Rebel 4x4 Help!

[milks669]

Hey guys, I'm a new Rebel owner. 2021 Rebel, Crew cab. I live in Toronto, Canada and last week it was a little slick one morning and getting off the highway I wanted to give it, so I turned on the 4x4 and drove off. I ended up in a drive thru not to long after that and I was still in 4x4 and the truck did not want to turn on a sharp extremely low speed. Like just creeping kinda thing. Anyway I turned off the 4x4 and I went on no problem. Today is a crazy snow storm and I wanted to use the 4x4 and e locker, but I don't want to ruin my new truck. Will it work in snow? I don't want to break it. The manual just says don't use it on dry pavement. So I understand, please correct me if I'm wrong. When I press the 4x4 button that's locking my front tires with the rear tires and all 4 wheels are driven at the same time. Are my front tires at this point spinning at the same speed? My past trucks I could turn no issue with 4x4, but this Rebel is definitely different than what I'm used to. Then if I hit the elocker, that's locking the rear wheels to spin at the same time. Correct? Any incite would be appreciated. I tried looking on the forum but didn't really find any info on this subject. Thanks.

 

[Nukegm426]

without the locker being active the tires will
Slip side to side, but it’s still noticeable driving in 4x4 on pavement. With the locker active then the wheels will match rotation side to side with no slipping. You can use a locker on pavement as long as your going slow it’ll be fine. With the locker off you can use the 4x4 in snow just fine.

 

[Ram Man 727]

Congrats on your truck. I'm in Barrie.
The 4x4 does not like tight turns..4 wheels trying to drive the truck forward so it makes the tight/sharp turns difficult. The locker locks both rear wheels to spin together. Will assist going through deep snow or rough terrain. I dont think you will see a benefit in light snow. It is supposed to automaticaly disengage if speed is more than 25-30 kmh. I'm still learning mine as well since its only 4 months old.

 

[milks669]

Congrats on your truck. I'm in Barrie.
The 4x4 does not like tight turns..4 wheels trying to drive the truck forward so it makes the tight/sharp turns difficult. The locker locks both rear wheels to spin together. Will assist going through deep snow or rough terrain. I dont think you will see a benefit in light snow. It is supposed to automaticaly disengage if speed is more than 25-30 kmh. I'm still learning mine as well since its only 4 months old.

I appreciate your reply. Thanks for that. I'm in Etobicoke. Not too far from you. I'm getting used to the 4x4, as it's different than what I'm used to. So I understand the e locker now. You explained it perfectly. So in 4x4 are the front wheels locked the same way? Spinning them at the same speeds? It seemed like they were when I was in the drive thru that day because the truck didn't want to move when I was turning slowly.

 

[Ram Man 727]

I do believe they are spinning at the same speed as the rear. I haven't had any issues turning at driving speed while in 4x4 high. I think its just when you are at very low speed and trying to make a sharp/tight turn, the truck will want to pull itself forward, making the turn a little difficult. On a smaller scale, its the exact same with my ATV.. when in 4x4 mode, tight turns at slow speed is a bugger.

 

[Sterno90]

I appreciate your reply. Thanks for that. I'm in Etobicoke. Not too far from you. I'm getting used to the 4x4, as it's different than what I'm used to. So I understand the e locker now. You explained it perfectly. So in 4x4 are the front wheels locked the same way? Spinning them at the same speeds? It seemed like they were when I was in the drive thru that day because the truck didn't want to move when I was turning slowly.

The Rebels as far as I know do not have lockers for the front drive train. If traction control is on the front tires will work just as the back. If the truck senses slippage of any of the front wheels it will pull power from that wheel and give it to he wheel that has traction. With the e locker on, it locks up the back wheels to spin at the same rate together, even if one wheel is slipping the computer will not pull power from the wheel that is slipping. Like everyone else has said slow tight turns when 4x4 is on is a pain the tires will want to try to bump and it feels jerky.
if you don't need it for the area you are in when trying to do the turn then turn of 4x4 while doing tight maneuvers and turn it back on if you need to once you are done with the tight maneuvers.
if you truck has the 4WD Auto you can turn that on too, and your truck will automatically engage and disengage the front drive train as needed to best help you maintain control of the vehicle.
Hope this information helps you and congratulations on your new truck I can not wait to get mine.

 

[milks669]

The Rebels as far as I know do not have lockers for the front drive train. If traction control is on the front tires will work just as the back. If the truck senses slippage of any of the front wheels it will pull power from that wheel and give it to he wheel that has traction. With the e locker on, it locks up the back wheels to spin at the same rate together, even if one wheel is slipping the computer will not pull power from the wheel that is slipping. Like everyone else has said slow tight turns when 4x4 is on is a pain the tires will want to try to bump and it feels jerky.
if you don't need it for the area you are in when trying to do the turn then turn of 4x4 while doing tight maneuvers and turn it back on if you need to once you are done with the tight maneuvers.
if you truck has the 4WD Auto you can turn that on too, and your truck will automatically engage and disengage the front drive train as needed to best help you maintain control of the vehicle.
Hope this information helps you and congratulations on your new truck I can not wait to g

The Rebels as far as I know do not have lockers for the front drive train. If traction control is on the front tires will work just as the back. If the truck senses slippage of any of the front wheels it will pull power from that wheel and give it to he wheel that has traction. With the e locker on, it locks up the back wheels to spin at the same rate together, even if one wheel is slipping the computer will not pull power from the wheel that is slipping. Like everyone else has said slow tight turns when 4x4 is on is a pain the tires will want to try to bump and it feels jerky.
if you don't need it for the area you are in when trying to do the turn then turn of 4x4 while doing tight maneuvers and turn it back on if you need to once you are done with the tight maneuvers.
if you truck has the 4WD Auto you can turn that on too, and your truck will automatically engage and disengage the front drive train as needed to best help you maintain control of the vehicle.
Hope this information helps you and congratulations on your new truck I can not wait to get mine.

I hear what you're saying about the traction control. I'll try and turn it off next time I'm in it and then make a tight slow turn. With your theory the truck should go no problem with 4x4 and traction off on a slow turn. But for some reason I don't think that's the case. I think the Rebels are a whole different animal. I believe Ram is using a different transfer case in the Rebels. The Rebels don't have 4x4 Auto which is why I'm having a hard time turning slowly in 4x4. This is my first Rebel but third Ram, and my other two would do a 4x4 slow turn no problem because they were equipped with a limited slip differential, which is the 4x4 auto. I believe when 4x4 is selected in a Rebel that the two front tires lock the same way as the e locker locks the rear. I'm looking for someone who can confirm this. As I'm going on what I think. Which isn't right. Does anyone know?

 

[RebelWithACause]

What you are experiencing is called binding. When a vehicle turns the outside wheel is taking a longer trip than the inside wheel, and thus will turn faster. If you have engaged 4x4hi this means both front wheels are turning at the same speed, and both the rear wheels are turning at the same speed. So by turning sharply the inside wheel wants to slip, to match the speed of the outside wheel. If the ground is slick this is ok, if it's dry pavement you will experience binding, or the inside wheel spinning fast, and trying to break traction.

This will damage your truck. Ensure the wheels can slip before tossing on 4hi and turning. In a straight line this is not an issue. Wide turns also should not be an issue.

 

[Sterno90]

I don't think the issues is fully traction control. I was using that as an example of the vehicle operates. Also, the rebels do have 4WD auto as an option, But it is just that an option your exact truck may not have it but they do have the ability to have it. As far as know the Rebels front transfer case is not an auto locker transfer case. I could be mistaken.
Bottom line when you are in a situation where you need to make a tight turn on dry hard ground take it out of 4Hi and have it in 2WD then once hard turning is complete put it back into 4Hi if the situation still calls for it and you should be fine.

 

[devildodge]

In a 4wd auto truck. You are in 2wd until slippage is detected, then using clutches the truck sends power to the slipping wheel. This is why you can turn tight with it...because it is just in 2wd.

The Rebel transfer case does not use clutches. This is why you get the binding.

Traction control does not cause this. Traction control would do nothing until the tires begin to slip in slippery conditions.

The Rebel has a rear eLocker which locks the rear axle only. There is no locker in the front. This is just the transfer case sending power to the front differential and then to both front wheels.

Your truck is working as designed.

You will not break your truck doing this "accidentally" but you should not do it regularly.

You will be fine to use your Rebel in the snow. That is what it is for.

Just remember if you decide to use 4wd low...you need to be in neutral to make the shift. But you would want to only use this in off road situations anyways.

The RAM trucks have a system called BLDS and this allows traction control to act like you have lockers front and rear. I have a thread here that explains this in detail. But again...this would come into play in low traction situations...not in a parking lot or drive thru.

 

[milks669]

What you are experiencing is called binding. When a vehicle turns the outside wheel is taking a longer trip than the inside wheel, and thus will turn faster. If you have engaged 4x4hi this means both front wheels are turning at the same speed, and both the rear wheels are turning at the same speed. So by turning sharply the inside wheel wants to slip, to match the speed of the outside wheel. If the ground is slick this is ok, if it's dry pavement you will experience binding, or the inside wheel spinning fast, and trying to break traction.

This will damage your truck. Ensure the wheels can slip before tossing on 4hi and turning. In a straight line this is not an issue. Wide turns also should not be an issue.

I understand everything that you explained and I agree with everything you said, except the rear wheels locking to spin at the same speed. If that was the case, whats the point of the e locker??

 

[devildodge]

I understand everything that you explained and I agree with everything you said, except the rear wheels locking to spin at the same speed. If that was the case, whats the point of the e locker??

What he means is the front and rear wheels receive 50/50 power split.

A 4wd auto will vary the speed/POWER to each.

Like our jeep Cherokee. 40/60 in auto. 30/70 in sport. 50/50 in rock mud. 20/80 in sport...or something like that.

All wheels turn at the same speed. The wheels slip and one will go faster than the other. This is where the locker comes in (or anti spin) they lock the wheels together so they continue to spin at the same speed both getting power equally. Traction control attempts to do the same using the brakes.

 

[RebelWithACause]

What he means is the front and rear wheels receive 50/50 power split.

A 4wd auto will vary the speed/POWER to each.

Like our jeep Cherokee. 40/60 in auto. 30/70 in sport. 50/50 in rock mud. 20/80 in sport...or something like that.

All wheels turn at the same speed. The wheels slip and one will go faster than the other. This is where the locker comes in (or anti spin) they lock the wheels together so they continue to spin at the same speed both getting power equally. Traction control attempts to do the same using the brakes.

Thanks devildodge, precisely what I was saying.

 

[Chris3058]

Congrats on your truck. I'm in Barrie.
The 4x4 does not like tight turns..4 wheels trying to drive the truck forward so it makes the tight/sharp turns difficult. The locker locks both rear wheels to spin together. Will assist going through deep snow or rough terrain. I dont think you will see a benefit in light snow. It is supposed to automaticaly disengage if speed is more than 25-30 kmh. I'm still learning mine as well since its only 4 months old.

Ram Man - howdy from Barrie as well!

 

[milks669]

In a 4wd auto truck. You are in 2wd until slippage is detected, then using clutches the truck sends power to the slipping wheel. This is why you can turn tight with it...because it is just in 2wd.

The Rebel transfer case does not use clutches. This is why you get the binding.

Traction control does not cause this. Traction control would do nothing until the tires begin to slip in slippery conditions.

The Rebel has a rear eLocker which locks the rear axle only. There is no locker in the front. This is just the transfer case sending power to the front differential and then to both front wheels.

Your truck is working as designed.

You will not break your truck doing this "accidentally" but you should not do it regularly.

You will be fine to use your Rebel in the snow. That is what it is for.

Just remember if you decide to use 4wd low...you need to be in neutral to make the shift. But you would want to only use this in off road situations anyways.

The RAM trucks have a system called BLDS and this allows traction control to act like you have lockers front and rear. I have a thread here that explains this in detail. But again...this would come into play in low traction situations...not in a parking lot or drive thru.

Thanks for this explanation. I completely understand now. I'll also look for your thread on this. Thanks again.

 

[devildodge]

Thanks for this explanation. I completely understand now. I'll also look for your thread on this. Thanks again.

My thread is at HDRAMS. Here is one were @AnthonyD1978 has video about it.

No locker. No problem.

This is a long video. Feel free to skip around. Not having a spotter made this take way longer. I find it interesting that I did not get the "4x4 overheat message" this entire trip like I did on my last outing. Even though I was way harder on the 4wd this time. Maybe there is break in period...

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