Stellantis fires hundreds of engineers

[AV8OR]

 

[Dewey]

Hopefully it was the engineers who were responsible for designing exhaust manifolds, leaking rear windows, uConnect 5 and getting rid of the V8.

Outsourcing to other countries is never good to hear. I don’t like the sound of that at all.

 

[vincentw56]

Hopefully it was the engineers who were responsible for designing exhaust manifolds, leaking rear windows, uConnect 5 and getting rid of the V8.

Outsourcing to other countries is never good to hear. I don’t like the sound of that at all.

And eTorque.

 

[dajogejr]

Tech jobs, pushed to other countries.. like India, where developers are cheap, plentiful, and disposable.

 

[theblet]

And eTorque.

And EVs

 

[frisby5]

Stellantis also made a deal With Commie California !

 

[66Fuelie]

The company I retired from pushed most software programming, accounting and a lot of production to India?
They will wonder why American has lost its manufacturing capability when we go to the next war.
Tom

 

[Rick3478]

Got to get rid of the people who designed reliable hardware to make room for the software "engineers".

 

[vincentw56]

Got to get rid of the people who designed reliable hardware to make room for the software "engineers".

Guess us software engineers aren't real "engineers".

 

[66Fuelie]

I agree with Vincentw56, I wrote software for many years. Still do on a contract basis.
Tom

 

[Eighty]

Guess us software engineers aren't real "engineers".

Unless you have an engineering license from the state you live in, it's technically illegal to call yourself an engineer. The only exception is railroad engineers.

I'm a licensed engineer (structural), and I have to do continuing education every year to maintain my license - and they always stress that heavily.

 

[vincentw56]

Unless you have an engineering license from the state you live in, it's technically illegal to call yourself an engineer. The only exception is railroad engineers.

I'm a licensed engineer (structural), and I have to do continuing education every year to maintain my license - and they always stress that heavily.

Doubt that. Considering that's my official title at my company and no one has a arrested us.

 

[Eighty]

Doubt that. Considering that's my official title at my company and no one has a arrested us.

Here's an excerpt from Texas statute (other states have similar language). I don't see software engineering in the list of allowed exceptions. Not trying to pick a fight, just saying that there are laws regarding the use of the term "engineer".

A person may not use the name, title, or words that convey to the public that a person is offering to perform engineering services to the public unless licensed under the requirements of the Act. The Act allows for the use or variation of the term "engineer" in a limited manner as summarized in this section.
(1) Pursuant to §1001.004(e)(1) of the Act, a person may use the term "engineer" or variation of the term to identify the name and trade in affiliation with an engineers' labor organization.
(2) Pursuant to §1001.055(b)(2) of the Act, a person who installs, operates, repairs or services any equipment or apparatus as listed in the statute may not use the term "engineer" unless authorized by another provision in the Act.
(3) Pursuant to §1001.061(b)(2) of the Act, a person employed by an operating telephone company or an affiliate of an operating telephone company engaged strictly in the art and science of telephony may use the term "engineer" in the person's job title or personnel classification if the person does not offer engineering services to the public and if the designation does not imply that the person is licensed under the Act.
(4) Pursuant to §1001.062(b) of the Act, a person who is a regular full-time employee of a private business entity that implements the design or specification sealed by an engineer licensed under the Act may use the term "engineer" in the person's job title or personnel classification if the person does not use the designation in conjunction with an offer to perform engineering services for the public.
(5) Pursuant to §1001.066(2) of the Act, a person employed by a business entity whose products or services consist of space vehicles, services or technology required by the National Aeronautical and Space Administration (NASA) may use the terms "engineer" or "engineering" in the person's job title or personnel classification if the person only uses the designation in association with the products and services related to NASA.
(6) Pursuant to §1001.301(f) of the Act, a person who is a regular employee of a business entity that is engaged in engineering activities but exempt from the licensure requirements under §1001.057 or §1001.058 of the Act may use the term "engineer" on business cards and forms of correspondence made available to the public providing the person does not:
(A) offer to perform engineering services to the public;
(B) use the designation outside the scope of §1001.057 or §1001.058 to convey the ability or willingness to perform engineering services or make an engineering judgment requiring a licensed professional engineer.
(7) Pursuant to §1001.406(a)(2) of the Act, a person who has an undergraduate or graduate degree from an engineering program accredited by ABET may use the term "graduate engineer" on the person's business cards and in any forms of correspondence or personal communication.
(8) Pursuant to §1001.406(b) of the Act, a person who has an undergraduate or graduate degree from an engineering program accredited by ABET and who is employed by a firm registered pursuant to Chapter 135 of this title and under the direct supervision of a licensed professional engineer may use the term "engineer" on the person's business cards and in any forms of correspondence or personal communication.

 

[Eighty]

And since you're from California, here's an excerpt from California statute:

6704. Defines who may use engineer titles (a) In order to safeguard life, health, property, and public welfare, no person shall practice civil, electrical, or mechanical engineering unless appropriately licensed or specifically exempted from licensure under this chapter, and only persons licensed under this chapter shall be entitled to take and use the titles “consulting engineer,” “professional engineer,” or “registered engineer,” or any combination of those titles or abbreviations thereof, and according to licensure with the board the engineering branch titles specified in Section 6732, or the authority titles specified in Sections 6736 and 6736.1, or the title “engineer-in-training.” (b) The provisions of this section shall not prevent the use of the title “consulting engineer” by a person who has qualified for and maintained exemption for using that title under the provisions of Section 6732.1, or by a person licensed as a photogrammetric surveyor.

 

[stevj]

Wow! I can be an engineer in Texas and California. Sweet!!

Steve

 

[vincentw56]

And since you're from California, here's an excerpt from California statute:

6704. Defines who may use engineer titles (a) In order to safeguard life, health, property, and public welfare, no person shall practice civil, electrical, or mechanical engineering unless appropriately licensed or specifically exempted from licensure under this chapter, and only persons licensed under this chapter shall be entitled to take and use the titles “consulting engineer,” “professional engineer,” or “registered engineer,” or any combination of those titles or abbreviations thereof, and according to licensure with the board the engineering branch titles specified in Section 6732, or the authority titles specified in Sections 6736 and 6736.1, or the title “engineer-in-training.” (b) The provisions of this section shall not prevent the use of the title “consulting engineer” by a person who has qualified for and maintained exemption for using that title under the provisions of Section 6732.1, or by a person licensed as a photogrammetric surveyor.

I'm not from California. Anyway, looks job title and professional services to the public is different things. So, we are both right. Legally without certification, I cannot offer software engineering services to the public. But my internal job title is fine as long as the company isn't "selling" me as one without certification. The issue is with being minimalized because I engineer software.

On a side note, I never liked the title anyway. With over 40 years of software development experience, I have had almost every title.

 

[Darksteel165]

Unless you have an engineering license from the state you live in, it's technically illegal to call yourself an engineer. The only exception is railroad engineers.

I'm a licensed engineer (structural), and I have to do continuing education every year to maintain my license - and they always stress that heavily.

I'm a Senior Infrastructure Engineer.
I don't have an engineering license.
Engineer is just a word, it's what it gets attached to which makes it illegal. You can't call yourself a Civil Engineer without a license.
My instance does not (though it could be confused as I don't work on infrastructure like bridges, except for businesses entire digital infrastructure).

The laws you are stating have a very particular meaning and jobset and don't restrict the term engineer for anything except those exact fields, IT not being one.


This is for MA

5.08: Use of Title Engineer or Land Surveyor No person, other than a Registrant holding a current License to practice in the applicable profession, shall advertise or hold themselves out as either a Professional Engineer or a Professional Land Surveyor, or use any other title to imply that they are qualified to practice engineering or land surveying in the Commonwealth, or in any other way hold themselves out as able to perform any of the Licensed Branches of engineering or land surveying. For companies that offer engineering or land surveying services to the public, a job title that includes the term “engineer” or “surveyor” implies to the public that the individual holding that job title is qualified to perform engineering or surveying work without supervision and therefore requires licensure by the Board.

 

[Darksteel165]

I'm not from California. Anyway, looks job title and professional services to the public is different things. So, we are both right. Legally without certification, I cannot offer software engineering services to the public. But my internal job title is fine as long as the company isn't "selling" me as one without certification. The issue is with being minimalized because I engineer software.

On a side note, I never liked the title anyway. With over 40 years of software development experience, I have had almost every title.

Even with what he posted to you states "no person shall practice civil, electrical, or mechanical engineering" As a software engineer you do none of those fields, so your title is still valid to the public. The restrictions on engineering have to do with physically building things. Like making a building, road, etc.

 

[Eighty]

Even with what he posted to you states "no person shall practice civil, electrical, or mechanical engineering" As a software engineer you do none of those fields, so your title is still valid to the public. The restrictions on engineering have to do with physically building things. Like making a building, road, etc.

You can’t practice any of those without being licensed. But, it goes on to say that unless you are licensed then you can’t use the term either.

I didn’t want to start a huge thing - just making the point that it’s a legally protected term. I once sat in on a board meeting where they penalized someone for using the term without being licensed.

 

[Darksteel165]

You can’t practice any of those without being licensed. But, it goes on to say that unless you are licensed then you can’t use the term either.

I didn’t want to start a huge thing - just making the point that it’s a legally protected term. I once sat in on a board meeting where they penalized someone for using the term without being licensed.

It's only legally protected if you are commiting fraud. I can call myself a doctor too as long as I don't incite or claim I have any medical qualifications. If I walked into a office and whipped out some building blueprints then yes I cant call myself engineer but everywhere else (not those fields listed above) we can, and the entire world does.