Best Oil for Hemi "Tick"

[HSKR R/T]

You know what Silver Billet, you are turning me around. I'm not quite ready to convert, but I'm reading the pamphlets at the door.

Your last reply was interesting. I remember asking my service advisor about DIY my oil changes back in 2019 when I bought the truck, he said it's fine only if I use 5W-20 with FCA MS 6395, not to go 30W. He looked me in the eyes when he said that last part. I couldn't find 30W with that requirement at the time, so I assumed there was none due to that reason. But come to find, there are plenty of 30W with FCA MS 6395 these days.

I did call my service advisor today at another dealership about sticking with 5W-20, same response as before. However, based on Chryslers own manual, it shouldn't be an issue if I use a 30W if it has a MS 6395 certification. Though I don't like having to fight my dealership service if I drop a lifter 3 years from now and they get me for a 30W technicality. Interesting though, you got my mind moving a bit on this subject.

They would have to prove the small difference in viscosity was the cause of the failure. The Magnuson/Moss act is in your side with this

 

[Mountain Whiskey]

Is there a generally regarded "best" oil for the 5.7 engines?

Yes. The best oil is the slippery honey colored oil.

 

[SD Rebel]

They would have to prove the small difference in viscosity was the cause of the failure. The Magnuson/Moss act is in your side with this

Absolutely, but I can't force them to work on my truck if they don't want to. They will stick their hands in their pocket and say prove it. That's time and money that may not be worth the fight, it could take years and I can still lose at the end.

I'm still not convinced the 30W is an upgrade, I'm seen plenty of other people who say the opposite, but I'm less closed minded about it and researching it further.

 

[A4Owner]

I agree with a lot of the stuff said here. On Audi forums, its always a blown turbo, oil consumption or check engine lights. Without fail, when you do a little digging you find one of two "kinds" of Audi owners: a) some silly Accountant or Lawyer who buys the car purely for the key fob thinking that German cars are "superior" and therefore capable of going 30k miles in between oil changes and b) twerps with blue hair that think it is totally reasonable for a 2 liter, 4 cylinder turbo charged engine to produce 450 or 500 horsepower. My car has zero mods, is ALWAYS topped off with Motul 8100 as per the spec in the owners manual...and I drive the **** out of it...and surprise, surprise...ZERO engine issues...ever...

 

[silver billet]

You know what Silver Billet, you are turning me around. I'm not quite ready to convert, but I'm reading the pamphlets at the door.

Your last reply was interesting. I remember asking my service advisor about DIY my oil changes back in 2019 when I bought the truck, he said it's fine only if I use 5W-20 with FCA MS 6395, not to go 30W. He looked me in the eyes when he said that last part. I couldn't find 30W with that requirement at the time, so I assumed there was none due to that reason. But come to find, there are plenty of 30W with FCA MS 6395 these days.

I did call my service advisor today at another dealership about sticking with 5W-20, same response as before. However, based on Chryslers own manual, it shouldn't be an issue if I use a 30W if it has a MS 6395 certification. Though I don't like having to fight my dealership service if I drop a lifter 3 years from now and they get me for a 30W technicality. Interesting though, you got my mind moving a bit on this subject.

Neither HPL or Redline is ms 6395 certified, they are both "meet or exceeds". So that in and of itself would be enough for Ram to deny warranty if they wanted to, even if I picked the 5w-20 that the manual suggests.

I have less than 5000 kms left on my 100,000 km engine warranty. It's been on Redline and now HPL since about 15,000 kms IIRC. Never worried about the warranty though I can appreciate that others may not feel the same. I've always had that same thought in my mind, better to worry about extending the total life of the engine than to worry about the first quarter of its life where you are least likely to need it.

 

[HSKR R/T]

Absolutely, but I can't force them to work on my truck if they don't want to. They will stick their hands in their pocket and say prove it. That's time and money that may not be worth the fight, it could take years and I can still lose at the end.

I'm still not convinced the 30W is an upgrade, I'm seen plenty of other people who say the opposite, but I'm less closed minded about it and researching it further.

As long as you keep with regular oil changes at the interval you feel comfortable with, that doesn't go beyond the oil life monitor you will be fine

 

[A4Owner]

One thing I don't actually know (although I have a MAJOR hunch about) if whether chronically driving on LOW oil levels is bad for the engine? Now before you roll your eyes, doesn't the ECU "instruct" the oil pump to distribute - as best it can - equal volumes of oil throughout the engine during full and low oil conditions? NOTE that I am not discussing pressure or throttle application versus idling in this situation. This is purely on dumb owners who do not physically check their oil levels, ever.

 

[1BADRAMLIMITED]

Pennzoil Ultra Platinum 5w20 comes up a lot. Anyone pound the you-know-what out of their hemi, or worse, sit idling for days!!!! and have no issues after putting in Pennzoil Ultra Plat?

Put me down for ultra platinum. Keeps my hemi nice and quiet/smooth! (5w20)

 

[HSKR R/T]

One thing I don't actually know (although I have a MAJOR hunch about) if whether chronically driving on LOW oil levels is bad for the engine? Now before you roll your eyes, doesn't the ECU "instruct" the oil pump to distribute - as best it can - equal volumes of oil throughout the engine during full and low oil conditions? NOTE that I am not discussing pressure or throttle application versus idling in this situation. This is purely on dumb owners who do not physically check their oil levels, ever.

The PCM/ECU has no control over the mechanical oil pump.

 

[BowDown]

Absolutely, but I can't force them to work on my truck if they don't want to. They will stick their hands in their pocket and say prove it. That's time and money that may not be worth the fight, it could take years and I can still lose at the end.

I'm still not convinced the 30W is an upgrade, I'm seen plenty of other people who say the opposite, but I'm less closed minded about it and researching it further.

It's not an upgrade. If you tracked the truck and kept oil temps above 250-270 for a consistent amount of time, it would be an upgrade but you're not.

The prescribed oil will be fine for 99% of the people driving these trucks so no, 5w30 isn't a needed or worthwhile upgrade. Too many people act like they're driving these trucks 8, 9 or 10 tenths and need extra protection when they're actually closer to 2 or 3 tenths, even when towing.

 

[BowDown]

One thing I don't actually know (although I have a MAJOR hunch about) if whether chronically driving on LOW oil levels is bad for the engine? Now before you roll your eyes, doesn't the ECU "instruct" the oil pump to distribute - as best it can - equal volumes of oil throughout the engine during full and low oil conditions? NOTE that I am not discussing pressure or throttle application versus idling in this situation. This is purely on dumb owners who do not physically check their oil levels, ever.

No. The oil pump is driven off the crank shaft and controlled solely by engine rpm.

Low oil volume would cause you to suck the pan dry intermittently causing a starved bearing or piston bore scarring

 

[silver billet]

It's not an upgrade. If you tracked the truck and kept oil temps above 250-270 for a consistent amount of time, it would be an upgrade but you're not.

The prescribed oil will be fine for 99% of the people driving these trucks so no, 5w30 isn't a needed or worthwhile upgrade. Too many people act like they're driving these trucks 8, 9 or 10 tenths and need extra protection when they're actually closer to 2 or 3 tenths, even when towing.

My truck sees regular towing between april and november, and it used to see pretty high temps at and above 250. This is far too high, I've now running a 180 tstat and use a high quality oil. Last year the highest I've seen was 230 (while towing) which is better. The tstat is what brought the temps down, the oil protects better at higher temps.

The simple fact is, everybody can switch to a 30 weight and it doesn't cost any extra, nor does it hurt you in any way. This is called a "free upgrade", it's a no brainer.

I believe this graphic sums the thread up nicely:

 

[silver billet]

One thing I don't actually know (although I have a MAJOR hunch about) if whether chronically driving on LOW oil levels is bad for the engine? Now before you roll your eyes, doesn't the ECU "instruct" the oil pump to distribute - as best it can - equal volumes of oil throughout the engine during full and low oil conditions? NOTE that I am not discussing pressure or throttle application versus idling in this situation. This is purely on dumb owners who do not physically check their oil levels, ever.

Lets stop at the first sentence. How do you get chronically low oil? I hope that's just theoretical, my truck doesn't use a drop of oil even after a summer of frequent towing.

 

[RAL]

My truck sees regular towing between april and november, and it used to see pretty high temps at and above 250. This is far too high, I've now running a 180 tstat and use a high quality oil. Last year the highest I've seen was 230 (while towing) which is better. The tstat is what brought the temps down, the oil protects better at higher temps.

The simple fact is, everybody can switch to a 30 weight and it doesn't cost any extra, nor does it hurt you in any way. This is called a "free upgrade", it's a no brainer.

I believe this graphic sums the thread up nicely:

Candidly, the graphic sums up only that you won't stop beating that poor animal until everyone agrees with you. If you were truly confident in your views, you'd put them out there for consideration and then let folks decide themselves. I've done enough racing, wrenching, and towing that I for one don't need the repeated brow-beating. The family business is also contracting / construction, so we have run enough pickups (from all of Chevy, Ram, and Ford) regularly towing heavy loads, pushing snow, etc. up to 300-350k miles with no internal engine issues. Now my dad is also fastidious about maintenance - oil is changed on all the equipment regularly with what the manufacturer specifies, but there are no fancy boutique oils and no over-thinking going up or down in viscosity. But do you know what typically kills our trucks? Not engine failures, but everything else - transmissions start to slip, frames rust when they are doing salting and plowing, the trucks just wear out generally after about 15 years or so. Engine lubrication is not the issue. My dad's last Ram 1500, that he just retired, went to 325k miles using this approach. You know what killed it? Door rust and the transmission started to slip. We should call Ram and demand a refund . . . .

The other thing that is really interesting here is the psychology. A lot of these trucks cost at least $50k, many hit the $80k mark. For most people, that is the most expensive purchase you will make after a home. So, if one is rational, one would only buy something that expensive in relative terms from people or a company where you have some degree of confidence in their knowledge, in terms of their ability to deliver a well built vehicle. But yet, you buy the truck from them and you really think they are going to spec an oil that is going to result in engine damage? (And don't tell me they don't care at all what happens out of warranty -- I know from professional experience that automobile companies spend millions learning about what motivates customer loyalty, and destroys it, as customer retention is a major goal of all car companies.) If they are that incompetent or dishonest that they cannot correctly spec the viscosity of the motor oil to be used, why would you buy the truck from them? What about the rest of the car? They had competence and integrity with the rest of it, just not with the motor? With all respect, nothing you are saying holds up to any sort of rational or fact-based analysis, other than the fact that a bunch of folks with too much time on their hands to think about motor oil talk about this stuff incessantly on websites like Bob is the oil guy or whatever the name of it is. (I remember reading that blog years ago and there was some genius over there who was running 0w16 oil in a Ferrari. He was a doctor, a cosmetic surgeon if I am not mistaken, so not a dope but not qualified on the subject. He ignored Ferrari's recommendation and got quite a fan base over there. Me? I'll go with the advice on oil viscosity from the guys who also build the F1 cars.)

Now if you are out of warranty, or the call is otherwise on your nickel, and you want to increase to a -30 viscosity, then go ahead and do so. That is your call and as I think I said earlier in the thread, I would be very surprised if it caused any issues. But if you think it is going to materially extend the life of the truck, all else being equal in terms of keeping the truck maintained generally, you are attaching far too much emphasis and over-thinking what is a relatively minor factor in vehicle longevity.

 

[BowDown]

My truck sees regular towing between april and november, and it used to see pretty high temps at and above 250. This is far too high, I've now running a 180 tstat and use a high quality oil. Last year the highest I've seen was 230 (while towing) which is better. The tstat is what brought the temps down, the oil protects better at higher temps.

The simple fact is, everybody can switch to a 30 weight and it doesn't cost any extra, nor does it hurt you in any way. This is called a "free upgrade", it's a no brainer.

I believe this graphic sums the thread up nicely:

Oil temps at 250° aren't hot, esp for a synthetic. If you want to believe it's an upgrade then by all means however until I see tangible real results between the two, no, its not.
If you have those results, post them up

 

[BowDown]

Candidly, the graphic sums up only that you won't stop beating that poor animal until everyone agrees with you. If you were truly confident in your views, you'd put them out there for consideration and then let folks decide themselves. I've done enough racing, wrenching, and towing that I for one don't need the repeated brow-beating. The family business is also contracting / construction, so we have run enough pickups (from all of Chevy, Ram, and Ford) regularly towing heavy loads, pushing snow, etc. up to 300-350k miles with no internal engine issues. Now my dad is also fastidious about maintenance - oil is changed on all the equipment regularly with what the manufacturer specifies, but there are no fancy boutique oils and no over-thinking going up or down in viscosity. But do you know what typically kills our trucks? Not engine failures, but everything else - transmissions start to slip, frames rust when they are doing salting and plowing, the trucks just wear out generally after about 15 years or so. Engine lubrication is not the issue. My dad's last Ram 1500, that he just retired, went to 325k miles using this approach. You know what killed it? Door rust and the transmission started to slip. We should call Ram and demand a refund . . . .

The other thing that is really interesting here is the psychology. A lot of these trucks cost at least $50k, many hit the $80k mark. For most people, that is the most expensive purchase you will make after a home. So, if one is rational, one would only buy something that expensive in relative terms from people or a company where you have some degree of confidence in their knowledge, in terms of their ability to deliver a well built vehicle. But yet, you buy the truck from them and you really think they are going to spec an oil that is going to result in engine damage? (And don't tell me they don't care at all what happens out of warranty -- I know from professional experience that automobile companies spend millions learning about what motivates customer loyalty, and destroys it, as customer retention is a major goal of all car companies.) If they are that incompetent or dishonest that they cannot correctly spec the viscosity of the motor oil to be used, why would you buy the truck from them? What about the rest of the car? They had competence and integrity with the rest of it, just not with the motor? With all respect, nothing you are saying holds up to any sort of rational or fact-based analysis, other than the fact that a bunch of folks with too much time on their hands to think about motor oil talk about this stuff incessantly on websites like Bob is the oil guy or whatever the name of it is. (I remember reading that blog years ago and there was some genius over there who was running 0w16 oil in a Ferrari. He was a doctor, a cosmetic surgeon if I am not mistaken, so not a dope but not qualified on the subject. He ignored Ferrari's recommendation and got quite a fan base over there. Me? I'll go with the advice on oil viscosity from the guys who also build the F1 cars.)

Now if you are out of warranty, or the call is otherwise on your nickel, and you want to increase to a -30 viscosity, then go ahead and do so. That is your call and as I think I said earlier in the thread, I would be very surprised if it caused any issues. But if you think it is going to materially extend the life of the truck, all else being equal in terms of keeping the truck maintained generally, you are attaching far too much emphasis and over-thinking what is a relatively minor factor in vehicle longevity.

Exactly and same here.
As I said earlier, no one driving these trucks are pushing the oil anywhere near its limits, not even close so to believe 5w30 is a magic elixir over 5w20 is laughable especially when the real solution is regular oil changes.

I'd bet anyone here that changing the oil at 5-6K miles is a far better bet on engine longevity than switching to 5w30 or any of the boutique brands.

 

[silver billet]

Nobody here is brow beating. There are 2 separate things going on here, 1) a 30 weight offers more protection than a 20 weight all else equal, this is a fact not an opinion. 2) do we "need" the higher protection?

I'm perfectly fine with people saying "no" to the second question, you run what you want to run. Just don't leave posts saying that 30 weight isn't better, because it is and that is a black and white fact.

So lets say we're out in antarctic and it's -60 and we need to walk outside. You have a choice between 2 coats, a really thick and warm parka or a spring jacket. The one is factually thicker than the other and will always keep you warmer (30 weight), do you need the parka? Well I'm going to wear it all times because they're the same price and I like being warmer, but you guys do you. If you only walk outside for 10 seconds, you can get away with the spring jacket, but if you're towing or racing (not that likely in a truck) then the parka makes more and more sense.

And, I do have UOA's and the highest amounts of copper and iron were on Redline 5w-20. The report before and after that run were RL 5w-30 and both those were run longer, with towing, and had lower wear numbers.

My run with mobil 1 0w-40 had some pretty low numbers too IIRC.

I'll get some of this together shortly, busy at work right now.

 

[BowDown]

Mobil 1 0w40 probably wears the best as its eurospec with high amounts of ZDDP but the downside of high amounts of ZDDP is that it kills catalytic convertors which is something the delvac crowd may want to pay attention to

The Effects of Zinc Oil Additives on Older Engines | Rislone

Almost everyone who’s into cars has an older vehicle that they love. Whether it’s the feeling that they get behind the wheel or the way the car looks parked in their driveway, they pour their time and effort into maintaining the car and keeping it looking like it’s just been driven off of the...

rislone.com

 

[silver billet]

Mobil 1 0w40 probably wears the best as its eurospec with high amounts of ZDDP but the downside of high amounts of ZDDP is that it kills catalytic convertors which is something the delvac crowd may want to pay attention to

The Effects of Zinc Oil Additives on Older Engines | Rislone

Almost everyone who’s into cars has an older vehicle that they love. Whether it’s the feeling that they get behind the wheel or the way the car looks parked in their driveway, they pour their time and effort into maintaining the car and keeping it looking like it’s just been driven off of the...

rislone.com

That's only a problem if you're burning/using oil excessively. My truck doesn't use a drop.

The bigger issue I had with mobil 1 is that I believe HPL to be a better oil, it is incredibly good at cleaning engines which mobil 1 doesn't do, and m1 is also low on moly which I don't like. Some guys spike it with LubeGuard but then you're playing tribologist and there is a danger that you make your oil worse by throwing the formula out. I want a perfectly formulated oil right from the producer without using additives.

So in my opinion (and I'm admitting this is my opinion here): the oils are ranked:
HPL (supercar/no vii/premium plus)
Redline 5w-30
Mobil 1 FS 0w-40 (optionally with LG)

I don't think m1 is a bad oil, I just think HPL offers more and I'm willing to pay for it. Redline has been changing their formula and we're not sure anymore what's going on with it. The old 5w-30 was excellent too, but again HPL beats it; it has much longer life in the pan (Redline isn't a long interval oil) and appears to clean better to boot.

 

[BowDown]

That's only a problem if you're burning/using oil excessively. My truck doesn't use a drop.

The bigger issue I had with mobil 1 is that I believe HPL to be a better oil, it is incredibly good at cleaning engines which mobil 1 doesn't do, and m1 is also low on moly which I don't like. Some guys spike it with LubeGuard but then you're playing tribologist and there is a danger that you make your oil worse by throwing the formula out. I want a perfectly formulated oil right from the producer without using additives.

So in my opinion (and I'm admitting this is my opinion here): the oils are ranked:
HPL (supercar/no vii/premium plus)
Redline 5w-30
Mobil 1 FS 0w-40 (optionally with LG)

I don't think m1 is a bad oil, I just think HPL offers more and I'm willing to pay for it. Redline has been changing their formula and we're not sure anymore what's going on with it. The old 5w-30 was excellent too, but again HPL beats it; it has much longer life in the pan (Redline isn't a long interval oil) and appears to clean better to boot.

The factory PCV system allows oil in the intake and into your cylinders where it burns, unless you have a catch can.
Those maybe fine oils and I'm sure they are but are they needed is the question. I say no but everyone should take this info and do what they please.