Catalytic converter stolen; Progressive only endorse aftermarket converter, any issue?

[msy288]

Your original was probably here:

5 arrested, $4.3 million dollars worth of catalytic converter seized in coordinated raid

ABC13's cameras were there as authorities moved about 17 pallets from a home and officers carried out boxes of converters.

abc13.com

Haha probably I also watched the news. It has been crazy for the catalytic converter theft in Houston and other parts of the country. I hope all the catalytic converter thieves get life sentence.

 

[Cbty2050]

I have been watching your situation with interest, my renewal is up with progressive in 2 weeks and I am thinking of looking else where. I know things do not always go this bad but the potential is there. Went back and read the policy terms in full and they do not use oem parts and use "competitive labor rates".

Call body shops and see what they think of Progressive. That said I have them and have had a couple of claims. Most recently our travel took on some water, the repair shop sent an estimate and Progressive authorized the work within a day. The auto side, they just try to cut all the prices and shops hate them for it.

 

[GKIII]

What's the warranty book time from RAM? I'll bet it's closer to Progressive's cost.

 

[jl13]

Hope no more members here will go through all the troubles/hassles I have been dealing right now. I had spent so much time to make Progressive to approve on the OEM part. It is kind of funny that the manager of the in-network body shop Caliber Collision where the converter got stolen was pushing the aftermarket converter together with Progressive. That's why the repair at their in-network shop never incur estimate difference bc there is a reason that they are in-network. If the theft incident happened on my driveway instead of in their in-network body shop, I really doubt that Progressive would still agree to authorize the OEM part. The aftermarket catalytic is like $1k something or even less while the OEM one is over $5k (including 800 core charge bc the old one cannot be returned).

But I heard that a lot of main insurance companies (not only Progressive) like to go for the aftermarket. Someone mentioned earlier that USAA insurance allow you add OEM option on your insurance.

yea I wouldn't be surprise if only a few would do oem parts, I'll see how my search turns out

 

[jl13]

Your original was probably here:

5 arrested, $4.3 million dollars worth of catalytic converter seized in coordinated raid

ABC13's cameras were there as authorities moved about 17 pallets from a home and officers carried out boxes of converters.

abc13.com

its a nation way issue.
San Francisco just pass a similar law I heard.
Not sure what LA county is waiting on or doing

 

[Aseras]

Folks! Need your suggestion again. Right now Dealership and Progressive don't quite agree on the repair estimate. The estimate on the part (OEM cat converters, sensors and core charge) is roughly $5k+tax and both agree on this number. The disagreement is on the labor part. Dealership want to charge roughly $1,400 (7 hours labor) on the labor for installation of cat converter and the four oxygen sensors; while Progressive only agree the labor charge to be $500 (3 hours labor). So there is about $900 difference. Initially the dealership service advisor asked me to negotiate with Insurance; otherwise I will have to pay the difference. Yesterday I escalate the issue to the management level of both parties, and right now they agree to talk to each other.

The Insurance adjustor told me that nowhere is charging a cat converter installation for 6 hours labor time, while dealership told me 6 hours labor time is by their standard book. I understand that the estimate from Insurance is always lower than that from dealership, as the former tend to give low ball offer while the latter always want to overestimate the time. What should be my standing in this case? I have been through so many hassles/talks in the past few weeks and really feel exhausted. If the difference is like $100+ I will just pay out of my own pocket; no way that I pay for $900 difference. I told them that I don't want to get involved in the estimate negotiation at this stage and would like they give a solution first. What do you think? Thanks!

Tell the dealer to quote them to replace every single damaged part, no repairs, soldering or welding. They cut the flange, whole new pipe. Cut the wire, whole new harness. That's how you deal with insurance make it really really expensive.

 

[msy288]

Tell the dealer to quote them to replace every single damaged part, no repairs, soldering or welding. They cut the flange, whole new pipe. Cut the wire, whole new harness. That's how you deal with insurance make it really really expensive.

Got it. That is actually similar to what Insurance adjustor told me yesterday about the extra 1.5 hours on "re-soldering the wiring". I asked him why they don't cover this item in the estimate, and the adjustor said there is no "re-soldering" as the whole component is being replaced. Looks like the dealer service advisor really want to screw up everything by adding unnecessary items.

 

[HSKR R/T]

Got it. That is actually similar to what Insurance adjustor told me yesterday about the extra 1.5 hours on "re-soldering the wiring". I asked him why they don't cover this item in the estimate, and the adjustor said there is no "re-soldering" as the whole component is being replaced. Looks like the dealer service advisor really want to screw up everything by adding unnecessary items.

If they cut the factory harness when they took your cars, there is no easy way to replace the whole harness and that would be even more expensive. Sounds like dealer is using book time, but trying to make parts as reasonable as possible

 

[msy288]

If they cut the factory harness when they took your cars, there is no easy way to replace the whole harness and that would be even more expensive. Sounds like dealer is using book time, but trying to make parts as reasonable as possible

Thanks. I am not sure about that part (if the factory harness was taken when it got hit).

 

[Cbty2050]

What's the warranty book time from RAM? I'll bet it's closer to Progressive's cost.

Warranty time is 1.7.

 

[msy288]

Latest update: I am extremely frustrated with the service advisor based on what happened this evening. I called him all day (like 30 times) but no answer, and guess what, around 5pm he sent an email to Progressive adjustor (cc the service manager and myself), and telling him that 2 hours labor time (it is actually 3 hours, he cannot read) is too low and they insists 6 hours+. What **** me off is the next sentence "If you (progressive) are Ok, we can use this 2 hours to install the cat converter and the customer (me) will pay the rest four hours (O2 sensors/re-soldering wires) by himself. I got extreme angry reading this email, and headed to dealership immediately. Btw I had a meeting with him and his boss yesterday and they agreed to find a way to solve it. His boss even said we may consider lowering the hours. But now everything we discussed yesterday is like never happened before. It is 30 mins drive in the rush hour time to the dealership in Katy from my home.

When I arrived the dealership, I saw the guy (service advisor) there. Apparently he just ignored my call for 30+ times. And he even gave me an attitude there. I kind of lost control of myself and started to yell at him in the lobby (not many customers there but I did get all the attention). I told him that he cannot even read an estimate, as it clearly shows that labor time is 1 hour (converter) +0.5 hours for each O2 sensors = 3 hours, not 2 hours. The service manager heard my voice and came out to talk to me. I told him to request change of advisor on the spot, and he asked me to have a private talk outside. Then I told him all the story and what Dealership promised me to fix it smoothly when I was still deciding to tow my truck to dealership or not. I told him that if you guys don't want my business, I will ask Progressive to pay the part and tow it somewhere else to do installation. The service manager said he will step in and will review it again and let me know tomorrow how it goes. Regarding my request to change advisor, he said sorry that they could not do that but he promised from now on he will step in directly. I told him that I don't want to talk to that guy anymore.

I will keep you guys updated how it goes. It is like a TV drama. I don't know why I have done wrong to deserve all these craps, but I am not giving up. It is 3.5 hours (6.5 hours-3 hours) labor difference, which is like $800. Now to me it is not about the money, it is my dignity. I feel so humiliated by what happened to me as I was treated as a clown and a tool to negotiate with insurance to maximize their benefit. And I have been to that dealership like 10 times so far and all of them went well, except this one.

 

[Cbty2050]

How many connectors/wires need to be fixed? Are they damaged in a spot that is hard to get to? I'm trying to figure out why the labor to repair/replace everything is so high in my head.

 

[msy288]

How many connectors/wires need to be fixed? Are they damaged in a spot that is hard to get to? I'm trying to figure out why the labor to repair/replace everything is so high in my head.

I don’t know actually. They just keep saying according to “Pro Demand” (no idea what is that), it request 6.5 hours. Funny that I asked another service advisor that I knew previously, he said he just get two trucks repaired for stolen cat converter and the labor time is 3 hours below. But since they are colleagues I can’t use his words to argue with my service advisor.

 

[Dewey]

What a fiasco.

Glad you went in and raised hell in person. That’s exactly what they needed. Far too easy to avoid phone calls and emails. They’re a little more cooperative when you raise your voice in front of other customers. I’ve done that plenty of times over the years. That tends to set them in the right direction.

 

[boogielander]

what in the flying F is 6 hours of labor to install cat and o2 sensors... im noob tech and I've only done 3 cat installs in my life (2 mitsubishi, 1 civic) all three were done within 3 hours. if a noob like me can get it done well within book time i don't see why more experienced tech at the dealer cannot do it within book time. Heck, the 3 installs all include me taking smoke breaks because my hands are too big to fit in some of the tight spots and i was getting irritated and was cussing like a drunk sailor.
Also, there's nothing to solder. I assume the thieves cut the o2 sensor wires closer to the o2 sensor on the cat and exhaust piping, not all the way pass the connector on the harness. Just unclip the broken harness and clip in the new harness w/ o2 and done.

Does the dealer employ sloths or what

I'm getting pissed off just reading your story... sorry man.

 

[HSKR R/T]

I don’t know actually. They just keep saying according to “Pro Demand” (no idea what is that), it request 6.5 hours. Funny that I asked another service advisor that I knew previously, he said he just get two trucks repaired for stolen cat converter and the labor time is 3 hours below. But since they are colleagues I can’t use his words to argue with my service advisor.

Pro-demand is the program they use to determine labor time for the work to be done. You can't just ask someone else to get a quote without them seeing the truck to see the work required. If factory harness was cut, that will add time. Depending on where they cut the exhaust, that could change the labor rate.

As for all the drama over it, the body shop should have been on the hook for the repairs as it happened in their lot. Letting them talk your insurance company into footing the bill was the first mistake. It's not yours, or your insurance company's, responsibility to replace the cats that were stolen when the truck was in possession of the body shop.

I'm sorry you are going through all this. Should have just stood your ground with the initial body shop. Get lawyers involved if needed

 

[msy288]

Pro-demand is the program they use to determine labor time for the work to be done. You can't just ask someone else to get a quote without them seeing the truck to see the work required. If factory harness was cut, that will add time. Depending on where they cut the exhaust, that could change the labor rate.

As for all the drama over it, the body shop should have been on the hook for the repairs as it happened in their lot. Letting them talk your insurance company into footing the bill was the first mistake. It's not yours, or your insurance company's, responsibility to replace the cats that were stolen when the truck was in possession of the body shop.

I'm sorry you are going through all this. Should have just stood your ground with the initial body shop. Get lawyers involved if needed

I just could not make that body shop pay using their own insurance. I tried it but the best we could reach is to let them pay the deductible. And also even if they agree to repair using their insurance, I am pretty sure that they will go for the aftermarket one bc the cost difference is huge. Another factor that made me tow to dealership for the repair, is that the body shop got hit again a few days after my truck got hit. So two break-in in one week. I just cannot leave my trucks there as the thieves may come back for the third time easily.

 

[msy288]

what in the flying F is 6 hours of labor to install cat and o2 sensors... im noob tech and I've only done 3 cat installs in my life (2 mitsubishi, 1 civic) all three were done within 3 hours. if a noob like me can get it done well within book time i don't see why more experienced tech at the dealer cannot do it within book time. Heck, the 3 installs all include me taking smoke breaks because my hands are too big to fit in some of the tight spots and i was getting irritated and was cussing like a drunk sailor.
Also, there's nothing to solder. I assume the thieves cut the o2 sensor wires closer to the o2 sensor on the cat and exhaust piping, not all the way pass the connector on the harness. Just unclip the broken harness and clip in the new harness w/ o2 and done.

Does the dealer employ sloths or what

I'm getting pissed off just reading your story... sorry man.

Thanks. Since I didn't get a chance to see the damage, I am not sure how the wires have been cut by the thieves. But I am sure that the dealership did employ sloths to save money

 

[HSKR R/T]

I just could not make that body shop pay using their own insurance. I tried it but the best we could reach is to let them pay the deductible. And also even if they agree to repair using their insurance, I am pretty sure that they will go for the aftermarket one bc the cost difference is huge. Another factor that made me tow to dealership for the repair, is that the body shop got hit again a few days after my truck got hit. So two break-in in one week. I just cannot leave my trucks there as the thieves may come back for the third time easily.

You didn't have to leave it at that body shop for repairs. Federal laws allows you to use any body shop if your choice when going through insurance.

 

[Mystic Rhythms]

For anyone reading this issue, this works for body panels, any parts, anything really. Use a shop u trust and possibly know the owner or at least the person dealing with your car directly. Every aftermarket part that shows up, have them damage it, and send the pic to the insurance, after anything comes in damaged more than once, the insurance will just up the pay to the OEM part. Done it many times with a shop i highly trust, the lady that deals with the insurance will always get every dime she can out of them. My last vehicle i had in to her got upgraded parts over what was already on the car, it paid for my deductible, and i walked out with a check for overage.

A shop that is so honest it is willing to commit fraud.