RAM Revolutionary... yet Problematic. Why does our favorite brand keep subjecting us to this?

[ldoh]

I want to see them turn their reliability issue around like that, just like Hyundai and Kia did a while back.
Do you think they could do this?
Do they want to invest the time and money to make it happen?
Do you think that they are perfectly happy selling boatloads of "potentially" great vehicles fast and furious, and then worrying about fixes later?
What's your opinion?

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The FCA culture seems to be one of attracting customers with the best discounts, adding extra creature comforts while offseting increased costs with planned obsolescence and less production development time normally used to control quality/reliability. It's bad enough they do it but then FCA ignores and, or denies the existence of issues. It's difficult to imagine FCA changing the business plan when they are gaining market share let alone they probably can't afford to take the time to improve the business plan with better quality/reliability and customer support while maintaining vehicle discounts.

I'm still debating whether it makes sense to purchase an extended warranty given FCA's lack of follow through acknowledging and correcting issues.

 

[JD Jackalope]

Great Mopar stories to me, and I have to admit I took advantage of my warranties coming to me through my aftermarket warrenty! I will not purchase a vehicle without the extended warranty.


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[ldoh]

On the other hand, it may not be a good idea to wait to buy given PSA's record and footprint. I bet the proposed PGA/FCA merger is an overall negative. In one case I recall reading an article that PSA's goal is to funnel Ram profits for better designed euro vehicles.

 

[JD Jackalope]

Idoh, I'm getting short on words right now. Very tired, like been up all night. Idoh, I Do appreciate your thoughts!


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[Willwork4truck]

The FCA culture seems to be one of attracting customers with the best discounts, adding extra creature comforts while offseting increased costs with planned obsolescence and less production development time normally used to control quality/reliability. It's bad enough they do it but then FCA ignores and, or denies the existence of issues. It's difficult to imagine FCA changing the business plan when they are gaining market share let alone they probably can't afford to take the time to improve the business plan with better quality/reliability and customer support while maintaining vehicle discounts.

I'm still debating whether it makes sense to purchase an extended warranty given FCA's lack of follow through acknowledging and correcting issues.

Well that certainly would have applied to the FCA from 2008 up with their minivans... tech was there but quality was not. I have wanted a stow n go van since 2010 but every year up to 2014 there was some forum reported issue that kept me wary. Not that 100% had the problems but enough did. Not to bore you truck owners with the details, it just left a bad taste as far as trust.

I took what I felt was a risk with the RAM but only after first hand experience with the new F150 body style. After a couple years of forum issues with all kinds of things We sold it. Then we looked at the GM’s but the 2014-2017 years had their own problems, so we just sat on the sidelines.

When the 5th gen RAM came out, conventional wisdom said to wait cause it was a first year major redesign however it wasn’t a first year for the tranny and the non ET engine so that was easier to swallow.
Yes theres been software bugs (ask Windows about that) and the enormous hole in the roof pano doesn’t give me warm fuzzies but she really liked the interior and the ride so we plunked down the 56K and off we went.

Would I have rather waited for a 20? Probably since at least some TSB’s have likely been applied now in production. Would it be as chancy to buy a 2020 now compared to a 2019? Likely better to have waited.

I’d encourage fencesitters to pick up a 2020 towards the end of the model year and enjoy the truck. Ford is rumored to have a 2021 redesign but then you have the 1st year thing again. GM has already done their redesign so nothing there. Tundra is still a 2010 truck so it and Nissan don’t do anything for me.

 

[pgrant3491]

I agree. I have had some horrible dealer experiences with Ram in the past. Had a 2010 bighorn with trans issues.

I think my very unsatisfying dealership visits have helped shape my somewhat negative opinion about FCA as a whole.

 

[Bighorned]

I think my very unsatisfying dealership visits have helped shape my somewhat negative opinion about FCA as a whole.

I understand how that would sour your opinion. I found another dealer that is more customer svc friendly etc and that helps. The 545 rfe trans has some issues. the 1500 I had would shudder when down shifting into passing gear etc. They said they couldn't replicate etc etc. Traded it in for a 2500 Trx 4 same year and had the exact same issue. After that I was done. But they have come a long way from an engineering standpoint etc and a lot of trucks from the big 3 have issues and quirks so I am back in the Ram for another shot and I can honestly say that I am not disappointed. I do feel bad for the guys having the leak issue with the back window though.

 

[pgrant3491]

I understand how that would sour your opinion. I found another dealer that is more customer svc friendly etc and that helps. The 545 rfe trans has some issues. the 1500 I had would shudder when down shifting into passing gear etc. They said they couldn't replicate etc etc. Traded it in for a 2500 Trx 4 same year and had the exact same issue. After that I was done. But they have come a long way from an engineering standpoint etc and a lot of trucks from the big 3 have issues and quirks so I am back in the Ram for another shot and I can honestly say that I am not disappointed. I do feel bad for the guys having the leak issue with the back window though.

I think its great that you have given FCA multiple chances. I have dealt with the same "unable to replicate the issue you have described" instances. I will also be going to a different dealership the next time I need to.

 

[MFALRAM]

If anybody remember my rants it also comes with praise. I had a the steering sticking going around left hand corners. Had to g g ohh they with dealer and start a case to get it fixed. They replaced the steering rack no problems since. My drivers side fog light was a passenger fog light upside down. That was replaced. I know with a new platform comes problems it really doesn’t matter what manufacturer. It doesn’t bother me if there’s problems as long as it gets fixed under warranty. I love this truck inside and out. Had more disappointment with the dealer dragging there feet to fix things than anything. So would I buy this truck again knowing what I went through??.... Yup without hesitation. This is the best truck imo out there right now. So yes some disappointing things about the truck but probably a lot less then if I bought a Chevy or Ford. Btw the two trucks I narrowed it down to before buying was the Tundra and the Ram. I picked the Ram.

 

[JustMe]

Yes they do however the OP and I are wondering why there cant be a commitment to quality and responsiveness as opposed to building just whats good enough.

I've been suggesting these very same thoughts, which I agree with the OP on, for a few weeks now but haven't gotten "any" feedback . . . hmmm . . . my shi* must "really stink"? SO, I'm gonna sit this one out (on the toilet) and let you all voice your thoughts, with my own amusement ! . ps; what no man on toilet thinking emoji ?

 

[iamtheav8r]

Also 55 and this is my first Ram. If it doesn't work like they said it would I'll never buy another. I usually trade every 2-3 years. So far, it's doing OK, but I hold my breath every time I drive it. Not a great new truck experience.

 

[DesertRebel]

We were hesitant at first to buy a Chrysler product,having never owned an American vehicle, but in 2012 we pulled the trigger on a Challenger R/T 6MT in Header Orange. Great car. My wife's daily driver/commuter for years. Put over 100,000 miles on it with just one fairly minor problem that was fixed under warranty. That purchase gave us the confidence to buy two Rams, both 2014 - one Express and one a Big Horn. So now we had three hemis. All of them we drove for at least 100,000 miles. Of these three, we still own the Big Horn today with 165,000 miles on it.

Now, even though we liked these vehicles, we aren't blind to Chrysler's quality reputation, so we bought extended warranty - we figure it into the price when we go shopping for a vehicle.
Of the 4 hemi's we have owned so far, only one gave us problems - the Big Horn we still own today needed the lifters and cam replaced, a $5,000 job that fortunately was paid for by the extended warranty.

To us, the totality of the experience - design, pride of ownership, quality, styling - still puts Ram at the top of our shopping list. The engine repair was a bummer, but didn't keep us from buying a 2020 Limited.

.

At the risk of going off-topic - what was the symptom that lead to cam/lifters replacement? Did you have a thread about it? I hate to take this thread sideways - but I'm interested in the details.

Thanks

 

[JD Jackalope]

The Lifters and especially their roller bearings on the top side of them failing caused 5.7 liter Hemis to fail.

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[JD Jackalope]

Look at the needle bearings they used on the Lifters on the Hemi..
Failure, and destroying it can.
Unacceptable!

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[JD Jackalope]

Are the Lifters in the 6.4 Hemi any different? Considering that engine and it's rougher ride now in a 2500. The 2500 is almost as sweet on the inside And with the right 20 inch wheels, looks great!
Who knows...

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[SpeedyV]

Like any company they must contend with the critical decision of speed to market or conservative release of innovation. The term bleeding edge did not come from the auto industry but certainly applies here. These trucks are made up from so many complicated subsystems that it makes diagnosis and repair extremely difficult. Many of the solutions today are software fixes that on the surface seem to be easy to apply but can have many other ramifications (no pun intended) if they implement these changes without testing what happens to the other connected systems. I am not trying to justify poor service or failures to address defects. I am just saying that it takes a smarter and more dedicated company and service technical people to make these beautiful machines operate to their potential. All of the auto industry have these dilemma's but its how the public perception is of there willingness to listen to the user community and the responses they give about addressing these issues that will determine loyalty. I have been lucky enough so far to have a dealership near me that values good techs and pays them appropriately so they stay. I wish that all dealers had this same attitude about the value of people in the delivery of service and happy customers. Sorry for the ramble but its something i have thought about quite a bit.

Agreed, and the one thing I’d add is that many of these rather complicated subsystems are outsourced to third-party suppliers. It is hard enough to get everything working when it’s all designed and built in-house. I can only imagine the additional challenges introduced when multiple manufacturers are involved.

 

[JD Jackalope]

Please OP here. .
Let's get back to if FCA can possibly get to a point where they care about quality control, fixing what is wrong and really caring.
Can they change their course, or will it take Much time?

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[JD Jackalope]

Will 2022 models do it for me? If I'm here on late 2021, and still hear you guys bitching about this and that, then I probably will keep driving my Durango. The thing has been real good with some watrenties.

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[SpeedyV]

Will 2022 models do it for me? If I'm here on late 2021, and still hear you guys bitching about this and that, then I probably will keep driving my Durango. The thing has been real good with some watrenties.

I guess I’ve been lucky. I’ve had a few minor warranty issues, but I’m okay with that on an early fully-loaded custom order (built 7/18).

 

[Reverse]

At the risk of going off-topic - what was the symptom that lead to cam/lifters replacement? Did you have a thread about it? I hate to take this thread sideways - but I'm interested in the details.

Thanks

The symptom I took the Ram to the dealer for is a loud tick from the engine when idling. Most Hemi's have the Hemi tick (all of mine did) and it is harmless, but this tick was louder than that. If you leave the tick long enough, you'll eventually start getting error codes for the cylinder that's affected by the damaged cam lobe, but I brought it in before that happened.

Supposedly, cam lifters in 2015+ model years no longer have this problem. We haven't had a problem since they were replaced - 35,000 miles ago now.