Should I Even Consider the EcoDiesel (3rd Gen)?

[Jerome10]

Been upping my truck knowledge and slowly shopping. I think I know my must haves and my nice to haves (Big Horn Level 2 or Laramie) and all that jazz.

One thing I had not considered AT ALL was the EcoDiesel. I had pretty much decided on the HEMI, preferably with e-Torque. Need to tow about a 5000lb (trailer + contents) 6x12 enclosed tandem-axle cargo trailer (max ever would be 7000lbs). This would be towed basically every business day, mostly suburban driving with possibly 1x a week 30-40 miles on the highway. V8 HEMI is more than enough for my needs. Also a selling point over F150 where finding the V8 is nearly impossible it seems (so I likely would have to go with the 2.7L V6 EcoBoost)

Do I even consider the EcoDiesel (3rd gen only) for my use case? I owned a 6 cylinder BMW diesel when I lived in Germany for 5 years, it was perfect for my needs in commuting but also had enough power for high-speed Autobahn driving, yet got superb fuel economy when desired. I had one failure in my ownership with some sort of cooler if I recall. Was about 1200 EUR to repair, which, while not cheap, also isn't particularly uncommon on any BMW (gas or diesel), so I didn't start cursing at diesel and its problems. I also find diesels intriguing just from the engineering/technology standpoint. There is something kinda cool about them to a geek like me. The MPG is a bonus, though offset by fuel costs somewhat, and possibly maintenance costs. Torque for towing?? I also know the diesel seems to be neutered on the Gladiators, so I'm slightly concerned that the RAM may also do this (it appears it is cooling related on the Jeep so maybe RAM doesn't have this issue?)

With that said, its another 5+ years later after my diesel BMW, and I have no idea even more of the additional garbage they hang off these engines now in an attempt to clean them up. I know I have to deal with DEF. I know, as of today, that I'm gonna pay $4.55 for diesel at my station, whereas regular is $3.20 and premium (may be necessary for towing?) is $3.53. $1 per gallon more is not insignificant. 30% higher fuel cost.

1) should I even consider the EcoDiesel for my use? I do see a fair number new and used (I'm kinda assuming local dealers have ordered a bunch since it is going out of production)... will I see benefits in ease of towing? Will I make up the fuel cost difference towing the trailer daily? Initial purchase price is higher too.... Any financial reason this might make sense?
2) Assuming it might work well for me use-wise, what is the consensus on the 3rd gen diesel reliability? Maintenance requirements? I wouldn't touch the 2nd or 1st gen with a 10 foot pole. The HEMI, while can have issues, is more than proven enough to me to be acceptable.
3) Concerns with mechanics that don't see these engines much? HEMIs are in nearly everything.
4) Parts concerns down the road? I am a guy who likes to buy the right thing then keep it a long time. Again, HEMI will have parts galore for a long time.
5) Does resale matter? One hand, no more diesels, may be desirable. On the other hand if its a piece of junk, nobody is gonna touch it with said 10-foot pole...

If it matters, I live somewhere that I could remove emissions, but I'm also not one to willy-nilly desire more pollution either, so I'd probably just like to leave the truck stock.

Consider it or stay away?

 

[SKT Customs]

On paper I liked everything I read about the ecodiesel and just a couple days ago I mentioned that I’m interested in getting an ecodiesel gladiator to my friend who’s a master technician and worked at CDJR dealers for 10 years and he immediately said “NO! DONT EVEN THINK ABOUT IT” lol. He didn’t go into too much detail but he said he had to replace tons of the 3rd Gen ecodiesels and they’re piles of garbage and especially with the CP4 fuel pump they’re nothing but problems. Like I said, this was his words & I consider him a very reliable source, but do your own research if you’d like It was enough to make me realize my hemi is just fine and the headaches of the ecodiesel aren’t worth the money I’d save in fuel lol. I do think in a perfect world if the engine & fuel pump were reliable it would be a fun engine to drive and the mpg would be great but he scared me out of it lol

 

[2021EcoDiesel]

I've been very happy with my Ecodiesel so far, I've now had it for almost 2 years, but to cover your points...

1) I absolutely notice a difference in fuel consumption while towing. My HEMI would struggle to get 11-12 MPG towing my old side by side on a 2 axle equipment trailer (App 5,500 pounds), where as the Eco managed about 17 on the same trip. between the cost of fuel, DEF, and somewhat higher maintenance costs, I'd say you might break even after a few years. While I don't think this motor will save you money, I think it's a trade off, you get more range and more torque in a perfect world. I was happy to take the risk of additional cost for the extended driving range I wanted, and as a diesel enthusiast I couldn't justify buying a Cummins HD truck so I bought the ECO.

2) So far I have 37,000 miles by no means a long term reliability test but the truck has yet to give me any issues, powertrain, emissions, or otherwise. I do believe FCA knew they had to get this motor right. Time will tell in the long run, and I plan on keeping this 1500 till it falls apart. Fingers crossed.

3) I'd say there are definitely more gasoline engine mechanics than there are diesel mechanics at most dealerships. Some dealerships certainly inspire more confidence than others, but Ram Dealers do have to work on Cummins engines too, so at least one tech/mechanic will have to be knowledgeable with modern diesel technology. Overall I agree with your concerns here and do think that most dealers will be able to help your HEMI truck more so than they would with your ECO truck.

4) From what I understand VM Motori will be making this motor for quite some time as they build them for many applications. However the engine is built in Italy, so shipping times will also be a big factor. I'm hoping supply chain issues continue to get better for my truck's sake.

5) Resale I think it will be desirable, maybe not quite as much as say a Cummins or a Mercury (Grand Marquis) Marauder, but there are plenty of people that like diesels who will pay for them. Provided all these 2020 and newer trucks don't start putting holes in their engine blocks or throwing crankshaft bearings...

But overall, do your own research and think about if the diesel is right for you. You'll be sacrificing some horsepower but gaining some torque, incurring some higher fuel costs but spending less time at the gas station, I love my ECO, it was the right choice for me.

 

[tom318]

I've had mine for little over 2yrs and have 67k miles now with 0 mechanical issues.

1. If you think you will save money long term you likely wont. Its possible if you do your own servicing and source parts online for cheaper prices then maybe you will be ahead after a few years. If you go with dealer servicing then forget about saving any money long term with this one unless your driving 30-40k+ miles a year and ignor deprciation. My thought is you need to "want" the Ecodiesel or prefer the driving experience. Buying one to save money = no chance in my opinion. I don't tow to often but when I do it does a great job and if your gentle on the throttle and conditions are right you can really get some good mpg. Best ive done with ~5500lbs with a car hauler loaded with 6atvs and dirt bike was 20mpg over 900 miles.

2. I do all my own servicing so I know correct oil was used and filters are changed when needed. It is a pricey truck to maintain especially if you wont do any maintenance yourself. Even doing my own oil changes and scoring a deal on oil im @ $70-80 per change(every 7500mi). Without scoring a deal is $100+, some dealers charge 200-300 so do you research on pricing from whoever you plan to use.

3. Need to be careful where you take the truck for any kind of work. Many aren't familiar with these engines and will treat it like a v8 f150 or HD diesel which could lead to issues.

4. I don't see any issues with parts, though the fuel pump recall seems to be an issue right now. New 2023s are still rolling into dealer lots and how long have you kept previous vehicles? Right now there is issues with parts for everything but its slowly returning to normal. My opinion would be to not worry to much about this one.

5. Only time will tell with this one. This truck seems to be the last of its kind and with that 33gal option I don't need see else on the market that gives yours 800-1000miles of range on one tank. I find that very appealing. If these engines prove to be reliable then I could see these being a hidden gem in years to come but who knows. If the engines blow up on everyone at 150k then we are all screwed.

This topic comes up a lot here and My opinion on this topic of "should I get the ecoD" is you need to WANT the diesel it and you need to LIKE the diesel. If your buying for any other reason you will likely be disappointed. Many will bring up that you will never make up the 5k upcharge of buying the diesel, to me that argument doesn't make much sense. No body is trying to make up the cost of going to the HEMI or opting for the 12'' screen, we choose those options because we want/like them. I think the EcoD option should be treated the same. I came from VW TDIs and so far I love mine and I'm happy I bought mine when I did!

 

[Sascwatch]

If you tow a lot the diesel makes sense, the fuel and maintenance both cost more negating some of the fuel economy savings. But mileage is greatly improved while towing.

My old gmc with the 5.3 averaged 28L/100km towing while my ecodiesel gets 17-18L/100km towing the same trailer on the same routes.

CP4 Fuel pump issues aren’t just on the ram trucks, every brand that was using the CP4 has had issues. Which have now lead to a recall on the early model trucks, 2022 and newer seem to have the upgraded pump already.

I’ve got well over 60k miles between my 2020 and 2022, many of which were towing a 7x17 enclosed tandem trailer for up to 3000km in one trip with zero mechanical issues.

I’ve had to have the def tank replaced on my 2020 due to a faulty def level sensor and a NoX sensor on my 2022. The def tank triggered the countdown to limp mode, while the sensor did not.

Overall I love the powertrain when compared to my 2010 gmc, but that truck also had 250k Km and was 10 years old by the time I upgraded. No the diesel isn’t a race engine, but it gets the job done.

I haven’t read about many of the new ecodiesels failing, timing cover leaks and a couple of fuel pump replacements is about it. Parts may become an issue down the road with the diesel being phased out, but the same can be said for the V8’s and the manufacturers replace those with smaller turbo charged engines. Only time will tell.

 

[John Jensen]

I agree 100% with all that is said in the previous three posts.
My 2016 Eco has been trouble free and only visited the dealer for recalls.
I'll happily own it until I can no longer drive.

 

[Jerome10]

On paper I liked everything I read about the ecodiesel and just a couple days ago I mentioned that I’m interested in getting an ecodiesel gladiator to my friend who’s a master technician and worked at CDJR dealers for 10 years and he immediately said “NO! DONT EVEN THINK ABOUT IT” lol. He didn’t go into too much detail but he said he had to replace tons of the 3rd Gen ecodiesels and they’re piles of garbage and especially with the CP4 fuel pump they’re nothing but problems. Like I said, this was his words & I consider him a very reliable source, but do your own research if you’d like It was enough to make me realize my hemi is just fine and the headaches of the ecodiesel aren’t worth the money I’d save in fuel lol. I do think in a perfect world if the engine & fuel pump were reliable it would be a fun engine to drive and the mpg would be great but he scared me out of it lol

Ok, helpful info. So issues even on this 3rd gen, eh?

 

[Jerome10]

I've been very happy with my Ecodiesel so far, I've now had it for almost 2 years, but to cover your points...

1) I absolutely notice a difference in fuel consumption while towing. My HEMI would struggle to get 11-12 MPG towing my old side by side on a 2 axle equipment trailer (App 5,500 pounds), where as the Eco managed about 17 on the same trip. between the cost of fuel, DEF, and somewhat higher maintenance costs, I'd say you might break even after a few years. While I don't think this motor will save you money, I think it's a trade off, you get more range and more torque in a perfect world. I was happy to take the risk of additional cost for the extended driving range I wanted, and as a diesel enthusiast I couldn't justify buying a Cummins HD truck so I bought the ECO.

2) So far I have 37,000 miles by no means a long term reliability test but the truck has yet to give me any issues, powertrain, emissions, or otherwise. I do believe FCA knew they had to get this motor right. Time will tell in the long run, and I plan on keeping this 1500 till it falls apart. Fingers crossed.

3) I'd say there are definitely more gasoline engine mechanics than there are diesel mechanics at most dealerships. Some dealerships certainly inspire more confidence than others, but Ram Dealers do have to work on Cummins engines too, so at least one tech/mechanic will have to be knowledgeable with modern diesel technology. Overall I agree with your concerns here and do think that most dealers will be able to help your HEMI truck more so than they would with your ECO truck.

4) From what I understand VM Motori will be making this motor for quite some time as they build them for many applications. However the engine is built in Italy, so shipping times will also be a big factor. I'm hoping supply chain issues continue to get better for my truck's sake.

5) Resale I think it will be desirable, maybe not quite as much as say a Cummins or a Mercury (Grand Marquis) Marauder, but there are plenty of people that like diesels who will pay for them. Provided all these 2020 and newer trucks don't start putting holes in their engine blocks or throwing crankshaft bearings...

But overall, do your own research and think about if the diesel is right for you. You'll be sacrificing some horsepower but gaining some torque, incurring some higher fuel costs but spending less time at the gas station, I love my ECO, it was the right choice for me.

Great feedback, appreciate you taking the time. Sounds very similar to me, and I also just have no need or really desire to go to a 3/4 ton truck either.

The real-world MPG is helpful as well. looks like you're getting about 40% better MPG with the diesel. I watched Alex on Autos lengthy review on an ED last night, he reported 50% MPG improvement. I've seen a couple other people say, I think they were more like 25' travel trailers though, that they were going from 8-9 on HEMI to 12-14 on ED, which is 33%-55% improvement depending on the numbers you use to calculate. Now, as I mentioned, I would be anywhere from 30%-40% more in fuel costs in my area (at this time). This pretty much eats up the MPG benefit from a pure cost perspective. And that ignores DEF and likely higher maintenance costs on the ED.

I didn't know that VM would keep making these. It appears, for now, that this engine will continue in Jeeps, correct? So hopefully that parts pipeline would not dry up if dealers are also needing things for Jeeps going forward.

While I understand fuel prices change, I don't think I can likely make a financial argument at this time just on fuel savings and fuel costs. Any financial benefit would appear to be more in resale (not a given) and hoping that it doesn't get eaten up by maintenance. If diesel prices ever normalize, maybe this becomes realistic, however, I am nearly certain I have lived in an area where Diesel has long been quite a bit more expensive that gasoline, though I don't know the historical spread between the two. I just know when I'd often go to the midwest to see family, I don't recall prices in Michigan being much different. Here in Idaho, I think diesel has always been quite a bit more.

So I guess the question comes down more to satisfaction and ease of towing HEMI vs ED. Just a more relaxed experience one vs the other. Easier time getting up to speed or holding a nice cruise in a comfortable gear, less noise etc.

At moment I'm still leaning towards the HEMI e-Torque. With basically zero financial reason to go ED, the somewhat unknown history on 3rd gens plus the bad rep on 1st and 2nd gens, more difficulty in finding a used truck equipped as I need, ED probably doesn't make sense. With that said, if the right truck came around I suspect I will at least be open to it.

 

[Jerome10]

CP4 Fuel pump issues aren’t just on the ram trucks, every brand that was using the CP4 has had issues. Which have now lead to a recall on the early model trucks, 2022 and newer seem to have the upgraded pump already.

Thanks for the info. I'll have to keep an eye on the fuel pump and if recall was performed should I find an ED that works for me.

 

[John Jensen]

Thanks for the info. I'll have to keep an eye on the fuel pump and if recall was performed should I find an ED that works for me.

FYI - no Eco pump recall has been completed yet. Still waiting on the part.

 

[Mchurch52]

There is an owner on one of the other sites that has over 150K trouble free miles on his Gen 3. I’d say by and large these are quite reliable and Ram got it right with this one. I have close to 60K between the 2020 I owned and now my 2021 and both were trouble free. Just take care of it and stay up on the maintenance. Remember too that it may be a $5000 upgrade over the base V-6, but is only $2500 more over the Hemi for 2023, so a great upgrade for the money if that is what you want. For me, I love the smoothness of the engine, the low end torque and the long range between fill ups.

As for the mechanic who said he’s replaced a ton of Gen 3 engines, I have a hard time believing that. I’m on most of the forums and have heard of very few problems and only a handful of failures with the Gen 3 engine. Many people lump the Gen 3 in with the Gen 2 and all of it’s problems, which is unfortunate.

 

[Chris3058]

Love mine. 2020 with 52k and zero mech issues. Zero. Had the normal window leak and some minor warranty issues and the HPFP recall is only issue I see. It’s great on the highway and kills gassers in MPG. I was gonna order a 23 ED Reb but missed the order cut off. So I may go with a 2500
Reb Cummins. May. Lol.

 

[Sascwatch]

I forgot to add that the 33 gallon fuel tank is a must if you tow often. The added range is much needed.

 

[Rammit]

I love the eco diesel idea but for whatever reason, they seem to have lots of issues. My friend has had two. His grand Cherokee ended up being purchased back via lemon law. A couple years later he tried it again in a 2020 Ram and the motor blew at 60k miles. Chrysler tied to deny the warranty but eventually replaced the motor. After months of waiting for a new motor, he got the truck back but it now had a constant squeak from somewhere that no one could resolve. He ended up trading it on a gmc unfortunately. I’m sure there are a lot of good experiences but after seeing this, I personally wouldn’t buy one

 

[J-Cooz]

85,000km on my 2020 and love it. Average 26-28mpg consistently, and get almost 20mpg towing my 7x16 enclosed snowmobile trailer.

I had a 5th gen Hemi before and it struggled to get 18mpg empty and downshifted at every single hill. The diesel chugs along in 8th gear.

DEF isn't even a cost I consider. It's $15-20 to fill my tank every 8,000km or so. I buy it straight from the pump at truck stops.

Does it save me money? Probably not. But I don't care. I enjoy the driving experience and love how it tows.

Sent from my SM-G781W using Tapatalk

 

[Jerome10]

I forgot to add that the 33 gallon fuel tank is a must if you tow often. The added range is much needed.

I'm definitely working to find a truck, HEMI or ED, that has this feature.... I could make it work without but I hear this recommended for towing so often.

 

[Jerome10]

85,000km on my 2020 and love it. Average 26-28mpg consistently, and get almost 20mpg towing my 7x16 enclosed snowmobile trailer.

I had a 5th gen Hemi before and it struggled to get 18mpg empty and downshifted at every single hill. The diesel chugs along in 8th gear.

DEF isn't even a cost I consider. It's $15-20 to fill my tank every 8,000km or so. I buy it straight from the pump at truck stops.

Does it save me money? Probably not. But I don't care. I enjoy the driving experience and love how it tows.

Sent from my SM-G781W using Tapatalk

Wow, ok, 20mpg with that trailer definitely impressive.

I'm not sure, as I said above, that it adds up financially, but it does sound like it is very likely a bit more "relaxed" experience with the ED and towing. Just kinda works, less shifting, less revving. That is a positive for sure.

 

[Ruger]

I ordered and received one of last ED and have no regrets whatsoever. It’s a great ride and whole different driving experience. I’m average 25 MGP and she only has 753 miles in her. She will be towing a 20’ pontoon and my enclosed trailer. To me it made sense to get the ED over the HEMI especially if you plan on towing anything at all. Bottom line is get what you want, you won’t go wrong with an ECO but you must want to own a diesel.

 

[Paco]

Traded my 2014 eco in, so I could get a new one in July 2022..
190,000 miles, ran like a top.
make sure you get a GDE tune, or you wont be happy.
Way more power than my current eco with the tune.

Best truck I have ever owned, besides the air suspension I had removed truck was solid.
The people having problems, could be the way they drive them???.

 

[tom318]

My thought on many of the previous gen failures is issues with oil types and oil change intervals. I suspect many people/shops/dealers used the incorrect oil or people pushed the intervals. Depends how people drive, many short trips + 10k mile oil changes and then possibly the wrong oil will, that would certainly shorten the life on these. Its hard to believe its a terrible engine when you have some pushing 300k on the 2nd gen. I think someone on here had over 600K. I want to say it was "VernDiesel"? Then others fail at 100k. Id bet money the dealer used the wrong oil on a bunch of these 2nd gen trucks......the techs probably see 100 Hemis for every 1 ED. Just my own theory with 0 facts backing it up......