Pain in the butt safety stuff

[Scap]

Nonsense. I addressed exactly what you said. There was no strawman and I believe you don't understand what the word even means. I understand it's difficult for you to support your goofy position.

Speaking of goofy positions.....
You're the one that flew the "think of the chillrun" flag early on in this thread.

 

[DEG]

Speaking of goofy positions.....
You're the one that flew the "think of the chillrun" flag early on in this thread.

Speaking of fallacy arguments. Perhaps you can specifically quote something I said that was not specifically on topic and accurate.

 

[firecadet613]

Speaking of fallacy arguments. Perhaps you can specifically quote something I said that was not specifically on topic and accurate.

The more driver assistance features there are, the average drivers skill decreases.

If a pilot always uses auto land, what happens to his skills?

 

[Willwork4truck]

There is no doubt those "annoying" safety features prevent accidents and save lives. For 20 years I commuted 100 miles round trip through St Louis rush hour traffic to and from work. During that time, I was rear ended 3 times when rush hour traffic came to a sudden halt but the vehicle behind me did not. Two of my vehicles were totaled as a result. I sure wish those driving behind me had those "annoying" safety features.

Before bitching about annoying safety features think about having your kids in the backseat and having to stop on the highway because the car ahead of you is waiting for a clearance to make a left turn only to see a pickup rapidly closing in your rearview mirror knowing they are not paying attention.

My point isn't about other drivers and what they do. It's about sonar etc that can't distinguish between a couple blades of grass and the back of a semi trailer.

 

[Pikeman_66]

I would think they would make it so when you select 4x4 it would shut that stuff off automatically.

 

[HSKR R/T]

I would think they would make it so when you select 4x4 it would shut that stuff off automatically.

If you go into 4-low it does

 

[dajogejr]

The more driver assistance features there are, the average drivers skill decreases.

If a pilot always uses auto land, what happens to his skills?

Fire..this is a great debate/discussion topic.
Tech, any kind, is always poo poo’d to start.
Think ABS, think back up camera.
Does tech give us more than can fail? Sure.
Does it typcially and “most” of the time get better with age? Yep.

I think this is a bit of a generational thing. I’m 47, grew up with manual everything including tilt in, vent front windows.
I’ve learned to use my mirrors, watch my surroundings.
Most younger drivers now never drove without backup camera, blind spot warnings, ABS.. to name a few.

I don’t know if the skill can decrease if it was never there is what I’m saying.

I don’t like the brakes slamming on when it comes to overgrown grass in a spot I’m backing into.
but…if someone pulling up behind me is distracted (and we all look in our rear view mirror…) and nanny tech stops them from plowing into me, or worse yet, a pedestrian, I’ll take that as a win.

You’re not wrong, but it’s something that just not a universal answer one way or another.

 

[Willwork4truck]

True, its not a universal answer nor criticism, just is a pain to me on occasion. Glad that it is shut off in 4L.
As far as skill degradation, like you said, most younger drivers haven't even developed the skills to begin with. Imagine the typical Gen X/Z trying to back up and hitch up a trailer without all of the cameras and aids. Or just watch YT videos of boat ramp/launch fails...

 

[firecadet613]

Fire..this is a great debate/discussion topic.
Tech, any kind, is always poo poo’d to start.
Think ABS, think back up camera.
Does tech give us more than can fail? Sure.
Does it typcially and “most” of the time get better with age? Yep.

I think this is a bit of a generational thing. I’m 47, grew up with manual everything including tilt in, vent front windows.
I’ve learned to use my mirrors, watch my surroundings.
Most younger drivers now never drove without backup camera, blind spot warnings, ABS.. to name a few.

I don’t know if the skill can decrease if it was never there is what I’m saying.

I don’t like the brakes slamming on when it comes to overgrown grass in a spot I’m backing into.
but…if someone pulling up behind me is distracted (and we all look in our rear view mirror…) and nanny tech stops them from plowing into me, or worse yet, a pedestrian, I’ll take that as a win.

You’re not wrong, but it’s something that just not a universal answer one way or another.

Very true, I'm about 10 years younger than you so I drove without all the nanny stuff as well.

True, its not a universal answer nor criticism, just is a pain to me on occasion. Glad that it is shut off in 4L.
As far as skill degradation, like you said, most younger drivers haven't even developed the skills to begin with. Imagine the typical Gen X/Z trying to back up and hitch up a trailer without all of the cameras and aids. Or just watch YT videos of boat ramp/launch fails...

Good point, they can't lose what they never had...

 

[Willwork4truck]

Very true, I'm about 10 years younger than you so I drove without all the nanny stuff as well.


Good point, they can't lose what they never had...

Can't take credit for the "skills they never had" but anyway...
In a few years not many will be driving who started w/o all of the additional tech help.
Just like cell phone usage, its un-imaginable nowadays for the average American to be without their smartphone. Doesn't matter what age they are. Not stuffing that genie back in the bottle.

 

[HSKR R/T]

Fire..this is a great debate/discussion topic.
Tech, any kind, is always poo poo’d to start.
Think ABS, think back up camera.
Does tech give us more than can fail? Sure.
Does it typcially and “most” of the time get better with age? Yep.

I think this is a bit of a generational thing. I’m 47, grew up with manual everything including tilt in, vent front windows.
I’ve learned to use my mirrors, watch my surroundings.
Most younger drivers now never drove without backup camera, blind spot warnings, ABS.. to name a few.

I don’t know if the skill can decrease if it was never there is what I’m saying.

I don’t like the brakes slamming on when it comes to overgrown grass in a spot I’m backing into.
but…if someone pulling up behind me is distracted (and we all look in our rear view mirror…) and nanny tech stops them from plowing into me, or worse yet, a pedestrian, I’ll take that as a win.

You’re not wrong, but it’s something that just not a universal answer one way or another.

Don't think of it as the drivers "losing" skills, because obviously they can't lose what they never had, but not ever developing the skills is a loss for society. The number of people tht post here freaking out when their back up camera doesn't work shows that

 

[Mountain Whiskey]

True, its not a universal answer nor criticism, just is a pain to me on occasion. Glad that it is shut off in 4L.
As far as skill degradation, like you said, most younger drivers haven't even developed the skills to begin with. Imagine the typical Gen X/Z trying to back up and hitch up a trailer without all of the cameras and aids. Or just watch YT videos of boat ramp/launch fails...

Ha! The kids at work don't know how I back into my parking spot between the column and the wall using my mirrors. I don't use the camera for much. It does make it quick and easy to see how far away from the wall I am. I can tell by the brake light pattern when I am in my old Lincoln. That really blows thier minds.

All said though, it sure makes lining up the trailer hitch easy!

 

[HSKR R/T]

Ha! The kids at work don't know how I back into my parking spot between the column and the wall using my mirrors. I don't use the camera for much. It does make it quick and easy to see how far away from the wall I am. I can tell by the brake light pattern when I am in my old Lincoln. That really blows thier minds.

All said though, it sure makes lining up the trailer hitch easy!

I can back into a parking spot straighter using the mirrors than the back up camera

 

[DEG]

The more driver assistance features there are, the average drivers skill decreases.

I don't believe that is true for most assistant features on today's cars.

If a pilot always uses auto land, what happens to his skills?

I would agree if we were talking about auto driving cars but that's not what is being discussed.

 

[firecadet613]

I don't believe that is true for most assistant features on today's cars.



I would agree if we were talking about auto driving cars but that's not what is being discussed.

The reverse auto braking? The 360 cameras? Lane assist?

The forward alert and auto braking - you honestly believe that's not causing many folks to pay less attention and multi task more while they're driving?

 

[DEG]

The reverse auto braking? The 360 cameras? Lane assist?

The forward alert and auto braking - you honestly believe that's not causing many folks to pay less attention and multi task more while they're driving?

Yes I absolutely believe those things are not causing anyone to pay less attention while they are driving.

 

[Dewey]

 

[firecadet613]

Yes I absolutely believe those things are not causing anyone to pay less attention while they are driving.

Lane assist and adaptive cruise control certainly are. But you're entitled to your own opinion.

 

[Oldphart]

I can back into a parking spot straighter using the mirrors than the back up camera

Same here, but at 72 with major arthritis, it's difficult for me to do the "look over your shoulder" thing now. The side mirrors are not a problem and the camera gives me a direct behind view. The first vehicle that had this was a 2008 Infifnti. At the time, I thought it was a useless waste of money, but it was included with the navi package.

I guess as one gets older, the useless becomes more of a necessity.

 

[Mountain Whiskey]

The reverse auto braking? The 360 cameras? Lane assist?

The forward alert and auto braking - you honestly believe that's not causing many folks to pay less attention and multi task more while they're driving?

Yes, this and the two dreaded diseases of out time:
Phoneinhand disease and Headupass disease.