Help a newb please

[LordWesquire]

Hey all,

Bought a Ram 1500 Limited Longhorn this week. It has the 5.7L w/ eTorque and the towing package. Using the vin lookup website, it says my towing capacity is right under 8,000lbs and the payload is 1500lbs. My wife and I want to look at camper trailers. What should I consider as my maximum dry weight limit? Why would the gearing make such a big difference between this an the same truck with 3.92 gears being rated for 11k+? Same components other than gears, right? Any recommendations on campers under $40k?

 

[Eighty]

You posted this in the towing forum, so you're obviously in the right place. I suggest you read some of the threads in here first. This one will probably be the most beneficial for you.

So you want to tow a camper!

The first thing you need to do is decide which camp you fall in. The best camp to be in is to own neither the truck or the camper. This allows you to research and keep feelings out of your decision. This allows you to easily sit back and learn the process. The next camp is owning the truck or...

5thgenrams.com

 

[llando88]

I've got 50K plus miles towing a few travel trailers ranging from 6,000 to 8,000# across the USA and Canada several times with a '16 Ram 2500 Cummins, and then my current '21 Ram 1500 V8. I just wanted to let you know where I am coming from:

It would probably be a good idea to go look at the driver side door weight sticker and take a picture, so you know the ACTUAL payload for YOUR truck. For reference, my '21 Ram 1500 sticker looks like this:



As you can see, the payload for my truck is 1,738 pounds. What does the sticker on the door of your truck say?

I felt very comfortable towing my last travel trailer, a 23 footer, with a dry weight of 5,297, and a cargo carrying capacity of 1,003 pounds, 296 of which was water.

Without knowing some more specifics about what your planned uses are for the trailer, what type of RVing you plan to do, it's pretty tough to say what would be the limit for a 1500. Something in the region of 23-25 max 27', or 6,000 to 7,000 lbs, with a tongue weight max around 10% of the trailer would probably be appropriate.

Of course cargo on board (you, partner, family, dog, grille, tools, W/D hitch, scuba diving weight collection etc. ) will have a bearing on what you can safely tow.

Again, this is only for reference, but here are the weights I used for my estimates with my last trailer:

2 x passengers - 360#
1 x Equalizer Hitch Head and 2 x bars - 86#
2 x 2,500w gennies, propane tank, tools - 100#

This is a total of 546 pounds, which comes off my payload of 1,738, leaving me 1,192 for the tongue weight of my trailer. The TW of my 23 footer was 604# at a rated GVWR of 6,300#, so I was around 50% of my remaining capacity for towing, even if I ran with full tank of water (which I never did).

Glad to help if you have some specific questions, but this should get you started in the right direction.

Rich

 

[LordWesquire]

I've got 50K plus miles towing a few travel trailers ranging from 6,000 to 8,000# across the USA and Canada several times with a '16 Ram 2500 Cummins, and then my current '21 Ram 1500 V8. I just wanted to let you know where I am coming from:

It would probably be a good idea to go look at the driver side door weight sticker and take a picture, so you know the ACTUAL payload for YOUR truck. For reference, my '21 Ram 1500 sticker looks like this:

View attachment 168826

As you can see, the payload for my truck is 1,738 pounds. What does the sticker on the door of your truck say?

I felt very comfortable towing my last travel trailer, a 23 footer, with a dry weight of 5,297, and a cargo carrying capacity of 1,003 pounds, 296 of which was water.

Without knowing some more specifics about what your planned uses are for the trailer, what type of RVing you plan to do, it's pretty tough to say what would be the limit for a 1500. Something in the region of 23-25 max 27', or 6,000 to 7,000 lbs, with a tongue weight max around 10% of the trailer would probably be appropriate.

Of course cargo on board (you, partner, family, dog, grille, tools, W/D hitch, scuba diving weight collection etc. ) will have a bearing on what you can safely tow.

Again, this is only for reference, but here are the weights I used for my estimates with my last trailer:

2 x passengers - 360#
1 x Equalizer Hitch Head and 2 x bars - 86#
2 x 2,500w gennies, propane tank, tools - 100#

This is a total of 546 pounds, which comes off my payload of 1,738, leaving me 1,192 for the tongue weight of my trailer. The TW of my 23 footer was 604# at a rated GVWR of 6,300#, so I was around 50% of my remaining capacity for towing, even if I ran with full tank of water (which I never did).

Glad to help if you have some specific questions, but this should get you started in the right direction.

Rich

My sticker says 1465lbs. Wife and I plus the kids and hitch and other equipment loading into the truck would be ~650lbs. How would I find the tongue weight of a trailer? I've been setting a limit of 6.5k for the weight thinking I was leaving plenty of cushion but maybe that's closer to the limit? Would getting stiffer springs in the rear/airbags/etc buy me some more weight capacity?

 

[bigdodge]

My sticker says 1465lbs. Wife and I plus the kids and hitch and other equipment loading into the truck would be ~650lbs. How would I find the tongue weight of a trailer? I've been setting a limit of 6.5k for the weight thinking I was leaving plenty of cushion but maybe that's closer to the limit? Would getting stiffer springs in the rear/airbags/etc buy me some more weight capacity?

there is a sticker on the trailer somewhere

also weigh your truck to be sure

 

[Trooper4]

My sticker says 1465lbs. Wife and I plus the kids and hitch and other equipment loading into the truck would be ~650lbs. How would I find the tongue weight of a trailer? I've been setting a limit of 6.5k for the weight thinking I was leaving plenty of cushion but maybe that's closer to the limit? Would getting stiffer springs in the rear/airbags/etc buy me some more weight capacity?

Tongue weight will most likely be 10/15%, but the weight dist hitch will change that some. Set for travel, then run is across the scale to finalize the setup. Lots of good advice in here on what and how to. Read and glean what you need.

 

[llando88]

My sticker says 1465lbs. Wife and I plus the kids and hitch and other equipment loading into the truck would be ~650lbs. How would I find the tongue weight of a trailer? I've been setting a limit of 6.5k for the weight thinking I was leaving plenty of cushion but maybe that's closer to the limit? Would getting stiffer springs in the rear/airbags/etc buy me some more weight capacity?

Load Stickers on trailers I've owned include actual GVWR and CCC, but not tongue weight. So you have to go find out by finding the specifications of a trailer from the RV Manufacturers. Using (say) a Forest River T2160 as an example, this is a 25' trailer with a hitch (tongue) weight of 585 pounds:

Evo Southwest T2160 - Forest River RV

Details, floorplan, specifications, and more about the T2160 EVO Travel Trailers.

forestriverinc.com

At 7,585 GVWR, I would feel more comfortable towing this longer distances with a W/D hitch with a 1500, but not on the ball. Popular hitch brands you see mentioned frequently are Blue Ox and Equal-i-zer. I have personal experience with Equal-i-zer; it works well.

Continuing the example, adding the 86# of the hitch to the TW listed (585#), you are now at 671# payload. Your cargo on board you said was 650#. So load on the truck adds up to 1,321#; within your truck's max payload of 1,465#.

(By the way, one other wild card is water. At around 8# per gallon, a full tank of 50 gallons in this rig would be 400#. Opinions vary about running with full tanks vs. empty; full can make the rig feel more "settled" but you do have to haul it, so mpg is reduced if you top up all the way. I could tell full vs empty going down road. Having "some" water on board is valuable, but I didn't run mine 100% most of the time, because our style was at parks where we plugged in, mostly. We didn't boondock a lot.)

There are a couple other figures worth checking (e.g. GCWR, GAWR) before making a final decision. And ideally you want to run the rig over a set of CAT scales to verify the load is properly distributed (or ballpark it with the Front Axle Load Restoration method the Ram manual provides).

As regards changing springs or adding air bags, I'm not qualified to common on that, and would defer to someone with experience in adjusting the truck with aftermarket parts.

But like I said, this should put you in the region what you can expect to tow with your truck, as it is now.

 

[Ramroo]

Tongue weight will most likely be 10/15%, but the weight dist hitch will change that some. Set for travel, then run is across the scale to finalize the setup. Lots of good advice in here on what and how to. Read and glean what you need.

Weight distribution hitch should not change tongue weight, just distribute the tongue weights
per truck axle.

 

[Ramroo]

I've got 50K plus miles towing a few travel trailers ranging from 6,000 to 8,000# across the USA and Canada several times with a '16 Ram 2500 Cummins, and then my current '21 Ram 1500 V8. I just wanted to let you know where I am coming from:

It would probably be a good idea to go look at the driver side door weight sticker and take a picture, so you know the ACTUAL payload for YOUR truck. For reference, my '21 Ram 1500 sticker looks like this:

View attachment 168826

As you can see, the payload for my truck is 1,738 pounds. What does the sticker on the door of your truck say?

I felt very comfortable towing my last travel trailer, a 23 footer, with a dry weight of 5,297, and a cargo carrying capacity of 1,003 pounds, 296 of which was water.

Without knowing some more specifics about what your planned uses are for the trailer, what type of RVing you plan to do, it's pretty tough to say what would be the limit for a 1500. Something in the region of 23-25 max 27', or 6,000 to 7,000 lbs, with a tongue weight max around 10% of the trailer would probably be appropriate.

Of course cargo on board (you, partner, family, dog, grille, tools, W/D hitch, scuba diving weight collection etc. ) will have a bearing on what you can safely tow.

Again, this is only for reference, but here are the weights I used for my estimates with my last trailer:

2 x passengers - 360#
1 x Equalizer Hitch Head and 2 x bars - 86#
2 x 2,500w gennies, propane tank, tools - 100#

This is a total of 546 pounds, which comes off my payload of 1,738, leaving me 1,192 for the tongue weight of my trailer. The TW of my 23 footer was 604# at a rated GVWR of 6,300#, so I was around 50% of my remaining capacity for towing, even if I ran with full tank of water (which I never did).

Glad to help if you have some specific questions, but this should get you started in the right direction.

Rich

I prob would not say MAX tongue weight of 10%, more like minimum of 10% for planning.
10% - 15% is what is recommended mostly.

 

[Trooper4]

Weight distribution hitch should not change tongue weight, just distribute the tongue weights
per truck axle.

Tongue Weight Vs Distributed Tongue Weight: All You Need To Know

Distributed tongue weight is the value that you control to more evenly distribute your trailer’s weight. DTW will typically be 2-3x more.

www.weigh-safe.com

With the weight distribution hitch, you are now seeing 70-80% of the original tongue weight on the back axle of the vehicle while that initial 20-30% (that was lifted off the front and added to the vehicle’s back axles) is now applied to the trailer axles.

 

[Ramroo]

Tongue Weight Vs Distributed Tongue Weight: All You Need To Know

Distributed tongue weight is the value that you control to more evenly distribute your trailer’s weight. DTW will typically be 2-3x more.

www.weigh-safe.com

View attachment 168888
With the weight distribution hitch, you are now seeing 70-80% of the original tongue weight on the back axle of the vehicle while that initial 20-30% (that was lifted off the front and added to the vehicle’s back axles) is now applied to the trailer axles.

Well, look a there. Didn’t know that.
Good to know.

 

[Trooper4]

Well, look a there. Didn’t know that.
Good to know.

It's all about leverage.

 

[kdoublep]

It's all about leverage.

...And ball bearings

 

[Ramroo]

It's all about leverage.

Yea when I first starting using a EDH towing heavy equipment with HDs I had convinced myself that the hitch didn’t help much with payload / GVWR limits. I only weighed several times, but I transfered more weight to the front axle ( as opposed to your diagram / bringing back to original weight). That, and the additional weight of hitch I thought it was a wash. I wasn’t counting pounds too much like y’all pulling TTs with 1/2 tons.
Definitely use one.

 

[Bt10]

As to your original questions:

Most people pack at least a 1000lbs if they have kids for a week trip, so back up the dry weight at least that much. Also, camping "gear", i.e. tools, hoses, cords, equipment, grills, propane, etc, add up quickly; back off another 300lbs . Most people do not haul water in the tank, or only fill close to the camp spot. Under $40k and 6500lbs, the best is going to be the Grand Design Transcend line.

Yes, gears change the torque thru the transmission, so 3.21 gears are like you trying to start out from a stop in 10th gear on a bicycle, it slips the torque converter and heats the fluid.

As others have said, you need the weight distributing hitch. Limited Longhorn should have lower profile tires than lower trims, but unfortunately they are probably "C" range. If you tow often, or the sway scares you too bad, move to a higher load range tire. Some people like a Hellwig swaybar, or Sumospring type bumpstop, or airbag helper, or max dollars could be spent on Core4x4 suspension to stop the sway.

 

[Trooper4]

Yea when I first starting using a EDH towing heavy equipment with HDs I had convinced myself that the hitch didn’t help much with payload / GVWR limits. I only weighed several times, but I transfered more weight to the front axle ( as opposed to your diagram / bringing back to original weight). That, and the additional weight of hitch I thought it was a wash. I wasn’t counting pounds too much like y’all pulling TTs with 1/2 tons.
Definitely use one.

Leverage of the bars removes weight from the rear axle, and redistributes it to the trailer and front axle. Don't know why they don't show it that way, but the important thing is that it reduces the rear axle load.

 

[Ramroo]

Leverage of the bars removes weight from the rear axle, and redistributes it to the trailer and front axle. Don't know why they don't show it that way, but the important thing is that it reduces the rear axle load.
View attachment 169022

Yea I get that.
My point was that I distributed more to front axle (than diagram) than to trailer. Thus not helping as much with GVWR.

I saw that is an option of moving a much higher percentage of tongue weight to trailer to help with payload /GVWR limits, but was not my issue with the HD. Got axle limits also.

My whole point of even mentioning it was my recommendation for OP to not count on WDH to help with payload limits IMO. Like you or someone else said, you always have more weight in truck than you count on.

 

[Trooper4]

Yea I get that.
My point was that I distributed more to front axle (than diagram) than to trailer. Thus not helping as much with GVWR.

I saw that is an option of moving a much higher percentage of tongue weight to trailer to help with payload /GVWR limits, but was not my issue with the HD. Got axle limits also.

My whole point of even mentioning it was my recommendation for OP to not count on WDH to help with payload limits IMO. Like you or someone else said, you always have more weight in truck than you count on.

Yes, GVWR will never change. It is what it is. But as long as a needed tongue weight is maintained for stability, a certain amount of weight can be positioned when loading the trailer, along with WDH to maintain adequate tongue weight. If that can't be achieved, then a 3500 or a smaller trailer.

 

[IvoryHemi]

Limited Longhorn should have lower profile tires than lower trims, but unfortunately they are probably "C" range. If you tow often, or the sway scares you too bad, move to a higher load range tire.

20” are still standard on Limited/Longhorn but the optional 22’s actually have a higher load rating (XL) than the 20’s (SL)