Hurricane Fuel Octane

[dcchris311]

Not that I want to use it but where do you find E20? Only E15 where I live and I stick with E10 or non ethanol at least for small yard engines.

You won't find it anywhere, you have to blend it yourself. It's quite cumbersome to do it daily haha but it's a nice jump in power. Here's a snapshot of a calculator for blends on a 33gal tank.

 

[HSKR R/T]

You won't find it anywhere, you have to blend it yourself. It's quite cumbersome to do it daily haha but it's a nice jump in power. Here's a snapshot of a calculator for blends on a 33gal tank.

I certainly wouldn't be playing around with mixing E85 into an engine that doesn't have a custom tune. And at that point, just tune for E85. Increasing octane on an engine that isn't tuned for it is pointless.

 

[HSKR R/T]

I'm not telling anyone to do it, just saying that this is a better option than a booster. You can safely run e20 with no issues as it's been done plenty of times. For small increases in power but mainly for knock resistance aka pre-detonation while running higher boost levels.

I'll be doing it just to experiment and datalog it.

"Safely" run it is subjective. increasing ethanol context would require different target A/F ratio. And if you are increasing boost, you should have a custom tune to prevent detonation. and, as already mentioned, at that point, just tune for E85 and not worry about mixing.

 

[dcchris311]

I certainly wouldn't be playing around with mixing E85 into an engine that doesn't have a custom tune. And at that point, just tune for E85. Increasing octane on an engine that isn't tuned for it is pointless.

Definitely don't tune for e85 unless your fuel system is setup for it and plan on doing oil a lot sooner than a regular schedule. E85 will dilute/degrade the oil much faster. Lower blends are easier on the o-rings and fuel system components. Also e85 will be hell to turn on cold days. It'd would take

"Safely" run it is subjective. increasing ethanol context would require different target A/F ratio. And if you are increasing boost, you should have a custom tune to prevent detonation. and, as already mentioned, at that point, just tune for E85 and not worry about mixing.

You're right, it is subjective. I only ever ran e30 and played with e50 occasionally but was terrified of it because of how corrosive ethanol is but dang is that power addictive. E30 also gave me the gains of ethanol, while still getting the fuel lubrication from the pump gas and my mileage didn't suffer, maybe I lost 40 miles less per tank.

If we're talking about these trucks, I wouldn't ever go past an e30 tune. E85 will degrade and destroy the entire fuel system if it isn't setup for it. E85 is corrosive and will eat away the o-rings/rubbers in all the components. Also, since it has a bit of water in it, it will also cause rust.

But everyone should do whatever they feel is safe and comfortable with their vehicles.

 

[HSKR R/T]

Definitely don't tune for e85 unless your fuel system is setup for it and plan on doing oil a lot sooner than a regular schedule. E85 will dilute/degrade the oil much faster. Lower blends are easier on the o-rings and fuel system components. Also e85 will be hell to turn on cold days. It'd would take

You're right, it is subjective. I only ever ran e30 and played with e50 occasionally but was terrified of it because of how corrosive ethanol is but dang is that power addictive. E30 also gave me the gains of ethanol, while still getting the fuel lubrication from the pump gas and my mileage didn't suffer, maybe I lost 40 miles less per tank.

If we're talking about these trucks, I wouldn't ever go past an e30 tune. E85 will degrade and destroy the entire fuel system if it isn't setup for it. E85 is corrosive and will eat away the o-rings/rubbers in all the components. Also, since it has a bit of water in it, it will also cause rust.

But everyone should do whatever they feel is safe and comfortable with their vehicles.

Anything built in the last 15 years can handle E85 in the fuel system without any issues. Yes you will need to go to bigger injectors, but that's all part of the "tuning" for E85. There is nothing to be scared about with it. There is more concerns for the power increase finding the weak link in your build, than the fuel being used.

As far as cold starts, that would all depend on the tune. If you have a competent tuner, it's a non-issue. There have been flex fuel vehicles running E85 year round since the 2000s. if you struggle to start on cold days, with an E85 tune, then your tune is crap.

 

[sblack33741]

Both. But I am sure that many will pretend they use the truck on the track daily so they run WOT at all times and require the extra expense of premium gas.

Does Ram's Hurricane engine need premium gas?​

"The high-output Hurricane performs better with premium gasoline,” Killian explains. “But if you use regular 87 octane fuel, it would only be slightly noticeable to the person really maxing out that engine.”

Doug Killian from Stellantis.

If you are running 87 on the HO, make sure it it Top Tier or you are regularly running detergents. This will mitigatesome of the carbonization from the direct fuel injection.

 

[DEG]

Based on what Stellantis engineer says for the HO, 91 preferable 89 acceptable. If I pulling trailer or going from 4500' to 12,000' I'll use 91.

Not sure why the engineer would contradict what they print in the owners manual or why the Ram manual would end up being different than the Wagoneer manual. The Wagoneer manual does not say 89 is acceptable in the HO; it requires 91. For the SO, 87 is acceptable, but 91 is recommended for higher performance under certain conditions.

Given my experience with the 4 Hemi Ram's I have owned, I tend to doubt claims the manual makes about getting better fuel economy with higher octane. I've spent many months running nothing but higher octane fuel in my Rams and never got any better economy than I did running 87 octane.

In my area there is a $0.51 difference between 87 and 91 octane so it would take a 2 mpg difference in fuel economy just to break even in fuel costs.

 

[BowDown]

So push the throttle an extra 32nd of an inch during normal driving and experience the same. Or flush an extra $30 bucks down the crapper each week. I am sure some like to do so.

Where are you buying gas that 87/89 to 93 is a $30 difference? 87 to 93 is is a $10 price difference at best here.

 

[6of36]

Where are you buying gas that 87/89 to 93 is a $30 difference? 87 to 93 is is a $10 price difference at best here.

$1 more a gallon, in Michigan. $.50 to midgrade, and another $.50 to premium.

 

[BowDown]

$1 more a gallon, in Michigan. $.50 to midgrade, and another $.50 to premium.

In North Texas, it's .50 difference from 87 to 93

 

[6of36]

In North Texas, it's .50 difference from 87 to 93

I think Costco is less, but they only have the two grades. Every normal station though, it's $1.00, and I drive all over Mi. I wish it was $.50.

 

[DEG]

In North Texas, it's .50 difference from 87 to 93

He didn't say $30 per tank; he said $30 per week so it depends on how far he drives in a week.

I spent 20 years driving 150 miles round trip to and from work and normally didn't stay home on the weekends. I was driving well over 50,000 miles per year and the extra .50 cents per gallon would have easily exceeded $30 per week.

 

[BowDown]

We all know, the original post stated that to, as well as any other manual, obviously. And many others know it wont make a difference but, we are on a forum where people dont like hearing "dont need to go OEM" or "dont need to follow what manual says with oil/gas" or like to be wrong/told otherwise. The point was it wont make a difference for us and my statements made that clear as well. (and made it clear it will likely be the same with the Hurricane as mountain whiskey said)


I just proved that the efficiency is exactly the same as ive tested it and SEEN it with many other the years. Only difference is the price and hole your burning in your pocket... again... as mountain whiskey said likely with the hurricane as well.


I proved that when i stated i towed as well. only times these specs are critacal is... again.... when using max power which we know... again.... is a very very small portion of the community.

I've done a similar tests driving both locally and long drives from Dallas to Houston. I've consistently gotten better mileage in the same conditions using 93 vs 87.

I average 420-430 miles per tank in the city and 510-520 on the highway using 93. Using 87, I can go 390-400 miles in the city and 490ish miles on the highway.

Your testing has shown no difference; mine has shown about 1-1.5mpg improvement using 93 over 87. Probably need more than examples 2 though

 

[BowDown]

I think Costco is less, but they only have the two grades. Every normal station though, it's $1.00, and I drive all over Mi. I wish it was $.50.

Costco is where I buy fuel

 

[BowDown]

He didn't say $30 per tank; he said $30 per week so it depends on how far he drives in a week.

I spent 20 years driving 150 miles round trip to and from work and normally didn't stay home on the weekends. I was driving well over 50,000 miles per year and the extra .50 cents per gallon would have easily exceeded $30 per week.

Yes, I assumed a week since that's all I do but you're right. I drive about 400 miles a week

 

[HSKR R/T]

Not sure why the engineer would contradict what they print in the owners manual or why the Ram manual would end up being different than the Wagoneer manual. The Wagoneer manual does not say 89 is acceptable in the HO; it requires 91. For the SO, 87 is acceptable, but 91 is recommended for higher performance under certain conditions.

Given my experience with the 4 Hemi Ram's I have owned, I tend to doubt claims the manual makes about getting better fuel economy with higher octane. I've spent many months running nothing but higher octane fuel in my Rams and never got any better economy than I did running 87 octane.

In my area there is a $0.51 difference between 87 and 91 octane so it would take a 2 mpg difference in fuel economy just to break even in fuel costs.

View attachment 182137

There is no point running higher than 89 octane in your Hemi unless you have logged significant knock retard on 89, or you have a tune for higher octane.

I run 91 due to having the Pulsar and keeping it on performance mode. Edge recommends 91 when using the Pulsar tunes.

 

[Dewey]

$1 more a gallon, in Michigan. $.50 to midgrade, and another $.50 to premium.

Same here in WI

Edit:Just checked Gas Buddy and Premium is currently $1.10 more. I only use that in my boat and other small engines because it’s ethanol free.

 

[HSKR R/T]

Same here in WI

Edit:Just checked Gas Buddy and Premium is currently $1.10 more. I only use that in my boat and other small engines because it’s ethanol free.

Depending on which station you sez there is anywhere from 50 cent to $1 difference between 87 and 91 here in Nebraska. And ethanol free 91 is the same price as E10

 

[Mountain Whiskey]

Where are you buying gas that 87/89 to 93 is a $30 difference? 87 to 93 is is a $10 price difference at best here.

ExxonMobil, Sonoco, BP, pretty much anywhere here in the Northern VA area. A dollar a gallon from perfectly fine 87 to overpriced 93. I have a 33 gallon tank, I don't know if the Hurricane truck will offer this.

In North Texas, it's .50 difference from 87 to 93

Well, YeeeHa little doggie! We ain't all in oil country son! Some of us non-cowpoke fellas have to pay to have that distilled oil piped up to us!

He didn't say $30 per tank; he said $30 per week so it depends on how far he drives in a week.

I spent 20 years driving 150 miles round trip to and from work and normally didn't stay home on the weekends. I was driving well over 50,000 miles per year and the extra .50 cents per gallon would have easily exceeded $30 per week.

Per tank, per week... I do more than a 33 gallon tank a week if I drive my truck all week. Just giving it an average. Full fill up is around 30 gallons so at that $1 difference from 87 to 93, $30.

I see the difference as my car takes 93. It is higher compression and custom tuned for 93 though. It had VVT but with an upgrade cam i had to lock that out.

 

[Mountain Whiskey]

Based on what Stellantis engineer says for the HO, 91 preferable 89 acceptable. If I pulling trailer or going from 4500' to 12,000' I'll use 91.

Sure if all you do is max out your trucks capabilities at all times, you should probably use higher octane gas. Most people drive these light duty trucks like a passenger car picking up groceries and kids at the soccer field. Most will never notice the difference between 87 and 93 idling in front of the school waiting on Jr, or hitting the hair salon for a mani-pedi with the wife.

Not sure why the engineer would contradict what they print in the owners manual or why the Ram manual would end up being different than the Wagoneer manual. The Wagoneer manual does not say 89 is acceptable in the HO; it requires 91. For the SO, 87 is acceptable, but 91 is recommended for higher performance under certain conditions.

Given my experience with the 4 Hemi Ram's I have owned, I tend to doubt claims the manual makes about getting better fuel economy with higher octane. I've spent many months running nothing but higher octane fuel in my Rams and never got any better economy than I did running 87 octane.

In my area there is a $0.51 difference between 87 and 91 octane so it would take a 2 mpg difference in fuel economy just to break even in fuel costs.

View attachment 182137

Common sense on his part.