2025 Tungsten Already Broken - Unreal

[JustAnotherGuy]

Ok, so understanding that and that problems do arise from time to time, why are you telling people to not buy the truck? Why not let a small problem be remedied by the service dept and wait to see what the actual issue was?

What you highlighted was explaining why opted to proceed with ordering a first run of refreshed models. When I arrived at my dealership my SA said they have so much backlog from all stellantis produced products, and it's getting worse.

He also conveyed the alarming number of unsolvable issues where either the vehicle remains parked there for months on end, or the manufacturers reply is essentially "it is what it is". My wife's grand wagoneer was in the shop for 5 months, and the same issues remain. No matter how many videos we take and document, if they cannot get it to consistently reproduce they just give the vehicle back. I've been approached by multiple grand wagoneer and wagoneer owners when we're out and about asking if we have issues. 2022,2023,2024...hemi and hurricane, all the same electrical gremlins. I stand by my comment that you should not buy a GW or W, even though it hurts my resale value.

I was under the impression that the grand Cherokee and grand Cherokee L weren't affected...my dealer said they're just as bad.

So yeah, absolutely. I would reconsider buying one of these trucks. The theme across the stellantis lineup has been gremlins, ghosts in the machine that cannot be fixed.

And to further clear things up, I've had issues with vipers, my previous 1500, expedition, Escalade, various Mercedes, Silverado's, etc. all where quickly diagnosed and fixed. Never was I told at a first visit, "well, we will see if we can find out what's causing it, but it's working fine now". These are complex machines and I fully expect issues, but when the manufacturer is demonstrating a pattern of never finding a solution....that's something that should be shared with other consumers

The truck on the other hand is absolutely amazing and I'm praying that these are in fact small issues and stellantis quickly gets their **** together. Should everything get worked out and they say "hey, there was a loose connector" then I'll absolutely update the post with a crisis averted acknowledgment. But right now I'm having deja Vu

 

[LOWRMPG]

What you highlighted was explaining why opted to proceed with ordering a first run of refreshed models. When I arrived at my dealership my SA said they have so much backlog from all stellantis produced products, and it's getting worse.

He also conveyed the alarming number of unsolvable issues where either the vehicle remains parked there for months on end, or the manufacturers reply is essentially "it is what it is". My wife's grand wagoneer was in the shop for 5 months, and the same issues remain. No matter how many videos we take and document, if they cannot get it to consistently reproduce they just give the vehicle back. I've been approached by multiple grand wagoneer and wagoneer owners when we're out and about asking if we have issues. 2022,2023,2024...hemi and hurricane, all the same electrical gremlins. I stand by my comment that you should not buy a GW or W, even though it hurts my resale value.

I was under the impression that the grand Cherokee and grand Cherokee L weren't affected...my dealer said they're just as bad.

So yeah, absolutely. I would reconsider buying one of these trucks. The theme across the stellantis lineup has been gremlins, ghosts in the machine that cannot be fixed.

And to further clear things up, I've had issues with vipers, my previous 1500, expedition, Escalade, various Mercedes, Silverado's, etc. all where quickly diagnosed and fixed. Never was I told at a first visit, "well, we will see if we can find out what's causing it, but it's working fine now". These are complex machines and I fully expect issues, but when the manufacturer is demonstrating a pattern of never finding a solution....that's something that should be shared with other consumers

The truck on the other hand is absolutely amazing and I'm praying that these are in fact small issues and stellantis quickly gets their **** together. Should everything get worked out and they say "hey, there was a loose connector" then I'll absolutely update the post with a crisis averted acknowledgment. But right now I'm having deja Vu

I take no issue at all with a person expressing their opinion. If your experience has been poor, absolutely that with shape your view. Overall, I personally don't know a single person who consults forums before buying a vehicle - in my general experience people come to a forum either because they just purchased a vehicle and want to learn something, or they have an issue. In that context, personal anecdotal opinions on forums don't move the sales needle - experiences do.

A dealer telling you they have no answer is absurd, but dealers are privately owned, not a reflection on a "company" -- for better or worse.

 

[RedFred]

I had my parking brake engage a couple days ago while in Costco parking lot. I didn't know what was going on, I only tried to move the truck up a couple of feet to move out of the way and I couldn't get it to move. I put it in Park and back to Drive, I tried turning the truck off and back on and still couldn't move it. I realized I had my driver's door open and this must of triggered the e-brake. I then closed the door, and released the e-brake and all was good. Are you sure you were not doing something that was triggering the e-brake? I'm not sure of all the conditions that would activate the e-brake, but having the driver's door open while trying to put it in drive did it to me.

 

[JustAnotherGuy]

I had my parking brake engage a couple days ago while in Costco parking lot. I didn't know what was going on, I only tried to move the truck up a couple of feet to move out of the way and I couldn't get it to move. I put it in Park and back to Drive, I tried turning the truck off and back on and still couldn't move it. I realized I had my driver's door open and this must of triggered the e-brake. I then closed the door, and released the e-brake and all was good. Are you sure you were not doing something that was triggering the e-brake? I'm not sure of all the conditions that would activate the e-brake, but having the driver's door open while trying to put it in drive did it to me.

Yes, unfortunately I tried every conceivable combination of things. Seatbelt on, off, door closed, etc. the truck did give me a P! Yellow dash code before this happened. Mark dodge (while it's not being serviced there) has gone above and beyond trying to help me out remotely. I was told they've seen faulty batteries causing gremlins so that may be this cause.

Spoke to my SA 30 minutes ago and he said best case I get it back Monday, most likely Tuesday. Until then im in a jeep compass...which is quite the sight. I'm over 6'5", nearly 280, and I had my 160 pound cane Corso and 80 pound Doberman with their heads out of the back window driving down the street...the compass is not designed for that lol

 

[Threesuns1]

Just a shot in the dark, does the 2025s have a "service brakes" in uconnect to release the emergency brake?

 

[HemiDude]

I take no issue at all with a person expressing their opinion. If your experience has been poor, absolutely that with shape your view. Overall, I personally don't know a single person who consults forums before buying a vehicle - in my general experience people come to a forum either because they just purchased a vehicle and want to learn something, or they have an issue. In that context, personal anecdotal opinions on forums don't move the sales needle - experiences do.

A dealer telling you they have no answer is absurd, but dealers are privately owned, not a reflection on a "company" -- for better or worse.

I guess allow me to be the first, then. Before I bought my '20 Ram I did a lot of research, including forums. With the covid effect in full swing at the time, I wasn't going to order a truck, and availability/selection weren't great, so I wanted to be sure to "buy once, cry once". Ram forums were full of people who raved about the new DT, with the majority of negative experiences seemingly related to the early '19 models. Ford guys were b**tching about trannies and plastic interiors, and GM guys had a lot of engine complaints. No single source of information drove me to my purchase decision, but forum presence was part of the equation.

 

[Jako]

I guess allow me to be the first, then. Before I bought my '20 Ram I did a lot of research, including forums. With the covid effect in full swing at the time, I wasn't going to order a truck, and availability/selection weren't great, so I wanted to be sure to "buy once, cry once". Ram forums were full of people who raved about the new DT, with the majority of negative experiences seemingly related to the early '19 models. Ford guys were b**tching about trannies and plastic interiors, and GM guys had a lot of engine complaints. No single source of information drove me to my purchase decision, but forum presence was part of the equation.

The 5th generation forum was a big help in making my buying decision. Thanks to all the posters over the years.

 

[JustAnotherGuy]

Here's a link to my review ignoring any issues

J

Thread '2025 Tungsten Informal Review'

Oct 4, 2024

I'll get some better pictures and more details later. I've yet to see pics of the off road package on a tungsten so here they are. Crappy angle but IMO looks great in person.

First and foremost, the new sound system. It's absolutely insane. So far above the Harmon Kardon in my limited. It's also noticeably better than the McIntosh in my wife's GW. I'd argue it's the best sounding OEM system I've ever heard.

Next up, the engine. It's smooth and it's fast, but as suspected it's quite boring to drive. The positive is it's so quiet that I'm not embarrassed. Those Ecoboost sound like weed...

• JustAnotherGuy
• Replies: 32
• Forum: 5th Gen General Discussion

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[Cueva del Osos]

I take no issue at all with a person expressing their opinion. If your experience has been poor, absolutely that with shape your view. Overall, I personally don't know a single person who consults forums before buying a vehicle - in my general experience people come to a forum either because they just purchased a vehicle and want to learn something, or they have an issue. In that context, personal anecdotal opinions on forums don't move the sales needle - experiences do.

A dealer telling you they have no answer is absurd, but dealers are privately owned, not a reflection on a "company" -- for better or worse.

Evening LOWRMPG…you now know someone who came here before buying his 2019 LTD! Before ANY major purchase I scope out forums, review sites, etc…collect a list of the pros and cons noted and then dig deep with my own research. I consider a review anywhere to just be an info source that can help form my own inquiries. I also discard the nicest and the meanest 20% or reviews/scores since they’re likely bots or worse…marketing morons.

I will add that the intro of AI into search engines has started making the web completely unusable to me. I was always taught to ask the right questions (and it takes research to realize what the right questions are), but AI seems to only want you to ask the questions it wants. Makes me glad that I’m retired and about ready to just use pen & paper after chucking everything but a phone and ipad into the dump! I weep for the kids who won’t know how to wipe their butts when it all comes crashing down.

 

[RedFred]

Evening LOWRMPG…you now know someone who came here before buying his 2019 LTD! Before ANY major purchase I scope out forums, review sites, etc…collect a list of the pros and cons noted and then dig deep with my own research. I consider a review anywhere to just be an info source that can help form my own inquiries. I also discard the nicest and the meanest 20% or reviews/scores since they’re likely bots or worse…marketing morons.

I also always join a forum before I purchase a car if I am interested in it. Car forums, and also car facebook pages, help you identify potential problems and also gives you an idea of what others are paying so you can be better prepared when at the dealership. From researching the car or truck, I usually end up knowing more about car than the car sales people do. Kind of surprises me that so many car salesman don't know much about the cars they are selling or what trim comes with what options. I try to learn as much as I can before hand so that I know exactly what I am getting and don't end up regretting a purchase.

 

[Jako]

I also always join a forum before I purchase a car if I am interested in it. Car forums, and also car facebook pages, help you identify potential problems and also gives you an idea of what others are paying so you can be better prepared when at the dealership. From researching the car or truck, I usually end up knowing more about car than the car sales people do. Kind of surprises me that so many car salesman don't know much about the cars they are selling or what trim comes with what options. I try to learn as much as I can before hand so that I know exactly what I am getting and don't end up regretting a purchase.

Thinking back, I believe there may be a thread on sales people. I had gone to a batch of dealerships at my leisure and was not impressed at all with the sales people, finally dealt with a sales manager and got the Ram at invoice, along with 5K from Ram, true car $ and $500 coupon sent to me after requesting a brochure via mail. That was back in Oct/Nov 2018, almost 50K msrp and 40K and change final price. I knew more about the Ram trim levels and options than the sales people thanks to the forum, avoided tow mirrors but should have gotten the bed utility group.

 

[UNSAFE]

Evening LOWRMPG…you now know someone who came here before buying his 2019 LTD! Before ANY major purchase I scope out forums, review sites, etc…collect a list of the pros and cons noted and then dig deep with my own research. I consider a review anywhere to just be an info source that can help form my own inquiries. I also discard the nicest and the meanest 20% or reviews/scores since they’re likely bots or worse…marketing morons.

I will add that the intro of AI into search engines has started making the web completely unusable to me. I was always taught to ask the right questions (and it takes research to realize what the right questions are), but AI seems to only want you to ask the questions it wants. Makes me glad that I’m retired and about ready to just use pen & paper after chucking everything but a phone and ipad into the dump! I weep for the kids who won’t know how to wipe their butts when it all comes crashing down.

I have used and still use the same process as you describe when making purchases. The internet has no doubt saved myself and many others from wasted dollars as well the aggravation of purchasing products that don't meet expectations. Your description of the addition of AI into search engines making them (Google) practically unusable.

 

[Alter Ego Trip]

I also always join a forum before I purchase a car if I am interested in it. Car forums, and also car facebook pages, help you identify potential problems and also gives you an idea of what others are paying so you can be better prepared when at the dealership. From researching the car or truck, I usually end up knowing more about car than the car sales people do. Kind of surprises me that so many car salesman don't know much about the cars they are selling or what trim comes with what options. I try to learn as much as I can before hand so that I know exactly what I am getting and don't end up regretting a purchase.

While I do agree this can be the case in many instances; keep in mind that salespeople are trying to memorize options on numerous models, and even more numerous trim packages/options. It would be like walking into a grocery store and asking for the differences in calories between three different types of pasta, and expecting the employee to know the answer off the top of their head.

Also, most customers have spent days/weeks/months researching a specific vehicle and options. It would only makes sense they are as educated, if not more, regarding certain features. My bigger complaint is sales members who don't know the answer, so they make something up which can be very detrimental to the customer.

You also have the fallout from Covid where supply and demand drove the industry, and salespeople never learned how to actually "learn their job".

 

[RedFred]

While I do agree this can be the case in many instances; keep in mind that salespeople are trying to memorize options on numerous models, and even more numerous trim packages/options. It would be like walking into a grocery store and asking for the differences in calories between three different types of pasta, and expecting the employee to know the answer off the top of their head.

Also, most customers have spent days/weeks/months researching a specific vehicle and options. It would only makes sense they are as educated, if not more, regarding certain features. My bigger complaint is sales members who don't know the answer, so they make something up which can be very detrimental to the customer.

You also have the fallout from Covid where supply and demand drove the industry, and salespeople never learned how to actually "learn their job".

To your point, someone who works in the grocery store is not considered a salesperson. They can direct you to where the items are located, but they really don't care which brand of pasta you buy nor do they have a vested interest in which you choose. If someone is a salesperson, they are expected to know the product they are selling or pitching to you, and should also know how it compares to their competitors. I know it's not a perfect world and salespeople are sometimes underpaid, so I shouldn't expect too much from them either. Most of the time I really don't want their input anyway, but like I said, sometimes their lack of knowledge of their product surprises me.

 

[HSKR R/T]

To your point, someone who works in the grocery store is not considered a salesperson. They can direct you to where the items are located, but they really don't care which brand of pasta you buy nor do they have a vested interest in which you choose. If someone is a salesperson, they are expected to know the product they are selling or pitching to you, and should also know how it compares to their competitors. I know it's not a perfect world and salespeople are sometimes underpaid, so I shouldn't expect too much from them either. Most of the time I really don't want their input anyway, but like I said, sometimes their lack of knowledge of their product surprises me.

There is a high turnover at dealerships with salespeople. There is no way they can know every feature of every vehicle in the lot. They learn the most asked about features, and, at least with RAM/Dodge/Jeep are supposed to help you with some of the connected features before leaving the lot, such as connecting your phone vie Bluetooth, and helping with siriusXM. I don't think there's ever been a time when I've gone to look at a vehicle that I didn't show a salesman something they didn't know about the vehicle I was looking at.

 

[RedFred]

There is a high turnover at dealerships with salespeople. There is no way they can know every feature of every vehicle in the lot. They learn the most asked about features, and, at least with RAM/Dodge/Jeep are supposed to help you with some of the connected features before leaving the lot, such as connecting your phone vie Bluetooth, and helping with siriusXM. I don't think there's ever been a time when I've gone to look at a vehicle that I didn't show a salesman something they didn't know about the vehicle I was looking at.

I don't expect them to know every feature of every car, but my point was sometimes their lack of overall knowledge is surprising. This does not include all salesman, of course some are better than others.

 

[Alter Ego Trip]

To your point, someone who works in the grocery store is not considered a salesperson. They can direct you to where the items are located, but they really don't care which brand of pasta you buy nor do they have a vested interest in which you choose. If someone is a salesperson, they are expected to know the product they are selling or pitching to you, and should also know how it compares to their competitors. I know it's not a perfect world and salespeople are sometimes underpaid, so I shouldn't expect too much from them either. Most of the time I really don't want their input anyway, but like I said, sometimes their lack of knowledge of their product surprises me.

Insert whatever store you prefer (Home Depot, Lowes, etc.); I guarantee in most instances you'll know more about the individual features than the employee. I don't expect someone in HD to know every feature on every dishwasher. I want a 30,000' view and then narrow it down from there.

I certainly am not disagreeing with you; I feel all sales members should be educated on the product. I'm merely raising awareness that there are considerably more options and features then most people realize. You have 1500/2500/3500/Grand Cherokee/Compass/Wrangler/4xe/Pacifica/Charger/Challenger/Wagoneer/Grand Wagoneer/RHO/Hornet/etc. Now take those times at least three trim levels each, then take the trim levels x 30 different options that can be added/subtracted. I think you get the point.

There is a high turnover at dealerships with salespeople. There is no way they can know every feature of every vehicle in the lot. They learn the most asked about features, and, at least with RAM/Dodge/Jeep are supposed to help you with some of the connected features before leaving the lot, such as connecting your phone vie Bluetooth, and helping with siriusXM. I don't think there's ever been a time when I've gone to look at a vehicle that I didn't show a salesman something they didn't know about the vehicle I was looking at.

It's rare you find a salesperson who knows everything about every vehicle. Some are experts on Jeeps or Rams, but rarely everything.

I don't expect them to know every feature of every car, but my point was sometimes their lack of overall knowledge is surprising. This does not include all salesman, of course some are better than others.

I think that could be said for about every profession on the planet. There are some who do just enough to get by, and others who take pride in their profession.

 

[RedFred]

I think that could be said for about every profession on the planet. There are some who do just enough to get by, and others who take pride in their profession.

Well if you carry the title of salesperson, it comes with the expectation that you are knowledgable on the product you are selling. A car dealership is not retail store that would be comparable to Home Depot, Walmart, or a grocery store. They are there to sell their own products. The standards of product knowledge is higher since your only purpose is to sell the product your company makes. Just my opinion, you are entitled to yours.

 

[Alter Ego Trip]

Well if you carry the title of salesperson, it comes with the expectation that you are knowledgable on the product you are selling. A car dealership is not retail store that would be comparable to Home Depot, Walmart, or a grocery store. They are there to sell their own products. The standards of product knowledge is higher since your only purpose is to sell the product your company makes. Just my opinion, you are entitled to yours.

Ummm, dealerships don't make cars.

 

[Biga]

A dealership salesperson should be more knowledgeable in the brand they sell, sure their are 100's of variations but many features overlap. For instance blue cruise will function pretty much the same on an F150 as it does on a Ford Mustang. We are not talking about Spaghetti noodles but vehicles costing upwards of $100,000 so it is expected the sales person will be more knowledgeable.