35 tire help please

[marshallk9]

I want to add 35s to my newly purchased (not yet received) rebel '23. I was thinking 2" front only spacers and 35x12.5 but am a little confused. Is that enough? Saw on YouTube that I may need to remove plastic mud flap and bend a little of the front of the well (very minor).
I'd love some recommendations on exact brands and setups if possible.
Also, if anyone knows the total height of the actual car afterwards, that would be super helpful as I have a somewhat limited garage height. (Why I'm thinking only 2" spacers and 35s vs lifts). Would be amenable to lift options or others if it's better.
Thanks for any help

 

[theblet]

Your rebel should already have a 1” list from the factory, so I’d think 2 inch level, UCAs, and spacers would do the trick. Check out this thread.

2019+ Rams with Lifts/Levels, and/or aftermarket wheel tire setups

(see attachment) Saw this on Instagram, 2019 Laramie with a 2 inch leveling kit, Fuel Lethal wheels and 35 inch Toyo Open Country M/T's

5thgenrams.com

 

[HSKR R/T]

If you stick with a 35x11.5 tire it should be fine. Go with a 12.5 ND it may rub. Mine rub just a little, but not enough to bother me

 

[User_84945]

I have 35x12.5 on my 19 Rebel. Running 2” Bora spacers up front and 1.75” in back. Had just a little rub on the wheel well plastic at full lock. Trimmed that off and it’s been fine.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[boogielander]

If you are only doing it for looks and not for offroad function then at the very least do bilstein 5100 leveling kit in the front. Will also get you 2" (from non-rebels. With rebels you'll only get 1 additional inch compared to your current height because rebels suspension are 1 inch lift already). Your expensive truck deserves to be modded properly.
DO NOT do spacer lift. that is just mickey mouse way of doing things; you're messing with the suspension geometry, adding more stress to your suspension, and rides like crap. Also it is a disaster waiting to happen.
DO get UCA.
I never let my customers install spacer; if they want spacers installed I show them the door because I don't want to be blamed when disaster happens. I always tell them do things the right way first time, so they don't have to pay me again to fix the disasters result from doing things the cheap way the first time.

Spacer and no UCA is like when San Andreas fault become active again. Some guy in the Facebook group went the mickey mouse way and had his ball joint popped, and he was blaming RAM for it.


Regarding tires:
if you're sticking with factory wheels you may also rub on UCA with 12.5 width tires in addition to rubbing your fender liner and mud flap.




This is mine on Fox 2.5 DSC front and rear. Front I left it at Fox factory setting (I believe it's 2" over non-rebels) because I want to have droop. If I crank it higher I lose droop travel.
Wheels and Tires: Method 305NV, 18x9, -12mm offset. Falken Wildpeak AT3W 35x12.5R18
Currently top of wheelwell to ground is about 39.5in all around.

Read my thread here for details on lift/ level: Fox 2.5 DSC Suspension - A Brief Overview, Procedure, and Review of Proper Suspension Setup
Read my thread here for details on wheel, tire, and trimming: 35x12.5R18 on Performance Orientated Lift - a Overview, Procedure, and Review.

 

[JerryBsizzle]

I want to add 35s to my newly purchased (not yet received) rebel '23. I was thinking 2" front only spacers and 35x12.5 but am a little confused. Is that enough? Saw on YouTube that I may need to remove plastic mud flap and bend a little of the front of the well (very minor).
I'd love some recommendations on exact brands and setups if possible.
Also, if anyone knows the total height of the actual car afterwards, that would be super helpful as I have a somewhat limited garage height. (Why I'm thinking only 2" spacers and 35s vs lifts). Would be amenable to lift options or others if it's better.
Thanks for any help

I can't exactly help you, but I had a 2019 Laramie with the off road group so it had the same 1" factory raised ride height. I put 2" spacers and new control arms and had 35x11.50r20s (285/65r20). I put 1.25" Bora wheel spacers on also.

I wouldn't do it again. It rode like dog crap. It's like the 3" overall over stock is just too much. What I would do is what has already been mentioned, Bilsteins or Eibach or something similar. My brother has the Rough Country loaded struts and they are fantastic, silky smooth ride.

I have a 6" lift on top of the Off road group with 35x12.50s on negative offset wheels and still had to do some trimming, just beware.

 

[WXman]

If you are only doing it for looks and not for offroad function then at the very least do bilstein 5100 leveling kit in the front. Will also get you 2" (from non-rebels. With rebels you'll only get 1 additional inch compared to your current height because rebels suspension are 1 inch lift already). Your expensive truck deserves to be modded properly.
DO NOT do spacer lift. that is just mickey mouse way of doing things; you're messing with the suspension geometry, adding more stress to your suspension, and rides like crap. Also it is a disaster waiting to happen.
DO get UCA.
I never let my customers install spacer; if they want spacers installed I show them the door because I don't want to be blamed when disaster happens. I always tell them do things the right way first time, so they don't have to pay me again to fix the disasters result from doing things the cheap way the first time.

Spacer and no UCA is like when San Andreas fault become active again. Some guy in the Facebook group went the mickey mouse way and had his ball joint popped, and he was blaming RAM for it.


Regarding tires:
if you're sticking with factory wheels you may also rub on UCA with 12.5 width tires in addition to rubbing your fender liner and mud flap.



View attachment 161829
This is mine on Fox 2.5 DSC front and rear. Front I left it at Fox factory setting (I believe it's 2" over non-rebels) because I want to have droop. If I crank it higher I lose droop travel.
Wheels and Tires: Method 305NV, 18x9, -12mm offset. Falken Wildpeak AT3W 35x12.5R18
Currently top of wheelwell to ground is about 39.5in all around.

Read my thread here for details on lift/ level: Fox 2.5 DSC Suspension - A Brief Overview, Procedure, and Review of Proper Suspension Setup
Read my thread here for details on wheel, tire, and trimming: 35x12.5R18 on Performance Orientated Lift - a Overview, Procedure, and Review.

As someone who has done leveling kits both ways, I 100% disagree with this advice. The Bilstein 5100s ride like s*** and it's pretty hard to guess how much actual lift you're going to get. Plus they are much harder to install so most guys end up paying to get them installed. Conversely, a spacer lift is inexpensive, easy to install, and you know exactly how much lift you get. You also keep factory ride quality. I use my trucks on and off road, tow with them, commute in them, the whole nine yards and I have NEVER one time had an issue of any kind with spacers. Ever. There's even a popular YouTube channel called Lite Brite where they became famous by beating their Jeep on the hardest trails in America using a spacer lift.

 

[Idahoktm]

As someone who has done leveling kits both ways, I 100% disagree with this advice. The Bilstein 5100s ride like s*** and it's pretty hard to guess how much actual lift you're going to get. Plus they are much harder to install so most guys end up paying to get them installed. Conversely, a spacer lift is inexpensive, easy to install, and you know exactly how much lift you get. You also keep factory ride quality. I use my trucks on and off road, tow with them, commute in them, the whole nine yards and I have NEVER one time had an issue of any kind with spacers. Ever. There's even a popular YouTube channel called Lite Brite where they became famous by beating their Jeep on the hardest trails in America using a spacer lift.

I have no experience with the Bilstein's but agree with you about spacers. I have a Readylift 2" kit with UCA's and the ride is awesome. A little stiffer than stock, but in a good way. I don't do serious off-roading but it's great on beat up dirt roads.

 

[theblet]

As someone who has done leveling kits both ways, I 100% disagree with this advice. The Bilstein 5100s ride like s*** and it's pretty hard to guess how much actual lift you're going to get. Plus they are much harder to install so most guys end up paying to get them installed. Conversely, a spacer lift is inexpensive, easy to install, and you know exactly how much lift you get. You also keep factory ride quality. I use my trucks on and off road, tow with them, commute in them, the whole nine yards and I have NEVER one time had an issue of any kind with spacers. Ever. There's even a popular YouTube channel called Lite Brite where they became famous by beating their Jeep on the hardest trails in America using a spacer lift.

Yup. Mine are great. If you use preload spacers, that will affect the ride, but top hats do not. I dont have UCAs, but he prob will due to having ORP.

 

[HSKR R/T]

As someone who has done leveling kits both ways, I 100% disagree with this advice. The Bilstein 5100s ride like s*** and it's pretty hard to guess how much actual lift you're going to get. Plus they are much harder to install so most guys end up paying to get them installed. Conversely, a spacer lift is inexpensive, easy to install, and you know exactly how much lift you get. You also keep factory ride quality. I use my trucks on and off road, tow with them, commute in them, the whole nine yards and I have NEVER one time had an issue of any kind with spacers. Ever. There's even a popular YouTube channel called Lite Brite where they became famous by beating their Jeep on the hardest trails in America using a spacer lift.

My Bilstiens, even on clip 6, ride just as good as factory. If your ride went to **** after installing them, then there was probably something done wrong during install

 

[WXman]

My Bilstiens, even on clip 6, ride just as good as factory. If your ride went to **** after installing them, then there was probably something done wrong during install

Or, maybe they ride like s*** because it's an objective fact that Bilstein designs their shocks to be more firm and the stroke is different. Yeah, yeah that's probably more like it.

I've done everything from full blown lift kits to Bilstein levels to spacer kits on probably 20 or 30 rigs from Jeeps to 4Runners to midsize trucks to fullsize trucks. Toyota, Nissan, Ford, GM, Ram, Jeep. The results are always the same....because Bilsteins are designed the way they are designed.

If you want a simple, inexpensive solution that rides like stock and works perfectly go with spacers. If you want a stiffer ride that's more expensive, harder to install, and does the exact same thing spacers do, go with Bilsteins.

 

[CalvinC]

Spacers alone are not optimal for actual off road use because of down travel, especially with a stock UCA.

In my experience they do largely preserve stock ride on smooth surfaces, but trouble comes with big suspension cycles like a speedbump or pothole. In those cases the lowered static position of the coilover reduces available down travel, and the down travel event often over cycles the stock coilover and if a stock UCA is used it might even bang on the coil. An aftermarket UCA can restore some of the lost down travel and more clearance for the spring.

Plus, folks usually add big tires at the same time, which a) highlights inadequacies in the stock suspension rebound control due to the heavier tire and b) are often E-rated requiring higher PSI and riding rougher.

These 2 things result in the "rides like crap" experiences folks have with spacers. And why they are really just for looks, especially without other supporting mods.

Spacers can be ok if you have matching UCAs and/or differential drops and/or UCAs to "play along" with the spacer moving the coilover's static position downward. But even in those scenarios the problem is that if your stock suspension sucks... it still does with a spacer.

 

[Vulpes]

Lots of option out there. For my Rebel, I went with the Carli Performance System with HD rear Springs. other stats in signature. Link here: Carli Performance System

After lift from grade to top of shark fin is about 6'11".

Measured from center hub to bottom on fender lip, about two inches of lift over stock height, with 3/4 of a tank of gas in the 26 gallon tank:

	Before Lift	After Lift (500 miles)
Front Driver	22"	24-1/4"
Front Passenger	22-1/8"	24-1/4"
Rear Driver	23-3/4"	26-1/8"
Rear Passenger	24-1/8"	26-3/4"

Had to remove the lower front mud flaps and make brackets to pull the front inner fender well in with a heat gun and bolts.


Driver side front photo. Not a lot of room between rear of front fender and rear of 35" tire, but it has never hit.


One problem though, the King strut lower spring mounts hit the front axles. Spoke with CJC and Carli, and I ended up removing material from the lower spring mount to correct this.

 

[boogielander]

As someone who has done leveling kits both ways, I 100% disagree with this advice. The Bilstein 5100s ride like s*** and it's pretty hard to guess how much actual lift you're going to get. Plus they are much harder to install so most guys end up paying to get them installed. Conversely, a spacer lift is inexpensive, easy to install, and you know exactly how much lift you get. You also keep factory ride quality. I use my trucks on and off road, tow with them, commute in them, the whole nine yards and I have NEVER one time had an issue of any kind with spacers. Ever. There's even a popular YouTube channel called Lite Brite where they became famous by beating their Jeep on the hardest trails in America using a spacer lift.

1. i offered an opinion as a tech and outfitter, not as someone who only has experience as an end user. Working the job gives me opportunities to witness countless end results of "I can't afford to buy quality, well designed products, so even though it's mickey mouse it will look good and i'm ok with that," "works just as good for fraction of cost," "my friend never had issues with it," "i don't need to spend that much," "i saw it on youtube, must be ok." and those are all NOT pretty. I'm not here to make money or sale anything. My presence here is to educate the fellow Ram owners on PROPER WAY of doing things, and the last thing I want is fellow members repeat the mistakes that other people did.
2. no matter how anyone spins it, spacer lift is mickey mouse. period. the only way to change that argument is to get a proper suspension lift.
3. if you have to guess how much actual lift you're going to get... you should pay a professional to do it.
4. if you think spacer lift offers quality ride... oh boy you have no idea what quality ride is.
5. if you never had an issue, good on you for being lucky. But still not the proper way of doing things and there are countless examples of why not to do it.
6. And what happens after that video by Lite Brite? They went back to proper suspension kits. They did it for clicks, not because they actually believe in it.

Anyways, I said what I said. I'm not here to sell anything and I gain nothing from posting here. Whether OP and others chooses to do things properly or mickey mouse it is up to them.


But what do I know... I'm just a tech and outfitter specialized in offroad rigs and my professional opinion should be 100% disagreed.

 

[Lpsouth1978]

1. i offered an opinion as a tech and outfitter, not as someone who only has experience as an end user. Working the job gives me opportunities to witness countless end results of "I can't afford to buy quality, well designed products, so even though it's mickey mouse it will look good and i'm ok with that," "works just as good for fraction of cost," "my friend never had issues with it," "i don't need to spend that much," "i saw it on youtube, must be ok." and those are all NOT pretty. I'm not here to make money or sale anything. My presence here is to educate the fellow Ram owners on PROPER WAY of doing things, and the last thing I want is fellow members repeat the mistakes that other people did.
2. no matter how anyone spins it, spacer lift is mickey mouse. period. the only way to change that argument is to get a proper suspension lift.
3. if you have to guess how much actual lift you're going to get... you should pay a professional to do it.
4. if you think spacer lift offers quality ride... oh boy you have no idea what quality ride is.
5. if you never had an issue, good on you for being lucky. But still not the proper way of doing things and there are countless examples of why not to do it.
6. And what happens after that video by Lite Brite? They went back to proper suspension kits. They did it for clicks, not because they actually believe in it.

Anyways, I said what I said. I'm not here to sell anything and I gain nothing from posting here. Whether OP and others chooses to do things properly or mickey mouse it is up to them.


But what do I know... I'm just a tech and outfitter specialized in offroad rigs and my professional opinion should be 100% disagreed.

Ok, we have seen you say that a spacer is "Micky Mouse" but you have not said one thing about what the ACTUAL issue is with them. What problems they cause, what damage will occur, why they are a bad way to go, etc. Making all encompassing statements with no supporting info does NO ONE any favors. If you want to educate people, then actually educate them, don't just make statements with nothing to support them. I truly welcome you to provide evidence as to why spacers are so bad, I am genuinely curious. Keep in mind that failures WILL happen with any product, including "proper" lifts.

That being said. I do have spacers on my 2021 Laramie and have been VERY happy with them. The truck still has a very nice ride, not quite stock, but I am also running 35" E rated tires, so I don't expect stock. I also replaced the UCA's to correct the geometry and have had ZERO issues with this combo. I take my truck to a very trusted shop for oil changes every 5000 miles and I always have them do a full inspection of the truck to ensure everything is still in top condition. No issues yet!

I will say that using something like Bilsteins, or a "proper" lift is likely a better way to go, it is not the ONLY way to go. Thousands (likely hundreds of thousands) of vehicles use spacers with NO issues. For those of us who don't do any heavy off roading but would like a small lift and/or larger tires, spacers are a perfectly viable option.

 

[Gotsboost]

If you are only doing it for looks and not for offroad function then at the very least do bilstein 5100 leveling kit in the front. Will also get you 2" (from non-rebels. With rebels you'll only get 1 additional inch compared to your current height because rebels suspension are 1 inch lift already). Your expensive truck deserves to be modded properly.
DO NOT do spacer lift. that is just mickey mouse way of doing things; you're messing with the suspension geometry, adding more stress to your suspension, and rides like crap. Also it is a disaster waiting to happen.
DO get UCA.
I never let my customers install spacer; if they want spacers installed I show them the door because I don't want to be blamed when disaster happens. I always tell them do things the right way first time, so they don't have to pay me again to fix the disasters result from doing things the cheap way the first time.

Spacer and no UCA is like when San Andreas fault become active again. Some guy in the Facebook group went the mickey mouse way and had his ball joint popped, and he was blaming RAM for it.


Regarding tires:
if you're sticking with factory wheels you may also rub on UCA with 12.5 width tires in addition to rubbing your fender liner and mud flap.



View attachment 161829
This is mine on Fox 2.5 DSC front and rear. Front I left it at Fox factory setting (I believe it's 2" over non-rebels) because I want to have droop. If I crank it higher I lose droop travel.
Wheels and Tires: Method 305NV, 18x9, -12mm offset. Falken Wildpeak AT3W 35x12.5R18
Currently top of wheelwell to ground is about 39.5in all around.

Read my thread here for details on lift/ level: Fox 2.5 DSC Suspension - A Brief Overview, Procedure, and Review of Proper Suspension Setup
Read my thread here for details on wheel, tire, and trimming: 35x12.5R18 on Performance Orientated Lift - a Overview, Procedure, and Review.

You are one of the few that does it right. I don’t understand people getting a 60k truck and installing a $100 lift.

 

[CalvinC]

Ok, we have seen you say that a spacer is "Micky Mouse" but you have not said one thing about what the ACTUAL issue is with them. What problems they cause, what damage will occur, why they are a bad way to go, etc.

Spacers alone are not optimal for actual off road use because of down travel, especially with a stock UCA.

In my experience they do largely preserve stock ride on smooth surfaces, but trouble comes with big suspension cycles like a speedbump or pothole. In those cases the lowered static position of the coilover reduces available down travel, and the down travel event often over cycles the stock coilover and if a stock UCA is used it might even bang on the coil. An aftermarket UCA can restore some of the lost down travel and more clearance for the spring.

Plus, folks usually add big tires at the same time, which a) highlights inadequacies in the stock suspension rebound control due to the heavier tire and b) are often E-rated requiring higher PSI and riding rougher.

These 2 things result in the "rides like crap" experiences folks have with spacers. And why they are really just for looks, especially without other supporting mods.

Spacers can be ok if you have matching UCAs and/or differential drops and/or UCAs to "play along" with the spacer moving the coilover's static position downward. But even in those scenarios the problem is that if your stock suspension sucks... it still does with a spacer.

I'm not the same guy you referenced above, but in my prior post I did my best to explain why spacers COULD be not so great.

In your use case, you understood the mission and made the best of a spacer lift by:
a) Adding UCAs
b) Not expectning to do hard core off roading
c) Not lifting over 3" (guessing your Laramie is not ORG?)

I note 3) above because I think there is a definite line between "Spacers work fine for me" and "Spacers ruined my ride" correlating with whether they're added the spacer to a Rebel/ORG Ram, or standard suspension. If someone throws a 2" spacer on top of the Rebel/ORG suspension, especially without UCAs, the trouble is magnified big time.

Like anything else, there are use cases and expectations to manage.

 

[Idahoktm]

2. no matter how anyone spins it, spacer lift is mickey mouse. period. the only way to change that argument is to get a proper suspension lift.

4. if you think spacer lift offers quality ride... oh boy you have no idea what quality ride is.
5. if you never had an issue, good on you for being lucky. But still not the proper way of doing things and there are countless examples of why not to do it.

But what do I know... I'm just a tech and outfitter specialized in offroad rigs and my professional opinion should be 100% disagreed.

When you make absolute statements like this, you lose some credibility. You are letting your biases get in the way of an objective review.

 

[theblet]

Spacers are fine if you don't hard core off-road. Some people just want bigger tires for the looks, so why spend thousands if you dont need to. If you will be off-roading, get the right lift for it.

If you use top hat spacers, it doesn't affect ride quality. Only preload spacers do that.

If you have ORP, you need to change the UCAs to use spacers, or you will have an issue.

Different applications require different solutions. It's not one size fits all.

 

[JerryBsizzle]

I can see both sides of it. I will disagree with theblet here, I had top hat spacers AND new control arms (all in one kit, same manufacturer so they should be matched right?) and I had issues. Enough issues that instead of spending more money to fix it I just got rid of the truck and started over. I think it goes like this

Cheap, mostly for looks and usually to maintain ride? Leveling spacers, add control arms if needed. Some may have issues, but most don't.

Buy once, cry once but opens up a whole new ball game on off road ride and some on road ride? New coilovers or higher performing coils/shocks, no top hat spacer. Mechanical issues will be very rare, ride quality is subjective opinion (as evidenced from responses in this thread and others)

Some of you may like watching some of the extremely informative videos Filthy Motorsports has put out. Here is a link to one