NRH)0"0"ORP = 1" higher from factoryno limit
Off Road 1+1" from NRHN/Amax 50mph
Off Road 2 / Off Road+2" from NRH+1" from NRHmax 25mph
 

cra1g

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Be careful, the OEM wildpeaks are NOT three peaks rated. You would have to purchase retail tires to get that
Well, mine came with the logo. I don't know if that's a late-production change, or maybe just a supply issue where they had to use "retail" instead of "oem" versions of the tire.

I've mentioned before that my original plan was to install BFG KO2s right away, but I'm really happy with the Falkens, and I'll most likely keep them until they're worn out.
32971
 
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Edwards

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Well, mine came with the logo. I don't know if that's a late-production change, or maybe just a supply issue where they had to use "retail" instead of "oem" versions of the tire.

I've mentioned before that my original plan was to install BFG KO2s right away, but I'm really happy with the Falkens, and I'll most likely keep them until they're worn out.
View attachment 32971
Hmm. What are your traction, temp, and treadwear numbers?
 

Edwards

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Here's a snippet of what I wrote in another thread about the ORP/Rebel A/S settings. In short, I don't think you're missing anything - I could've swore this conversation table was in manual, but now you made me look, so here's the data (maybe we can sticky this somewhere).


Based on the fact that general air suspension lifts are not compatible with the Rebel/ORP packages, it leads me to believe the 1" lift from factory is both electronically and supsension component controlled as the bag part #'s are the same.

point of note: the Rebel's NRH will always be higher than the standard air ride even at highway speed - per the manual page 325(ish), all trucks return to NRH at highway speed automatically, you can't drive in OR1 or OR2 indefinitely

Mode5 Position Air RideORP/Rebel AirNotesSpeed Limit
Entry/Exit-2" from NRH-3" from NRHBoth systems are at bump stopsmax 25mph
Aero-.6" from NRH-.6" from NRHif on 'auto' will [email protected] >62, return @ <35
Normal (NRH)0"0"ORP = 1" higher from factoryno limit
Off Road 1+1" from NRHN/Amax 50mph
Off Road 2 / Off Road+2" from NRH+1" from NRHmax 25mph
One correction (at least on mine) is that E/E cancels out at 15MPH, not 25.
 

DavidNJ

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Be careful, the OEM wildpeaks are NOT three peaks rated. You would have to purchase retail tires to get that
Thanks for the correction!!! It is so complicated to figure out what you are really getting with all of these nuances.

Similar issue with Michelin Pilot Sport P4S tires on sports cars and sports sedans. There is an OEM P4 model...not the same.
 

edrclark

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Well, mine came with the logo. I don't know if that's a late-production change, or maybe just a supply issue where they had to use "retail" instead of "oem" versions of the tire.

I've mentioned before that my original plan was to install BFG KO2s right away, but I'm really happy with the Falkens, and I'll most likely keep them until they're worn out.
View attachment 32971
Mine didn’t :cry:

32994
 

Edwards

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I hadn't thought to look at that. Looks like 500/B/B, and the retail version (from Falken's site) would be 660/A/B.

View attachment 32989
Looks like you got a unicorn. Clearly not the retail tire yet different than what others have received with the ORG. I don't have the snow version either. Not a big deal in Texas though...
 

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