2019 knocking/tapping issue

[rgmg0492]

What was the diagnosis of your engine? Any check engine lights? Mine sounds like this as well until warmed up.

They said the lifters were eating the camshaft. I had metal shavings on the screen of the Oil Control Valve. No check engine lights just the sound.

 

[2020GraniteBH]

Do you guys drive with MDS engaged or disabled? I have heard it helps, but I am curious as to your situation.

 

[rgmg0492]

Do you guys drive with MDS engaged or disabled? I have heard it helps, but I am curious as to your situation.

Disabled.

 

[JLaw297]

OP - any further developments with the dealer on yours or have you just accepted it for now after their last look at it?

 

[Haully11]

OP - any further developments with the dealer on yours or have you just accepted it for now after their last look at it?

No update. Haven't gotten around to make another appointment yet but will probably call soon since I am sure they are a month out for service appointments. Am waiting for winter to make sure that it is cold enough for them to hear it. The problem hasn't gone away, still happens nearly every morning. I just keep documenting it for the time being.

 

[Ethan2388]

No update. Haven't gotten around to make another appointment yet but will probably call soon since I am sure they are a month out for service appointments. Am waiting for winter to make sure that it is cold enough for them to hear it. The problem hasn't gone away, still happens nearly every morning. I just keep documenting it for the time being.

Any word yet, would like to know as I’m having the same noise/issue

 

[Haully11]

Negative. Haven't gotten around to taking it back in...problems haven't changed.

 

[Haully11]

A little bit of an update....truck is at the garage now. I told them about the cold start knocking and the audible spark knock under heavier acceleration. I just got a call that they couldn't reproduce the cold start knocking. I have more videos from earlier this week of the knocking. Adviser then tells me that they did find that cylinder 6 was having misfires but the codes would clear themselves. Adviser then said that they need to get inside the engine to check the spark plugs and then mentioned something about a lifter. I told them my thoughts on what may be causing the cold start knocking and spark knock. His only response was that they need to get inside the engine and that he would call me back. I don't know what exactly that entails but I guess I will find out whenever they call back. This has been extremely frustrating and I don't know how I can get them to hear the cold knock like I can nearly every morning...Will update further when I hear back.

 

[silver billet]

A little bit of an update....truck is at the garage now. I told them about the cold start knocking and the audible spark knock under heavier acceleration. I just got a call that they couldn't reproduce the cold start knocking. I have more videos from earlier this week of the knocking. Adviser then tells me that they did find that cylinder 6 was having misfires but the codes would clear themselves. Adviser then said that they need to get inside the engine to check the spark plugs and then mentioned something about a lifter. I told them my thoughts on what may be causing the cold start knocking and spark knock. His only response was that they need to get inside the engine and that he would call me back. I don't know what exactly that entails but I guess I will find out whenever they call back. This has been extremely frustrating and I don't know how I can get them to hear the cold knock like I can nearly every morning...Will update further when I hear back.

Do you drive with MDS disabled?

 

[silver billet]

I took mine in last Monday for the same thing. They told me there is a Star Case for the Hemi Tick and had to do four procedures and if any of then produced metal shavings then they would have to replace my engine. If there are no shavings then it would be a cam shaft and lifters replaced. They called me Friday and said they would have to order the engine. When they removed the Oil Control Valve it was covered in shavings. So I am in a loaner for another week or so. Google Star Case Hemi Tick and it gives some info. I have 32,000 miles on mine.

What was the diagnosis of your engine? Any check engine lights? Mine sounds like this as well until warmed up.

Are you guys doing blackstone lab UOA's?

 

[Haully11]

Do you drive with MDS disabled?

I do most of the time...don’t always disable it though.

 

[mk2019ORP]

I would have them recheck your exhaust manifolds. I won’t even pretend to be a mechanic, but mine was very similar. Took to a private mechanic (not the dealer/they couldn’t “repeat” the symptoms) and they discovered the passenger side exhaust manifold was cracked. Replaced them both and all is well. Here is a TSB that covers it if you’re still under some kind of warranty. Good luck.

 

[Haully11]

Service advisor called and said he found that an MDS solenoid was broken and falling apart. They replaced and said the misfires have gone away. They heard a slight tap after they put it back together and compared to a new truck on the lot so they are done with it for now. Pretty sure this saga will continue because they again have made no effort to document the cold start knocking as I have documented in videos

 

[silver billet]

Service advisor called and said he found that an MDS solenoid was broken and falling apart. They replaced and said the misfires have gone away. They heard a slight tap after they put it back together and compared to a new truck on the lot so they are done with it for now. Pretty sure this saga will continue because they again have made no effort to document the cold start knocking as I have documented in videos

To be honest your videos confused the heck out of me. Not because you did anything wrong, but because it turns my "knowledge" on this completely inside out.

I had always understood that the classic "hemi tick" as in lifter failure (not exhaust tick), was only prominently heard on a hot idle, never cold. There are many, many reports of this on another forum, always heard on a hot idle.

What I hear in my truck occassionally on a cold start, is almost identical to your video, except not as prominent or consistent knocking. Your's seems to knock with every rotation, mine knocks once a second or so, its more intermittent and sporadic and some times it doesn't do it at all that start/time. I've made that knocking noise get less and less over time by using better oil. Currently HPL 0w-30 has reduced that knock the most. This knock has been in my truck from at least 5000km, possibly right from the beginning. I know I heard it really soon after buying it new and is the reason I started researching ticks and oils in the first place.

My understanding of your/my knock was that it is piston slap. The piston heads expand at a different rate than the cylinder wall so there is more clearance and room for the piston to move around, until it begins to warm up a bit and the temps even out. GM's v8's make a similar noise apparently and neither the GM nor hemi piston slap is anything to worry about, many engines make it well past 200K miles without any failure.

My truck is incredibly quiet, like buttery smooth once it's warmed up. Not a hint of knocking/slapping/ticking or anything, again due to my choice in oil. It took a while to get here. But it makes me think I don't have any lifter tick due to all reports to this date saying that lifter tick is a hot idle sound, not cold idle.

So I'm wondering if the shavings/lifter failure reported in this thread are not caused by the knock we're hearing in these videos, but simply that we have two issues going on at once and you're simply recording the piston slap and not lifter tick?

Hopefully I'm not confused and/or confusing the matter worse. But hoping someone else might chime in with their thoughts/reports. Because if we can hear lifter failure on a cold start like these recordings show, then my truck is getting traded off sooner than expected.

I have done UOA reports over the last 4 to 5 oil changes, not a hint of any abnormal wear. But many on BITOG say that you might not catch lifter failure anyway because the shavings etc are way too large for the analysis to pick up, they can only detect extremely small amounts/particles which is why they're measures in parts per million. Guys have done UOA's without any signs of failures and still had it fail on them with shavings in the valve.

 

[Haully11]

there was another user in this thread that had the same sound as mine and his cam was destroyed by a failed lifter. I went to the dealer after they called to tell me they were done with it and I talked to the tech that worked on my truck. I had him listen to the videos to see if the noises he was hearing was the same thing. He confirmed with 100% certainty that he has not heard the sounds in my videos and confirmed that to diagnose he would likely have to tear the engine apart and that the sound is “concerning”.

My truck will sit at the dealer over the weekend and we will see what happens on Monday morning.

I have videos that the sound is synched with the engine rpm’s. Whether it’s piston slap or a lifter roller smacking the cam I don’t know I guess.

 

[Haully11]

To be honest your videos confused the heck out of me. Not because you did anything wrong, but because it turns my "knowledge" on this completely inside out.

I had always understood that the classic "hemi tick" as in lifter failure (not exhaust tick), was only prominently heard on a hot idle, never cold. There are many, many reports of this on another forum, always heard on a hot idle.

What I hear in my truck occassionally on a cold start, is almost identical to your video, except not as prominent or consistent knocking. Your's seems to knock with every rotation, mine knocks once a second or so, its more intermittent and sporadic and some times it doesn't do it at all that start/time. I've made that knocking noise get less and less over time by using better oil. Currently HPL 0w-30 has reduced that knock the most. This knock has been in my truck from at least 5000km, possibly right from the beginning. I know I heard it really soon after buying it new and is the reason I started researching ticks and oils in the first place.

My understanding of your/my knock was that it is piston slap. The piston heads expand at a different rate than the cylinder wall so there is more clearance and room for the piston to move around, until it begins to warm up a bit and the temps even out. GM's v8's make a similar noise apparently and neither the GM nor hemi piston slap is anything to worry about, many engines make it well past 200K miles without any failure.

My truck is incredibly quiet, like buttery smooth once it's warmed up. Not a hint of knocking/slapping/ticking or anything, again due to my choice in oil. It took a while to get here. But it makes me think I don't have any lifter tick due to all reports to this date saying that lifter tick is a hot idle sound, not cold idle.

So I'm wondering if the shavings/lifter failure reported in this thread are not caused by the knock we're hearing in these videos, but simply that we have two issues going on at once and you're simply recording the piston slap and not lifter tick?

Hopefully I'm not confused and/or confusing the matter worse. But hoping someone else might chime in with their thoughts/reports. Because if we can hear lifter failure on a cold start like these recordings show, then my truck is getting traded off sooner than expected.

I have done UOA reports over the last 4 to 5 oil changes, not a hint of any abnormal wear. But many on BITOG say that you might not catch lifter failure anyway because the shavings etc are way too large for the analysis to pick up, they can only detect extremely small amounts/particles which is why they're measures in parts per million. Guys have done UOA's without any signs of failures and still had it fail on them with shavings in the valve.

Found a video on YouTube that sounds exactly like mine that was lifter/cam related. Listen at the 44 second mark.

 

[silver billet]

Found a video on YouTube that sounds exactly like mine that was lifter/cam related. Listen at the 44 second mark.

Very hard to say. I would say that sounds more like I expected a lifter tick to sound and not like the first 3 videos in this thread. This video here is not what I hear in my truck, I'll see if I can capture a video of it sometime soon.

 

[Jonnybow]

I had the classic cold start tick that I've had on several Ram 1500 and 2500 gas motors in the past. This one is on my 2019 1500 VVT/eTorque and it finally got bad enough that a co-worker asked me if my truck was OK. After listening to it from outside the truck on a cold start, I immediately thought the truck was either out of oil or was getting ready to self destruct.
I brought it in and they saw the manifold bolts sheared and a crack in the manifold (I didn't ask which side). They now have the truck and are waiting on parts. I'm curious what it will sound like when the new manifold is installed and if there's still a tick at all. Will check back in and update

 

[RamCares]

A little bit of an update....truck is at the garage now. I told them about the cold start knocking and the audible spark knock under heavier acceleration. I just got a call that they couldn't reproduce the cold start knocking. I have more videos from earlier this week of the knocking. Adviser then tells me that they did find that cylinder 6 was having misfires but the codes would clear themselves. Adviser then said that they need to get inside the engine to check the spark plugs and then mentioned something about a lifter. I told them my thoughts on what may be causing the cold start knocking and spark knock. His only response was that they need to get inside the engine and that he would call me back. I don't know what exactly that entails but I guess I will find out whenever they call back. This has been extremely frustrating and I don't know how I can get them to hear the cold knock like I can nearly every morning...Will update further when I hear back.

Hey there,

If you'd like some assistance while your vehicle is being diagnosed, please reach out. We're available via direct messaging.

Callie
Ram Cares

 

[Six_Swix]

Hello all. I’m a new member and this is my first 1500 gasser. Coming from a long history of Cummins trucks. Truck has 36k on it. It has developed what I consider a metallic knock/tapping on cold starts. It is rhythmic with rpms. I have done a lot of research and watched a lot of videos and this does not sound like the normal hemi tick or exhaust leaks. I’ve had it to the dealer once already because my exhaust bolts rusted and broke and I asked the dealer to look in to this knocking/tapping noise as well. They fixed the exhaust connection and told me the sound went away. Yeah ok clearly not the case and the 2 problems are not related. I have numerous videos from cold starts to document the problem. The truck also seems to be down on power, I notice a hesitation under acceleration and there is audible spark knock/detonation. I do plan to take it back to the dealer but any input on cause? I’m thinking lifter/cam failure…link to video is below.

Hey man. Live far up north. Recently brought my truck in for service and mentioned to them that ny tick was back and thru should look at my manifold bolting. They diagnosed it as as "knock" this time. Long story short, the pulled it apart and found scoring in cylinder 5. Currently waiting on an engine replacement as its still under extended. I'll post more after I get the full report back.

104000 km