UAW to strike at midnight tonight at GM

[GraniteRam]

Some of those people are still employed there.

One or two people that make $90k a year doesn't make them the average employee like the article states. GM is the one that made that statement in the article to make it seem like UAW workers have pockets full of money so they look bad to the public eye. Skilled trades have their own separate contract also.

 

[silver billet]

Wrong.
The function of government is to protect the rights of citizens. Healthcare is not (and never has been) an essential “service” of governing. Healthcare, like housing, food, water, etc. are personal responsibilities. It is the citizen’s responsibility to procure such services, not the government’s responsibility to provide them. That is not the role of government.
You present the assertion that people cannot afford healthcare, yet ignore the cause. Outside of the disabled and infirm, who are the realm of charity, those who cannot afford (insert any expense here) have simply failed to earn the income that would enable such purchase or have spent frivolously in other ways, which is a result of their own inability to prioritize their spending.
I knew a guy making minimum wage who had a nicer/newer phone than I did.
My tenants at my rental had a larger TV and a newer, more expensive car than I did.
People CAN “afford it”, they just choose to instead invest in entertainment related liabilities then complain that no one is taking care of them, apparently oblivious to their responsibility for same.

Again you cherry pick pieces of the argument. Government is not just there to protect the rights of citizens, it is there to provide services which are otherwise simply not going to be done properly, like roads etc. Can you imagine a libertarian society with people paying to use "the best roads"? What a mess. It'd be just as bad as health care is now.

The thing you guys refuse to accept, is that some services can be provided better, and without "prejudice" by the government. They can do it fairly and equably for all. Any service which fits that requirement (like health, education, roads, garbage disposal) NEEDS to be done by the government. It trully is essential for healthcare to be accessible and affordable to all. Your economy will be much stronger when your middle class workforce is strong.

Why does the government do it better? Because they don't put money as the first priority. Yes money is important and a service must be provided responsibly, but the government can do it without trying to make a profit, (ie: "for cost"), a corporation cannot. A corporation MUST make profit, and in a capitalist society it needs to make more and more every quarter. That intense drive to make a profit is the difference between a government provided service, and a corporate service.

You still haven't explained why the US healthcare system costs the most in the world per capita, with the least coverage, causing the most bankruptices. It's a very poor system, the facts are not on your side when you compare your healthcare vs the rest of the first world.

And you also haven't explained your logically inconsistent viewpoint: if healthcare shouldn't be government funded, why is public school education federally/state funded? And would you prefer that to stop?

 

[silver billet]

Did you not read my comment?
I never asked for a raise.
I changed employers. The union was not a factor in anyone’s ability to change an employer, then or now.

I was talking "you" in the plural.

 

[SpeedyV]

Again you cherry pick pieces of the argument. Government is not just there to protect the rights of citizens, it is there to provide services which are otherwise simply not going to be done properly, like roads etc. Can you imagine a libertarian society with people paying to use "the best roads"? What a mess. It'd be just as bad as health care is now.

The thing you guys refuse to accept, is that some services can be provided better, and without "prejudice" by the government. They can do it fairly and equably for all. Any service which fits that requirement (like health, education, roads, garbage disposal) NEEDS to be done by the government. It trully is essential for healthcare to be accessible and affordable to all. Your economy will be much stronger when your middle class workforce is strong.

Why does the government do it better? Because they don't put money as the first priority. Yes money is important and a service must be provided responsibly, but the government can do it without trying to make a profit, (ie: "for cost"), a corporation cannot. A corporation MUST make profit, and in a capitalist society it needs to make more and more every quarter. That intense drive to make a profit is the difference between a government provided service, and a corporate service.

You still haven't explained why the US healthcare system costs the most in the world per capita, with the least coverage, causing the most bankruptices. It's a very poor system, the facts are not on your side when you compare your healthcare vs the rest of the first world.

And you also haven't explained your logically inconsistent viewpoint: if healthcare shouldn't be government funded, why is public school education federally/state funded? And would you prefer that to stop?

First, a disclaimer: This is an entertaining thread, and I hesitate to interrupt.

But please consider the argument carefully. Infrastructure projects such as “roads” are increasingly being funded and even operated through PPPs (public-private partnerships) or even completely privately. Governments almost never prove to be innovative or fast-acting; this presents a problem in high growth areas when it comes to infrastructure.

In Texas, where I’d be willing to bet more roads are built than 90% of other states or countries, these partnerships based on private funding have become common practice. A few years back, I lived within 15 minutes of roughly $8 billion of such projects. And ALL of them included the addition of “pay for use”, variable-rate toll lanes that pay back the private financier over a 50-year period (while also obligating this private party to maintain said roads).

In these projects, the private party is doing (most of) the actual work, and government is simply “protecting the rights of the people” (@VoiceOfReason’s argument) by ensuring the project meets certain design standards.

Carry on!

 

[StrangeGuy]

Again you cherry pick pieces of the argument. Government is not just there to protect the rights of citizens, it is there to provide services which are otherwise simply not going to be done properly, like roads etc. Can you imagine a libertarian society with people paying to use "the best roads"? What a mess. It'd be just as bad as health care is now.

The thing you guys refuse to accept, is that some services can be provided better, and without "prejudice" by the government. They can do it fairly and equably for all. Any service which fits that requirement (like health, education, roads, garbage disposal) NEEDS to be done by the government. It trully is essential for healthcare to be accessible and affordable to all. Your economy will be much stronger when your middle class workforce is strong.

Why does the government do it better? Because they don't put money as the first priority. Yes money is important and a service must be provided responsibly, but the government can do it without trying to make a profit, (ie: "for cost"), a corporation cannot. A corporation MUST make profit, and in a capitalist society it needs to make more and more every quarter. That intense drive to make a profit is the difference between a government provided service, and a corporate service.

You still haven't explained why the US healthcare system costs the most in the world per capita, with the least coverage, causing the most bankruptices. It's a very poor system, the facts are not on your side when you compare your healthcare vs the rest of the first world.

And you also haven't explained your logically inconsistent viewpoint: if healthcare shouldn't be government funded, why is public school education federally/state funded? And would you prefer that to stop?

There are so many things incorrect in this post that it doesn't even deserve a detailed reply, at least not here. It sounds like you don't even live in the USA. In addition, this post is very far off the thread topic. An international activist has plenty of room on Facebook, Twitter, etc. I don't think a Truck forum needs it.

 

[silver billet]

There are so many things incorrect in this post that it doesn't even deserve a detailed reply, at least not here. It sounds like you don't even live in the USA. In addition, this post is very far off the thread topic. An international activist has plenty of room on Facebook, Twitter, etc. I don't think a Truck forum needs it.

"International activist".

Look, I admitted I'm not American, but one reason why I'm not shy discussing American politics is because your decisions (as a country) quite often end up affecting us here in Canada. One very relevant example: the recent tariffs. There are many others.

As for this being a "truck forum", heaven forbid us having a friendly discussion on something not related to trucks, eh? That's the nature of discussion, it changes from the original topic naturally, nothing wrong with that unless the original poster is complaining. You may not think a truck forum needs it, but no one is forcing you to read this thread.

But I promise this is my last post on this (yeah, I know said that before).

 

[VoiceOfReason]

the government can do it without trying to make a profit

That is part of the problem. Who funds the government? The government does not have to compete for funding because the funding it receives is compulsory. That lack of competition breeds rampant incompetence. I live in Michigan.
Come try out our roads. That is government quality right there.

Also, while certain services are impracticable to privatize (police, fire, certain aspects of infrastructure), others are not (education, communications, waste removal), and often do get privatized, or have privatized options, or are done under contracts with non-government corporations.

 

[drstein]

Want something screwed up, let the Government run it.

 

[VoiceOfReason]

I was talking "you" in the plural.

"Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery."
And, no, you were not, but nice try at saving face after being caught wrong, again.

 

[JF19Longhorn]

Silver billet: Sorry, this just made me laugh "Can you imagine a libertarian society with people paying to use "the best roads"?" You must not live on the east coast of the US. We pay ridiculous tolls, it seems like every 5 miles, and the roads are still ****! So even payingto use the 'best roads' doesn't work! HAHAHAHA!!!

 

[Drewster]

GM: Joke's on you - we can't get processors for the modules we need to build the vehicles anyway

 

[silver billet]

Silver billet: Sorry, this just made me laugh "Can you imagine a libertarian society with people paying to use "the best roads"?" You must not live on the east coast of the US. We pay ridiculous tolls, it seems like every 5 miles, and the roads are still ****! So even payingto use the 'best roads' doesn't work! HAHAHAHA!!!

Sorry for your shi++y roads. There are many places in the world where they travel on well maintained, government roads, maybe you just need to "get out more", see the rest of the world?

 

[JF19Longhorn]

Oh, I've seen alot of the world and rode some amazing roads.

The comment just made me laugh.

 

[Jako]

Silver billet: Sorry, this just made me laugh "Can you imagine a libertarian society with people paying to use "the best roads"?" You must not live on the east coast of the US. We pay ridiculous tolls, it seems like every 5 miles, and the roads are still ****! So even payingto use the 'best roads' doesn't work! HAHAHAHA!!!

NYC - I think the roads are doing better BUT the tolls are just high high and higher. Cash toll (via Mail) is $35.00 (19.00 + 16.00) from Brooklyn to NJ and back. Ouch!