What could cause this damage to the cam???

[HSKR R/T]

That is genuinely infuriating. I love these trucks, but the company making them is absolute garbage. I can't support a company that churns out bad parts and then abandons their customers.

All vehicles have problems, but some manufacturers stand behind their product more than others. That alone is why I'm leaving Ram.

You won't find anything different between all of the big 3 here in the US. Ram, Ford, Chevy all have their issues. Join any one of the multiple Facebook groups or forums for their trucks and you will hear the same complaints. The grass isn't always greener. And for every one issue like OPs, there are literally tens of thousands of trucks with no issues.

 

[SD Rebel]

I agree RAM is no different than other manufacturers when it comes to this, they are relatively rare, I mean look at Toyota right now with their Tundra engine recall.

That being said, it's the customer service that is RAMs and Stellantis issue. How they handle it is where they maybe running a bit shorter than the rest.

 

[BowDown]

How often do you see high mileage hemis (say, 175k + miles) with 0 issues?

My 03 went 277K with the only failures being a broken valve spring and a failed water pump

 

[BowDown]

Here is one from today, lifter on these lobes are fine no damage. Cam is degrading/flaking/failing. This is from a 2016 DS 5.7.

Looks like the cam hardening failed

 

[BowDown]

I don't know if it makes a difference as I know Comp and Lunati have been having lots of material failures/wiped cams. I know it has always been an issue or risk but it seems to have skyrocketed since the pandemic.

My opinion is that this is a 3 fold problem.
1st, They are using an likley iron camshaft instead a steel or billet steel cam.
2nd, which is likley the bigger issue is that the cams used in the LS/LT and HEMI and have relativley large lobe lifts combined and high ratio rocker arms of 1.6-1.65. Normal is 1.5.
3rd, The above configurations require valve springs with high seat pressures to control the lifter, roker and the valve. Both the HEMI and the LS/LT engines have very compact heads with even more compact valve spring seat meaning the valve spring has a small OD which makes its job even more difficult and requires additional seat pressure.

Excessive/High seat pressures will eat cam lobes if not well managed

BBC: 1.53/1.54" spring
LS: 1.050/1.290" spring
Gen 3 HEMI: 1.035/1.210" spring
MOPAR V8 340-360: 1.49"

 

[ChadAllen]

My opinion is that this is a 3 fold problem.
1st, They are using an likley iron camshaft instead a steel or billet steel cam.
2nd, which is likley the bigger issue is that the cams used in the LS/LT and HEMI and have relativley large lobe lifts combined and high ratio rocker arms of 1.6-1.65. Normal is 1.5.
3rd, The above configurations require valve springs with high seat pressures to control the lifter, roker and the valve. Both the HEMI and the LS/LT engines have very compact heads with even more compact valve spring seat meaning the valve spring has a small OD which makes its job even more difficult and requires additional seat pressure.

Excessive/High seat pressures will eat cam lobes if not well managed

BBC: 1.53/1.54" spring
LS: 1.050/1.290" spring
Gen 3 HEMI: 1.035/1.210" spring
MOPAR V8 340-360: 1.49"

That is some great info Thank you that.

 

[ChadAllen]

I agree RAM is no different than other manufacturers when it comes to this, they are relatively rare, I mean look at Toyota right now with their Tundra engine recall.

That being said, it's the customer service that is RAMs and Stellantis issue. How they handle it is where they maybe running a bit shorter than the rest.

Exactly! I'm not leaving ram because my cam shredded. I'm leaving because thousands of people have had the exact same problem through no fault of their own. I'm leaving because of the way Ram/stellantis treats customers after the sale.

If this had been just me, or a rare failure, I'd just bite bullet. Sh*t happens. But this problem is so common it's got its own name. If you get to the point where your engine is known as much for the "tick" as it is for anything else, then recalls, design changes or a change in part suppliers is pretty much a no brainer. Ram, however, just blames their customers for the tick.

I'm glad you mentioned Toyota. Yes, they have a serious issue with their new V6.....but like you said: recall. They are addressing the problem. Exactly what Ram should have done with these cams.

 

[SD Rebel]

Exactly! I'm not leaving ram because my cam shredded. I'm leaving because thousands of people have had the exact same problem through no fault of their own. I'm leaving because of the way Ram/stellantis treats customers after the sale.

If this had been just me, or a rare failure, I'd just bite bullet. Sh*t happens. But this problem is so common it's got its own name. If you get to the point where your engine is known as much for the "tick" as it is for anything else, then recalls, design changes or a change in part suppliers is pretty much a no brainer. Ram, however, just blames their customers for the tick.

I'm glad you mentioned Toyota. Yes, they have a serious issue with their new V6.....but like you said: recall. They are addressing the problem. Exactly what Ram should have done with these cams.

I don't disagree. RAM sucks with customer service after sale, at least with my experience. Basic things like returning phone calls, I've never experienced such a lack of basic service in my 30 years of owning vehicles.

 

[ChadAllen]

I don't disagree. RAM sucks with customer service after sale, at least with my experience. Basic things like returning phone calls, I've never experienced such a lack of basic service in my 30 years of owning vehicles.

Amen to that. I ordered an exhaust manifold, bolts and gasket from Mopar. Paid for overnight, but they shipped standard so I got them a week late, then they refused to refund that shipping. Open the box and everything is literally tossed in with no packing material, so the gasket was shredded. They made me pay for shipping to send it back.

When a service manager at a dealer threatened me with physical violence and hit me in the face with my keys, I called Ram. They point blank told me "you must have instigated it."

Worst. Business. Ever. Dunno why I'd expect them to make a decent damn vehicle.

 

[HSKR R/T]

Exactly! I'm not leaving ram because my cam shredded. I'm leaving because thousands of people have had the exact same problem through no fault of their own. I'm leaving because of the way Ram/stellantis treats customers after the sale.

If this had been just me, or a rare failure, I'd just bite bullet. Sh*t happens. But this problem is so common it's got its own name. If you get to the point where your engine is known as much for the "tick" as it is for anything else, then recalls, design changes or a change in part suppliers is pretty much a no brainer. Ram, however, just blames their customers for the tick.

I'm glad you mentioned Toyota. Yes, they have a serious issue with their new V6.....but like you said: recall. They are addressing the problem. Exactly what Ram should have done with these cams.

The Hemi "tick" isn't the lifter or cam failure. It's a completely different thing that has nothing to do with engine life. Every Hemi has it the Hemi tick, but not every Hemi has cam/lifter issues. I've never heard of anyone having an issue with repairs while under warranty. Once you are outside of warranty, it's ridiculous to think RAM should cover it. Also, Chevy has more lifter issues than RAM. Ford has its own problems with cam synchronizers. Pick your poison. None of the manufacturer are going to fix a vehicle for free outside of warranty

 

[SD Rebel]

Amen to that. I ordered an exhaust manifold, bolts and gasket from Mopar. Paid for overnight, but they shipped standard so I got them a week late, then they refused to refund that shipping. Open the box and everything is literally tossed in with no packing material, so the gasket was shredded. They made me pay for shipping to send it back.

When a service manager at a dealer threatened me with physical violence and hit me in the face with my keys, I called Ram. They point blank told me "you must have instigated it."

Worst. Business. Ever. Dunno why I'd expect them to make a decent damn vehicle.

Wow, I thought I had issues at the dealer, that is some BS right there.

 

[HSKR R/T]

Amen to that. I ordered an exhaust manifold, bolts and gasket from Mopar. Paid for overnight, but they shipped standard so I got them a week late, then they refused to refund that shipping. Open the box and everything is literally tossed in with no packing material, so the gasket was shredded. They made me pay for shipping to send it back.

When a service manager at a dealer threatened me with physical violence and hit me in the face with my keys, I called Ram. They point blank told me "you must have instigated it."

Worst. Business. Ever. Dunno why I'd expect them to make a decent damn vehicle.

Ordering through a Mopar website is ordering though a dealer, not Mopar. ****ty dealers aren't Stellantis corporate. I've had mostly good experiences with dealers. Find a bad one, then just don't go back to them. Find a good one, and stick with them. And once again, you will finding similar issues across the board with all manufacturers.

 

[Cbty2050]

I ordered an exhaust manifold, bolts and gasket from Mopar.

No you didn't, you bought them from a dealer with an online store.

Worst. Business. Ever. Dunno why I'd expect them to make a decent damn vehicle.

What business is the worst? You seem like a smart person and realize the dealer and Ram are not the same business.

 

[Cbty2050]

Ordering through a Mopar website is ordering though a dealer, not Mopar. ****ty dealers aren't Stellantis corporate. I've had mostly good experiences with dealers. Find a bad one, then just don't go back to them. Find a good one, and stick with them. And once again, you will finding similar issues across the board with all manufacturers.

The sooner everyone figures this out the happier they will be.

It's like going to work for a company and realizing they actually suck, if you stay you are also the problem. Move on and be happy.

 

[Mountain Whiskey]

When a service manager at a dealer threatened me with physical violence and hit me in the face with my keys, ......

Wow, I'm glad that was not me. I mean I would kind of miss you guys. I don't know if I would be allowed internet to surf this sight while awaiting trial for manslaughter.

 

[BowDown]

Exactly! I'm not leaving ram because my cam shredded. I'm leaving because thousands of people have had the exact same problem through no fault of their own. I'm leaving because of the way Ram/stellantis treats customers after the sale.

If this had been just me, or a rare failure, I'd just bite bullet. Sh*t happens. But this problem is so common it's got its own name. If you get to the point where your engine is known as much for the "tick" as it is for anything else, then recalls, design changes or a change in part suppliers is pretty much a no brainer. Ram, however, just blames their customers for the tick.

I'm glad you mentioned Toyota. Yes, they have a serious issue with their new V6.....but like you said: recall. They are addressing the problem. Exactly what Ram should have done with these cams.

I'm leaving because of the way Ram/stellantis treats customers after the sale.

I can understand your sentiment here

If this had been just me, or a rare failure, I'd just bite bullet. Sh*t happens. But this problem is so common it's got its own name. If you get to the point where your engine is known as much for the "tick" as it is for anything else, then recalls, design changes or a change in part suppliers is pretty much a no brainer. Ram, however, just blames their customers for the tick.

This I disagree with, I don't believe that this is common nor is it limited to Ram/Stellantis, Mahle is likely the cam vendor and they are the vendor for many other manufacturers. Some cams hardening process fails and customers come to automotive forums to seek help or complain whiles the millions of others that never have an issue say nothing. Every make has random issues, GM is having the very same problem. A friend just got a new bottom end in his Acura because of an factory assembly issue. My Audi Q5 had a recall for the engine due to a connecting rod issue.

The difference is that the Ram issue isn't wide spread or even frequent, if they were having the failures that Audi/VW or Honda/Acura, I suspect they would be recalling hemi vehicles

https://gmauthority.com/blog/2022/01/chevy-silverado-and-gmc-sierra-have-major-engine-problems-says-consumer-reports/

https://www.cnbc.com/2022/10/06/gm-hit-with-102point6-million-jury-verdict-in-engine-flaw-class-action.html

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These, to me, are more serious/consistent issues. When we start seeing consistent mass failures in the HEMIs then I'd concede it to be an issue.
The hemi tick is usually an exhaust leak and has been widely misreported by people on youtube seeking clicks. I'm also not a believer in the idling killing these engines, police cars sit and idle for hours at a time

 

[Mountain Whiskey]

It is an amazing thing. If you stay off of internet forums you will find that cases of vehicle failures are rare.

 

[spyder]

If you looked at the photo of the cam, you should know that the oil is obviously going to show cam material in it. Oil analysis likely not worth doing on this one because it's just going to show full of metal.

If oil analysis had been done when the tick first started, it would have told good information about it and a lot of time chasing exhaust leaks, etc. could have been avoided though.

 

[spyder]

My 2014 Ram ate the cam, but we've had lots of others in fleet service that have gone well over 100k without a problem. Stuff happens, mechanical stuff breaks. It's not THAT big of a deal to replace cam and lifters. It sucks and isn't cheap, but it's cheaper than when my Cummins got cylinder damage. ...at almost 400k.

 

[silver billet]

It is an amazing thing. If you stay off of internet forums you will find that cases of vehicle failures are rare.

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